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T@T-2-MoNk3y
11-14-2010, 06:51 AM
boring race... well done petrov for holding back alonso for so long.

don't feel vettel deserves to be champ...

OatmealMan
11-14-2010, 07:01 AM
Hey look, Vettel won

Firestorm998
11-14-2010, 07:14 AM
Well done Vettel. Youngest champ ever and nice to see some emotion from the guy.

surgeon
11-14-2010, 07:16 AM
who knew the most exciting f1 season for years would end up being the worst in all of its history. i hate every facet of the red bull team, except for mark webber, and vettel is the most over-rated, undeserving champion for a long time.

SayaSe
11-14-2010, 07:54 AM
and vettel is the most over-rated, undeserving champion for a long time.
Because he won despite having aborted three races while Alonso got wins by team orders? Get real. Alonso flipping off Petrov today because he wasn't good enough to get past him showed his true personality.

surgeon
11-14-2010, 08:20 AM
Because he won despite having aborted three races while Alonso got wins by team orders? Get real. Alonso flipping off Petrov today because he wasn't good enough to get past him showed his true personality.

vettel won 10 poles, most of which were red bull 1-2s. it's obvious he had by far the best car and still managed on several occasions to only just beat mark webber, of all people. he should've won the championship 3 or 4 races ago, he didn't because he's over-rated.

alonso showed he's human; who wouldn't be angry that after starting 3rd (and falling back to 4th, still enough to win), he ended up at the back of the points because his team brought him in way too soon and cost him the WDC.
alonso won one race through team orders. the way RBR favoured vettel all year is enough for me not to want him to win: vettel infront - "we will favour whichever driver is ahead on points", webber leading - "we will not favour either driver".

SayaSe
11-14-2010, 08:45 AM
he should've won the championship 3 or 4 races ago, he didn't because he's over-rated.
No, he didn't because he aborted three races (75 potential points lost) and Alonso got undeserved wins through team orders... :rolleyes:

And being human isn't an excuse for acting like a ♥♥♥♥ to a random Russian who happens to get in your way.

surgeon
11-14-2010, 08:57 AM
alonso gained 7 points through team orders in a team sport. two of vettel's 3 DNFs were also his own fault.

And being human isn't an excuse for acting like a ♥♥♥♥ to a random Russian who happens to get in your way.

neither is it when you turn into your team-mate, take yourself out of the race and him out of the lead because the team told him to go into fuel-saving mode several laps before vettel.

Highway Chile
11-14-2010, 09:32 AM
goto be one of the most boring and frustrating races ever....if I was alonso i probably would of knocked petrov out like Haye did..

both Renaults played their role for RB Renault well today

i hope next year there will be actual fighting for p1,p2 p3, etc...most of the time it seems Red Bull just go off into the distance and the majority of fighting is for the lower posistions, i dunno if this is RBR's fault or not but they for me the are the most boring team ever in existance of any sport.



and even though 2010 was not to be his year...

If Alonso wins the WDC tomorrow you have to post an ASCII Ferrari F10 :p



F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F
10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10 F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F1
0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10 F10F10F10F10F10F10
F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F
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0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10 F10F10F10F10F10F10
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F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F
10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10 F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F1
0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10 F10F10F10F10F10F10
F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F1 0F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F10F 10F10F10F10F10F10F


:D

will soon be time for next year's thread too : o

SayaSe
11-14-2010, 09:47 AM
most of the time it seems Red Bull just go off into the distance and the majority of fighting is for the lower posistions
Just like Schumacher?

i dunno if this is RBR's fault or not but they for me the are the most boring team ever in existance of any sport.
Just like Schumacher?

I don't see why people keep dissing those who completely dominate.

T@T-2-MoNk3y
11-14-2010, 11:03 AM
Just like Schumacher?


Just like Schumacher?

I don't see why people keep dissing those who completely dominate.

if they completely dominated they would have won both championships way before the final 2 races...

SayaSe
11-14-2010, 11:07 AM
That just makes the dissing even worse.

Highway Chile
11-14-2010, 11:08 AM
who completely dominate.

one WDC and one WCC in a season which came down to strategy more than actual racing doesn't mean complete domination rofl

SayaSe
11-14-2010, 11:20 AM
one WDC and one WCC in a season which came down to strategy more than actual racing doesn't mean complete domination rofl
I was referring to your general complaints about drivers who "just go off into the distance" and leave "the majority fighting for the lower positions". That is complete domination.

T@T-2-MoNk3y
11-14-2010, 11:25 AM
complete domination is a 1-2 in every race and winning by a clear lap...

i still don't feel the redbull car is completely legal...

surgeon
11-14-2010, 11:34 AM
the red bull has obviously been dominant all season, by a large margin. people said button only won last year because he had the best car, but that was only true for the first 3 or 4 races until RBR caught up.
i like webber but he's nowhere near the level of alonso or hamilton, and i think that proves how dominant the car was. put any one of about half the field in that car and they'd have won the WDC too.

MrChris
11-14-2010, 11:50 AM
I find the Alonso rage hilarious but also a bit annoyed because yes the Red Bulls are sort of twats, they just hide it better than Ferrari

still, Webber should turn that frown upside down (like he did his car) he did good

ledbelly
11-14-2010, 12:33 PM
complete domination is a 1-2 in every race and winning by a clear lap...

i still don't feel the redbull car is completely legal...

the job of an F1 designer is to push to the very limits of what's legal.

i'm actually glad red bull won everything and not ferrari. if mclaren weren't going to win anything then i hoped red bull would.

it may be foreign owned but it's a british team.

T@T-2-MoNk3y
11-14-2010, 12:36 PM
that bugs me about redbull too... the cars are built in a factory in England and they play the Austrian national anthem :(

ledbelly
11-14-2010, 12:41 PM
that bugs me about redbull too... the cars are built in a factory in England and they play the Austrian national anthem :(

well they provided the money. i still see it as adrian newey's car and a british team as a whole though.

Peelz
11-14-2010, 01:24 PM
Alonsos rage and blaming his failure on somebody else just highlights what kind of man he really is.

Vettel deserve it for at the very least being a really nice down to earth guy.

Zero_Vector
11-14-2010, 01:56 PM
Vettel's year maybe.

Posted back in Feb by Kev.

Rep to Tony for the F10. :)

Shame for Alonso. That track is a bastard to pass on, but really I would have expected him to make a Kobayashi-style dive down the inside to at least risk it.

I kind of dislike Vettel a little, but he was crying at the end. That softened my heart. Plus he did drive well this season.

Highway Chile
11-14-2010, 02:24 PM
Posted back in Feb by Kev.

Rep to Tony for the F10. :)

Shame for Alonso. That track is a bastard to pass on, but really I would have expected him

I kind of dislike Vettel a little, but he was crying at the end. That softened my heart. Plus he did drive well this season.

this might offer some insight on why both massa could not pass Alguesari (srsly...♥♥♥♥ing JAIME ALGUERASUARI (however you spell) of all people and why Alonso had difficulty passing Petrov:

http://www.formula1.com/results/season/2010/841/6806/speed_trap.html

sure it is qualifying but look at the top 3...read somewhere that Petrov and Kubiscuits took a new engine just for this race, so i guess that made it even tougher for Hamilton to pass him.

to make a Kobayashi-style dive down the inside to at least risk it.

lol, did you see some of that desperate, maybe fustration style driving near the end when he was taking that longer, but faster line around the outside of the track. It was quite a sad moment I thought. But in some ways...I still think if anyone should of got that title, it was him. Just got 14th place on a terrrible race in Silverstone and says he's gona win the WDC, somehow motivates himself so much and drives the hell out of that F10. You have to be quite proud of him and Ferrari for what they did in the past few months.

Just imagine Hamilton and Alonso if they were in that Rb6....season woulda been over at Bahrain lolol

Also Tilke needs to gtfo out whatever contract he has with Bernie to produce theses bloody awful tracks...they need to get rid of ♥♥♥♥ like Monaco which is just time trial also..stop this street circuit ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, no one cares if there is a city just outside the track, we all just want to look at cars are get some classic tracks back onto the calendar.

hopefully with Pirerlli producing less enduring tyres (Montreal was imo the best race of them all and i would say the tyre degedration and them pitstops played a role),, banning of the double diffuser, KER system (loved watching Raikkonen and Hamilton use that :D) and maybe some other aero rules yet to come we will have a more 'racing' 2011 F1 season. i hope that this fuel ban is only temporary, because it really makes qualifying so ♥♥♥♥ing dull and predictable

OH LOOK RED BULL FASTEST AGAIN IN Q3 what a surprise :\


also had this other thought while i was on the toilet the other day...what if all the tyres looked exactly the same, like none of them had green stripes, they were just black. could add another nice little bit of uncertatinty for the front runners specially when they look at the Barichello's, the Hulkenburg's, Sutil's etc when those get p11, p12, p13 in qualifying and can choose whatever they want.


Alonsos rage and blaming his failure on somebody else just highlights what kind of man he really is.

Vettel deserve it for at the very least being a really nice down to earth guy.

i've seen people rage more over a game of CSS than that lol

Zero_Vector
11-14-2010, 02:44 PM
Yes, I think Pirelli tyres, KERS and the adjustable rear-wing should make at least a bit of an improvement to overtaking. It really needs it.

I wouldn't agree with taking Monaco off though. Having seen a GP live there, it really is amazing. And there have been some very good races there when it rains :p They just need need a weather machine.

The tyre idea is definitely a goodun. It might be a bit confusing for the teams themselves, but they could come up with some secret marking.

surgeon
11-15-2010, 03:12 AM
the renaults had the best traction coming out the corners, which means at the end of the two straights (basically the only passing place on what is the world's 2nd most boring circuit, after bahrain), alonso was too far behind to try anything.

i agree about refueling too, i don't really like how races can get decided by pit stops but it adds another element of strategy instead of who can swap the wheels fastest.
i also agree about monaco. if they want to cut costs, scrap the sunday race and award points for quali because the order will always be the same. the only problem is if they do scrap it, it'd be replaced with a tilke track in a desert where 150 people turn up to watch.

RAKTHEUNDEAD
11-15-2010, 03:32 AM
he should've won the championship 3 or 4 races ago, he didn't because he's over-rated.

Engine explosion in Korea says hello. In fact, mechanical issues in the first race of the season say hello as well.

Yes, I think Pirelli tyres, KERS and the adjustable rear-wing should make at least a bit of an improvement to overtaking. It really needs it.

Right after the season with the most overtaking since 1989? There were more than double the number of successful overtaking manoeuvres this year over last year. It's by far the biggest percentage increase in overtaking season-on-season ever. Also, KERS, as evidenced by 2009, doesn't appreciably improve overtaking; in fact, it tended to stop it, as demonstrated by the Belgian Grand Prix, where Fisichella had the superior car, but couldn't get close enough to Raikkonen to even take him on in the overtaking zones.

Zero_Vector
11-15-2010, 03:36 AM
Watch Monaco 2008. That was probably in the top 3 races in 2008:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs8fVxSG-es

Only clip I could get so excuse the patronizing commentary.

Rain + barriers everywhere = glorious.
Right after the season with the most overtaking since 1989?

Wow really? Chalk that one up to Kobayashi :p Seriously though I guess in retrospect it's been a good season for overtaking just the finale was chronically short on it. KERS seemed to help Lewis with a lot of overtaking in 2009 but I suppose the use of it defensively probably cancelled that out.

Peelz
11-15-2010, 04:53 AM
also had this other thought while i was on the toilet the other day...

Wat??

surgeon
11-15-2010, 04:59 AM
Engine explosion in Korea says hello. In fact, mechanical issues in the first race of the season say hello as well.

of the 10 races he started on pole, he won 3 of them (lewis and alonso won every race in which they started from pole, button likewise in 2009). only 2 of those he failed to win were because of retirements.

Highway Chile
11-15-2010, 10:57 AM
Engine explosion in Korea says hello. In fact, mechanical issues in the first race of the season say hello as well.



Right after the season with the most overtaking since 1989? There were more than double the number of successful overtaking manoeuvres this year over last year. It's by far the biggest percentage increase in overtaking season-on-season ever. Also, KERS, as evidenced by 2009, doesn't appreciably improve overtaking; in fact, it tended to stop it, as demonstrated by the Belgian Grand Prix, where Fisichella had the superior car, but couldn't get close enough to Raikkonen to even take him on in the overtaking zones.

i take it you got that info from :

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ZaV_FBjfUdMJ:www.cliptheapex.com/forum/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D51%26t%3D822+f1+overtakes+in+2 010&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=safari

because of the 1989 thing
also noticed that stuff like their avg. overtakes per GP is actually a little bit higher than what it should be cause they are using 2010 as 17 gp's but it was actually 19..

but then i found something REALLY puzzling, when you go and look at the actual stats for each track.

just take Shanghai for example and look at the number of overtakes it says for the 2010 race.

82 ?!

EIGTY TWO OVERTAKES IN ONE RACE ? maybe it was just that long ago but bloody hell i don't recall eigty two actual overtakes which to them excludes:

The overtaking figures for each race (across both data sets) do not include:

Position changes on the first lap of the race
Position changes due to drivers lapping backmarkers
Positions gained in the pits
Positions gained due to drivers yielding
Positions gained when a car has a serious technical problem; e.g. puncture, accident damage, etc.


so it wasn't just Glock getting p1 in q3 then crashing on lap 1 so everyone got an 'overtake'...they are saying it was a proper pass.

but damn 83 just seems way too strange, specially as there are only 24 cars.

You get some more believable stuff like 15 in Monza for 2010...

Also 21 for Bahrain...:p

maybe i am just reading the table wrong


Watch Monaco 2008. That was probably in the top 3 races in 2008:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs8fVxSG-es

Only clip I could get so excuse the patronizing commentary.

Rain + barriers everywhere = glorious.
lol, yes that was an entertaining race but because of the rain...you have to say the track itself is there more for the glory than for actual racing.


hmm they might have the fastest car...but not the fastest driver :

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2010/11/11542.html

:D

RAKTHEUNDEAD
11-15-2010, 12:16 PM
just take Shanghai for example and look at the number of overtakes it says for the 2010 race.

82 ?!

EIGTY TWO OVERTAKES IN ONE RACE ? maybe it was just that long ago but bloody hell i don't recall eigty two actual overtakes

[...]

but damn 83 just seems way too strange, specially as there are only 24 cars.

I remember that race. It was wet, there's a long straight with a big braking zone at the end. There was a lot of overtaking. Schumacher was a big loser in all of that.

A lot of the overtaking manoeuvres were in Lap 4. There's a video of all of them here:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xd0kp0_2010-china-overtakes_auto

Also 21 for Bahrain...:p

maybe i am just reading the table wrong

Most of them, if I remember correctly, between the new teams, probably at the start of the race. Some people get a good start, then get re-passed after a few laps. There weren't many shown on camera, because the Red Bull of Vettel was just imperious until the reliability issues at the end.

hmm they might have the fastest car...but not the fastest driver :

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2010/11/11542.html

:D

That's a good point. I'd rate Fernando Alonso as a strong technical driver, with very good corner-to-corner skills - perhaps the best in the sport right now - but I wouldn't necessarily rate him as a wheel-to-wheel racer as I would Hamilton or Kubica or even Kobayashi. Then again, I wouldn't rate Vettel as a great wheel-to-wheel racer either.

Just a note, though, to show that qualifying success doesn't always guarantee you good race success: The 1982 season featured only two wins from pole position, and the champion, Keke Rosberg, scored a single pole position during the season - which he promptly retired from.

Highway Chile
11-15-2010, 12:25 PM
Yea...seems like them 6 new cars at the back add a nice number to the overtakes and that slick vs inter tyre thing in Shanghai made it to 82... Lol 82 wow.


still though the fact is there even if there is more overtaking, we have seen so often cars just unable to do anything in the disturbed air of the car infront...significant rule changes are needed.

RAKTHEUNDEAD
11-15-2010, 12:28 PM
Chalk that one up to Kobayashi :p

I'll chalk some of that up to Kobayashi, alright. He passed people at the Hungaroring. Major respect from me. Shows you why I was supporting him all year.

Seriously though I guess in retrospect it's been a good season for overtaking just the finale was chronically short on it.

Probably as much to do with the track than the cars. I wasn't fond of Abu Dhabi last year; there are theoretical overtaking zones damaged by improperly-designed braking zones. It's not a great place for the final race of the season, action-wise, which is why I'm glad that they're going back to Brazil next year.

Zero_Vector
11-15-2010, 01:02 PM
Something this season about the wet races has led to a lot of overtaking in them. Close to half the overtaking this season came from those 4 wet races! A lot of the increase is probably down to the 6 mobile chicanes that joined the grid this year.

surgeon
11-15-2010, 01:39 PM
Probably as much to do with the track than the cars. I wasn't fond of Abu Dhabi last year; there are theoretical overtaking zones damaged by improperly-designed braking zones. It's not a great place for the final race of the season, action-wise, which is why I'm glad that they're going back to Brazil next year.

It's the perfect race - all those sheiks get to show off their yachts and obnoxious wealth, while Bernie Ecclestone receives millions from them in return. That's what F1 is about - Bernie making money at others' expense.

I'm glad Brazil is getting the finale again. Most people only tune in for the last race, and if they have to suffer through Abu Dhabi they probably aren't coming back. On the down-side, Bahrain still gets to open the season.

Highway Chile
11-16-2010, 08:50 AM
Something this season about the wet races has led to a lot of overtaking in them. Close to half the overtaking this season came from those 4 wet races! A lot of the increase is probably down to the 6 mobile chicanes that joined the grid this year.

yea was thinking this in bed last night when i couldn't sleep...82 overtakes in a season which had 500..16.4% of the season's of overtakes in ONE race which was wet.

maybe in 2011 the FIA should enforce giant tank osf water on the back of every car which slowly drips out over the race...

eram
11-16-2010, 08:56 AM
the next 113 days are really boring.

Suddenly, Fog, Everywhere.
http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/4707/193801370.jpg

T@T-2-MoNk3y
01-11-2011, 09:03 AM
Bye bye Legard...

Martin Brundle is to become BBC Sport's lead Formula 1 commentator in 2011, with David Coulthard moving alongside him as co-commentator. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/9355081.stm)

only 58 days to go til the new season starts...

RAKTHEUNDEAD
01-11-2011, 09:31 AM
Bye bye Legard...

Martin Brundle is to become BBC Sport's lead Formula 1 commentator in 2011, with David Coulthard moving alongside him as co-commentator. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/9355081.stm)

only 58 days to go til the new season starts...

About bloody time, I say. Martin Brundle has deserved a shot at the top for a while now, and having another experienced racing driver in there will hopefully mean some rapport there.

surgeon
01-11-2011, 09:46 AM
I'm so glad Legard is gone, but DC is a terrible choice as a replacement (unless DC stands for David Croft, who's maybe better even than Brundle).
Besides the fact that he defends Red Bull whatever they do, whenever they cut to him during a race he always talks about the most dull things.

Firestorm998
01-11-2011, 09:59 AM
About bloody time, I say. Martin Brundle has deserved a shot at the top for a while now, and having another experienced racing driver in there will hopefully mean some rapport there.
Yep, should be a good combo. Brundle has grown into the tv role well and is now able to produce exciting commentary. I hope DC sticks to a more techie role to back Brundle up kinda like Murray / Hunt or Murray / Brundle. That style of presentation worked really well.

I didn't find Legard engaging at all.

T@T-2-MoNk3y
01-11-2011, 11:15 AM
i was never a legard fan... he got too excited and would cut off Brundle when he was saying something insightful...

Zero_Vector
01-11-2011, 12:37 PM
Legard seemed to go on about the dullest stuff. He had these bits of useless information he kept trotting out.

It may be better that David Croft hasn't been bumped to the main commentary as he and Anthony Davidson go well together.

surgeon
01-11-2011, 02:02 PM
i was never a legard fan... he got too excited and would cut off Brundle when he was saying something insightful...

the best parts were when he'd say something inane and stupid to brundle, who'd just ignore him and then start talking about something else after a long silence.

Pulseezar
01-12-2011, 07:25 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/9359509.stm

HD next season :D

MikeBlaszczak
01-14-2011, 01:39 PM
F1 race on the right, track day on the left (http://youtubedoubler.com/?video1=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DJUhu13qp8Oc%26feature%3Dplayer_embedde d&start1=&video2=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Dseget3zOj_8%26feature%3Dplayer_embedde d&start2=&authorName=Not+Sure), from the same vantage point.

Zero_Vector
01-15-2011, 07:57 AM
That's cool. Back on the old Eau Rouge an F1 car would at least have to brake. I'd love to drive Spa in any kind of vagely sporty car.

Gotta buy me an HD TV for March.

Firestorm998
03-06-2011, 06:33 AM
BBC F1 2011 preview (Podcast) (http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/cff1)

Discussions on Bahrain GP, new rules etc.

Soon time for the 2011 F1 thread Highway. ;)

Zero_Vector
03-06-2011, 08:38 AM
I haven't seen Tony post in OT for ages :(

It still seems like ages to until the first race. Damn political unrest getting in the way of my fast car racing!

McLaren looking slow again... sigh.

ledbelly
03-06-2011, 10:47 AM
F1 race on the right, track day on the left (http://youtubedoubler.com/?video1=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DJUhu13qp8Oc%26feature%3Dplayer_embedde d&start1=&video2=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Dseget3zOj_8%26feature%3Dplayer_embedde d&start2=&authorName=Not+Sure), from the same vantage point.

lol

yeah, the difference in speed is quite amazing. :)