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fomeboy
05-13-2010, 10:39 AM
Does anybody know if Source SDK tools will be available for mac developers and when?

derrman0426
05-13-2010, 10:59 AM
im presuming once all source games are brought to the mac integrated source engine we'll see support for it on mac. portal is already on that engine, team fortress 2 i figure would be next and day of defeat source which run on the latest 2009 build. counter-strike source would be soon to follow with it in beta and all, then they'll top it all off by releasing the full half life 2 series onto the new engine, and there will be joyness and yayness amongst the community XD

Rojo
05-13-2010, 11:43 AM
Do you mean tools like Hammer? They aren't porting these over.

They are going to update the SDK to compile code for cross platform compatibility. That's it.

fomeboy
05-13-2010, 11:46 AM
If thatīs the case it is a big turn off for me...

birvin
05-18-2010, 09:02 AM
then why the ♥♥♥♥ port the engine over if they aint porting the tools what are we suppose to do sit here with our thumb up out asses and use the force to make mods on macs?

Killers2
05-18-2010, 09:43 AM
I guess you make them on Windows and then compile it on Mac.
"
we do not plan to port the individual tools in the Source SDK at this time. Hammer in particular is heavily using MFC so it wouldn't be worth the effort.

- Alfred"

Vonje
05-18-2010, 09:50 AM
then why the ♥♥♥♥ port the engine over if they aint porting the tools what are we suppose to do sit here with our thumb up out asses and use the force to make mods on macs?

Use Windows? There's no denying that it is the main platform for developers. Besides you WILL be able to make maps on Macs (confirmed on the first announcement).

MoDFoX
05-18-2010, 10:29 AM
That's a pain in the ♥♥♥, I don't want to install steam and all my games twice just to get resources for Hammer.

drwolfik
05-18-2010, 11:20 AM
This was discussed a long time ago:
Alfred Reynolds
Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:54:08 -0800

We will be releasing code support for OSX so you can compile your mods for OSX.
The timing of that will be shortly after release.

- Alfred
Source: hlcoders forum (http://www.mail-archive.com/hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com/msg29600.html).

Ninja0Pain
05-18-2010, 05:45 PM
We are a tier 1 so most likely we will get it

WolfyZack
05-19-2010, 02:10 AM
I hope they port at least SOMETHING over. I'd like to try Hammer at least.
But at this point, better support for just using 3rd party maps would be nice.

Greggers :D
05-19-2010, 04:07 AM
They aren't porting these over.

:o Mind citing your source?

birvin
05-19-2010, 08:27 AM
this is ♥♥♥♥ing bull ♥♥♥♥ they are still sucking ms off. oh yea lets use mfc for everything uhuhuhuhuhuh so we cant port it to mac uhuhuhuhuhuh we are bunch of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. im about tired of seeing Microsoft. Mac > Win. When i do get a mac all of my windows cds are geting the 12 gauge.

damicatz
05-19-2010, 12:54 PM
this is ♥♥♥♥ing bull ♥♥♥♥ they are still sucking ms off. oh yea lets use mfc for everything uhuhuhuhuhuh so we cant port it to mac uhuhuhuhuhuh we are bunch of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. im about tired of seeing Microsoft. Mac > Win. When i do get a mac all of my windows cds are geting the 12 gauge.

Perhaps if you would control your rabid anti-Microsoft vitriol for a moment, you'd realise that a lot of C++ applications written in Windows use MFC. A Windows application using MFC is no different than a Mac application using Cocoa; neither can be effectively ported between platforms without a significant rewrite.

gu3st
05-19-2010, 01:17 PM
Actually.. MFC would be more similar to Carbon. Cocoa is totally a different language. MFC and Carbon are atleast C++ as well.

damicatz
05-19-2010, 01:56 PM
Actually.. MFC would be more similar to Carbon. Cocoa is totally a different language. MFC and Carbon are atleast C++ as well.

It's not really about what language the APIs are in (though technically, you can make a Cocoa application using C++ via Qt (http://qt.nokia.com/products/platform/qt-for-mac)).

Cocoa and Carbon and MFCs are all platform-specific APIs. An application written purely in Carbon or Cocoa is just as difficult to port to Windows as an application written using MFcs is to the Mac.

MacBalance
05-19-2010, 03:14 PM
I would like to be able to play with Hammer, but I'll live if they don't port it.

NSGod
05-20-2010, 05:10 PM
Actually.. MFC would be more similar to Carbon. Cocoa is totally a different language. MFC and Carbon are atleast C++ as well.

First of all, the term "Carbon" is used quite often without clarifying exactly what is meant by it. Carbon can generally mean 2 different things:

1) Carbon UI: this is what most people mean when they say "Carbon application". The application links against the Carbon.framework, has a Carbon-based user interface that uses HIToolbox, and it uses the Carbon Event Manager for event handling. The Carbon.framework includes the lower-level Carbon APIs (see 2)). These are available in 32-bit form only.

2) "Carbon" lower-level APIs: these are C-based APIs available in frameworks like CoreServices, ApplicationServices, and CoreFoundation. Even non-Carbon UI applications (such as a "Cocoa" app) can, and routinely do, use these APIs. Virtually all of these APIs (except for deprecated (discontinued) functions) are available in 64 bit.

The following is a diagram of the layered-nature of Carbon:

Carbon.framework (ApplicationServices + Carbon UI, Carbon Event Manager)
-----------------------------------
ApplicationServices.framework (CoreServices+ higher level stuff like CoreGraphics, font and text handling, etc.)
-----------------------------------
CoreServices.framework (CarbonCore, Networking, AppleEvents, SearchKit, etc.)
-----------------------------------


All Carbon APIs, including both 1 and 2 from above, are C-based, not C++. The only place (that I'm aware of) that expressly uses C++ is IOKit (used for writing hardware device drivers). Though all of Carbon is C-based, most developers that are developing a Carbon UI-based application will use C++, since that provides an object-oriented approach to development (and they're free to call the C-based Carbon APIs whenever they need to).

While Cocoa apps are generally written in Objective-C, it's probably the most flexible of all, since you can call not only Objective-C and C, but also C++ (otherwise known as Objective-C++).

NSGod
05-20-2010, 05:34 PM
It's not really about what language the APIs are in (though technically, you can make a Cocoa application using C++ via Qt (http://qt.nokia.com/products/platform/qt-for-mac)).

Cocoa and Carbon and MFCs are all platform-specific APIs. An application written purely in Carbon or Cocoa is just as difficult to port to Windows as an application written using MFcs is to the Mac.

You don't need Qt to write a Cocoa app in C++. Just start with a basic Cocoa application template, change the filename extensions from ".m" to ".mm" and define a namespace by adding a line like the following to the top of your .mm files:

using namespace std;

buckmeister
05-20-2010, 06:10 PM
Firstly, the Carbon UI framework is on track to be deprecated, which is a well-known fact among developers. Carbon was created as a cleaned up version of the pre-OS X APIs to help with porting applications to OS X.

Yes, Cocoa uses Objective-C as it's language, but the compilers support "Objective-C++" - ie a combination of Objective-C and C++ in the same file. It has restrictions (ie a class has to be either a C++ or Objective-C class)

Finally on the Hammer issue, Valve use Windows to develop their games, and have no plans to change this in the near future, so it wouldn't be worth their while to port Hammer to the Mac. The Source SDK only provides tools that Valve use themselves; they don't develop tools especially.

Gunn3r
06-25-2010, 11:28 PM
Actually.. MFC would be more similar to Carbon. Cocoa is totally a different language. MFC and Carbon are atleast C++ as well.
... actually Cocoa is not a language it's an API, you probably mean Objective-C instead.
And yes ... lets wait for the Mac Source SDK! :D

dreamersofeden
12-06-2010, 11:18 AM
Any news about Source SDK for Mac?

Madd the Sane
12-06-2010, 01:03 PM
Carbon is C, although you can make Carbon calls in C++.

spillz
03-21-2011, 11:15 PM
you ungrateful little fruit lovers. you're all lucky you finally have some decent games to play.

why would Valve release hammer and the other authoring tools for the mac? do you really think it would be a good use of their time??? Cmon, they use pc's to develop games and will continue to do so. Releasing it for the mac would require a total rewrite of the tools... i.e. total waste of time, not to mention now they have 2 sets of code to keep upto date... no way would they do this, don't kid yourself.

If you want to develop source games run a vm or get a pc, simple as that.

Symmetric
03-21-2011, 11:17 PM
you ungrateful little fruit lovers. you're all lucky you finally have some decent games to play.

why would Valve release hammer and the other authoring tools for the mac? do you really think it would be a good use of their time??? Cmon, they use pc's to develop games and will continue to do so. Releasing it for the mac would require a total rewrite of the tools... i.e. total waste of time, not to mention now they have 2 sets of code to keep upto date... no way would they do this, don't kid yourself.

If you want to develop source games run a vm or get a pc, simple as that.

Valve never said they were bringing the entire SDK to Mac. Ever.

What they did say was that the SDK would be updated to allow addon authors to make their addons Source 2009-compatible so they could be used on the Mac. That has yet to happen.