Anyone else think this game is awful?

[DarkFenix]

Because I certainly do. I am basically venting frustration over the game, but my problems with the game are far from unreasonable.

1) The AI has magic X-ray vision. The tutorial makes a point of telling you to hide in bushes, yet in actual play the AI simply sees through bushes 90% of the time.

2) The AI has magic bullets. Another game where the AI is magically accurate through dense visual cover at an absurd range.

3) Stealth mechanics are arbitrary and possibly broken by design. Ok, so here's an example of what I mean. First mission, after the explosion screws your shot. The enemies are alert but haven't seen you, in fact they clearly have no idea snipers are present, but they all look in your direction and your direction alone. Furthermore, certain guards can be eliminated (I used quickloading to test it out) but certain guards if eliminated will arbitrarily trigger all the area's enemies to instantly know your location.

4) Sniper rifles are terrible. Bullet drop at 50 metres? Please. And I'm no stranger to scope sway, but this guy's scope dances around like he's drunk during an earthquake. Oh and on the same lines as bullet drop at absurdly short ranges? Let's also talk bullet travel time at short ranges.

5) The game seems determined at every stage to stop me having fun. For starters the example from point 3, I had the opportunity to stealthily eliminate most, if not all, of the enemies in the area, but the game's design steals that fun away immediately. A mission or two on, I'm supposed to provide sniper support for Delta 3's assault, what do I get to do? Shoot 3 immobile enemy snipers then it's called off and I don't get to do anything fun.

I only played as far as the oil rig level (which was the last straw, I mean, a level where you're not even a sniper, and stealth is not an option at all), but I gave the game a few chances after it determinedly screwed up every level in turn. This game has potential to be great, but awful AI, weapons, level design and stealth mechanics ruin it completely.

[lostatneverseen]

guess its back to easy call of duty modern warfail for you.

[DarkFenix]

Wondered how long it'd take a troll to come out to play.

[Exil]

guess its back to easy call of duty modern warfail for you.

Wow...the only thing a troll can say, sorry to say this but OP has valid points...

there are a few more stuff that you still haven't see OP...

Like your allies getting stuck (on the no-sniper missions - there are at least 2 more after the oil rig), enemies hitting you through the wall...at one point I had to cover the ground team as a sniper (after the oil rig) it was impossible, as soon as the enemy started fighting them and I fired just 1 shot, they all turned towards me and started ♥♥♥♥♥♥ my area...

The game has a lot of flaws, its grinding my nerves more then relaxing me...

[Kezuru]

AI=Omnipresence. To think that this game was tested and given the go ahead anyway....sigh. The challenge in a sniper game is making the shot. The act of shooting should have been the mainstay, not running from enemies that see the world on easy mode. You'd think they wouldn't be able to ignore this, after saying this would be the most realistic sniping game ever, but then again; what's the competition? I hope there's is some dev somewhere going...I can do better than that.

[Gravity Cat]

Yes the bots are a bit super vision but think to real life, its not hard to see a camo guy in some plants , if they just shot somone and you look hard enough. I think ppl wanted a "realistic" sniping game that was easy, both things dont mix lol. I do think because of the smalls maps etc its can be hard to stealth but very much possible, tbh I think ppl are moaning because the game can be quite hard.

[DarkFenix]

Ever actually tried to pick out a ghillie suit in a square kilometre of vegetation? It's not easy even up close. At long range it's nigh impossible.

[limit]

DarkFenix ur points to the game is right how ever this game is made by "city-interactive" not "Treyarch" there for it will never have the AI or game play we want or need ... this is a low budget team that makes game if you have ever seen there other games you would understand that thay do not have a lot of skills in game design how ever i must say this game could be grate if the time was put in ot it.

[Inimical_rize]

Agreed the bullet drop is incredible, a standard I.W (Infantry weapon) SA80A2, M16, M4 (weapons of smiler calibre) the effects of wind become apparent at 100mtrs after 400mtrs gravity will take effect, over 700mts heat will take an effect, over 1400mtrs curvature of the earth, 1600+ heat, humidity, rain, snow, hail and everything said before obv. (in extreme cases)

Edit: Forgot to add that i like the game, just making an observation.

[Kezuru]

Yes the bots are a bit super vision but think to real life, its not hard to see a camo guy in some plants , if they just shot somone and you look hard enough. I think ppl wanted a "realistic" sniping game that was easy, both things dont mix lol. I do think because of the smalls maps etc its can be hard to stealth but very much possible, tbh I think ppl are moaning because the game can be quite hard.

Hard? Any game that can be run through in a weekend is not hard. Everyone expected "realistic", but there's no satisfaction from fighting from the same distances as other fps', just through a scope. Calculate for wind, blah, blah who cares when they are only 100 meters away? An M4...an M4 could reach all engagement ranges in the game easily. With iron sights. How the hell is there realism in that? People are complaining that the game puts them in that situation when they never expected to be. They bought the game for a different challenge.

[mhenlo1990]

Because I certainly do. I am basically venting frustration over the game, but my problems with the game are far from unreasonable.

1) The AI has magic X-ray vision. The tutorial makes a point of telling you to hide in bushes, yet in actual play the AI simply sees through bushes 90% of the time.

2) The AI has magic bullets. Another game where the AI is magically accurate through dense visual cover at an absurd range.

3) Stealth mechanics are arbitrary and possibly broken by design. Ok, so here's an example of what I mean. First mission, after the explosion screws your shot. The enemies are alert but haven't seen you, in fact they clearly have no idea snipers are present, but they all look in your direction and your direction alone. Furthermore, certain guards can be eliminated (I used quickloading to test it out) but certain guards if eliminated will arbitrarily trigger all the area's enemies to instantly know your location.

4) Sniper rifles are terrible. Bullet drop at 50 metres? Please. And I'm no stranger to scope sway, but this guy's scope dances around like he's drunk during an earthquake. Oh and on the same lines as bullet drop at absurdly short ranges? Let's also talk bullet travel time at short ranges.

5) The game seems determined at every stage to stop me having fun. For starters the example from point 3, I had the opportunity to stealthily eliminate most, if not all, of the enemies in the area, but the game's design steals that fun away immediately. A mission or two on, I'm supposed to provide sniper support for Delta 3's assault, what do I get to do? Shoot 3 immobile enemy snipers then it's called off and I don't get to do anything fun.

I only played as far as the oil rig level (which was the last straw, I mean, a level where you're not even a sniper, and stealth is not an option at all), but I gave the game a few chances after it determinedly screwed up every level in turn. This game has potential to be great, but awful AI, weapons, level design and stealth mechanics ruin it completely.

i agree with these points, i was really hoping this would be a sniper game and not some arcade shooter... guess we'll just have to take some hostages from a company who could make a real sniper game? who's in? ;)

[andythebrave]

dark fenix is correct on missions in middle of dark rendezvous the AI picks me off even tough there all dead just as i cross fence even if im behind rocks trees digger leaving the camp the ai picks me off the multiplayer gives your position away with compass , there no skill there then it is just track the dot and listen, as i've said in other posts this game at the moment is not fit for purpose single player my sniper can progress and i hunted everyone even check every inc of tree line still i get blasted and its ot no skill. dont touch this game guys it needs a major patch and the dots removing onthe comapss if they fre yea but not if you ahve not fired its a cmaping game and its full of ai bugs, you throw a nade and they stand there as you have not triggered the auto repsonse,it is bad guys. Ive had to turn of the cam for bullet as almost eevry shot was becoming head shot.
If anybody has a fix for gettig rounbd this issue let me know please

[mouldir]

I too have got bored with this game quickly; the single player part anyway. I thought it was going to be about spending some time scouting to find an ideal sniping position, spot all the targets and then take them all down with them running around unable to spot you. This never seems to be an option. Its almost better to grab an assault weapon and go in blasting, it has about the same chance of success.

The grapple hook seems never to be available so you can't get to 90% of the visible terrain. There are invisible walls all over the place so you can only follow the linear route dictated. These are badly missed chances to open up the game to different play styles and just use some of all the ground out there.

I also hate, like others, that the tutorial made a lot of sneaking about in cover, only to find in the main game that this is pretty much a waste of time. You can't see enemies from 25 feet away but they can seem to spot you lying down in cover from 500 yards.

A flawed game that could have been so much better.

[Jefffryfry]

Answer me this. Why did they disable prone in multiplayer?

[gmt2001]

I agree on all of the points listed in the OP and most of the replies. The game has some flaws that really need to be worked out.

To add on to the list of complaints:
>You would except to have a 2-man team the whole game. Thats how a sniper TEAM works. Why dont they try to replace your fallen comrade while hes out?
>Working on the above point. This game has potential to make a great 2-person co-op if they fix some of the other discussed problems
>Has anyone else noticed that if an enemy is alerted to your presence he sometimes runs into a collision box and then just runs in place until you kill him?
>Where is the Coriolis effect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriolis_effect)?
>Why doesnt going prone stabilize our aim? You still swing like a drunken idiot. And why cant we have a stand to stabilize the weapon even further?
>Seriously we DO NOT need the MW2 knife. They should make it more like the Splinter Cell knife
>How about an option to use real magazines like AA?
>How about some nice large open terrain with some trees, hills, and the like. Perfect map for some actual sniping

[Squa7ch]

Yes the bots are a bit super vision but think to real life, its not hard to see a camo guy in some plants , if they just shot somone and you look hard enough. I think ppl wanted a "realistic" sniping game that was easy, both things dont mix lol. I do think because of the smalls maps etc its can be hard to stealth but very much possible, tbh I think ppl are moaning because the game can be quite hard.

spotting a well trained sniper in a ghillie suit in some vegetation is next to impossible if done correctly, especially at long range.

[Pendragon90]

Agreed with the OP, this game has major flaws and it almost completely misses the point of a stealth sniper game.

[pherone]

>Where is the Coriolis effect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriolis_effect)?

Pretty sure the Devs of this game have never ever used that word.

[qedqed]

So that's another game like Operation Flashpoint where AI always know where you are no matter if they cant see you?

[Blade01]

So that's another game like Operation Flashpoint where AI always know where you are no matter if they cant see you?

No, the Ai are good but not unbeatable.

[qedqed]

No, the Ai are good but not unbeatable.

I just checked a 5 min of gameplay on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh8kDlGrG9c, it seems very fine.
I don't know about military sniper rifles but the .22 got bullet drop at 50m, in games like Bad Company 2 bullet drop (depending on the rifle) starts at over 100m.

It looks like a cool single player game, i'm a bit worried about the multiplayer snipe fest.

[Sklex]

The OP is on the money.

Game looks great, plays fine. What makes it a complete waste of time is the AI.

Sorry but this is meant to be a sniper game. People who play sniper games like to sneak. Set up attacks. And in its current state its impossible. The enemy all know exactly where I am the second I move out from behind cover. :o

And has everyone noticed how the enemy all shoot at the ground? Even though the bullets magically come out of the barrel, reflect of the dirt, and land in your face?!?!

This is simply not the modern day replacement for Sniper Elite. :mad:

[Blade01]

Well i have never completed a singleplayer game in 15 years, my fix is online against real people, i've yet to see any singleplayer game where i can bothered to deal with the idiot Ai.

As for multiplayer this game is very good, if we get the dev support it deserves it will be even better.

Oh & sniper elite sucks donkey ballz, imho.

[boris5134]

I would have to agree in the fact the game is heavily flawed. Enemy combatants with X-Ray vision, being shot from the middle of no where, being shot by dead people, field of view is placed too far forward or is too narrow as everything appears closer than it is. I've played up til the sneak through the camp mission section where I'm really awestruck, how do all these people supposedly see a man laying in thick brush with a ghillie suit on? I can understand they might LOOK in your direction, that doesn't mean they SEE you. Hell, I hid in the middle of a woodsball paintball field in nothing but jeans and a red golf shirt and not even the ref had any idea I was there.

Not that the game did everything wrong as it surely made me go wow over the graphics and some animations (I've never seen AI perform a full body vault over a "wall" before, usually its a scripted solid movement but to see someone's body actually vault sideways over an obstacle is a first). Graphics in general are just amazing. I'd say they're better than what I've seen on some more heavily worked projects. Vegetation is well placed and dispersed. Overall environment looks excellent. World view of your own self (weapon, arm, scopes and the like) all are very clean and detailed, almost thought I was holding the real thing.

Things that need work:

Enemy AI - I don't know how you would even attempt to fix this as I would suggest you simply throw it away. I would start with using the AI from the original Ghost Recon to start. Hell' I'd even BUY you a copy to copy off of. No one is ever going to see a man in a well prepared ghillie suit behind thick brush but yet loose sight of them behind a 6x6 roof support post (and yes I am pulling gameplay for that) And what in the hell is this about the enemy will be able to "HEAR" me simply based on my stance? WHAT!? How the hell does the ice on mars have an affect on the solar dust collecting on Pluto? You affect one aspect of sense with the other? Interesting.

Ballistics Part 1 - (Range) (Being an avid sport shooter and marksman I'm well familiar with trajectory) Secondly, NO ONE EVER zero's there rifle at the end of the barrel. Having hit placement not 15m in front of me and compensating for range I would expect to see at about 100m just doesn't fly)

Ballistics Part 2 - (Wind) Wind will push a bullet depending on its velocity, mass, and volume. Just seeing the "SR 25" with the supposed "7.62x51mm" the wind offset for the distance and gauged wind is astro-♥♥♥♥ing-nomical.

Ballistics Part 3 - (Stance) I know how accurate a rifle can be if you tune it right, and mine is simply the combination of scrap parts and I'm making 2" groups at 100m with iron sights, I'm SURE any sniper rifle built will have tolerances MUCH higher than my AR-15. Prone with a bipod? If I'm not making 1.5" groups at 100m with being prone, supported with a bipod, and scope on that thing than I need to quit shooting.

Weapons: I don't even know where to begin, nerf some, boost others, why would anyone in their right mind on a combat deployment take a 10 round mag box for a SR 25? I don't even think they ISSUE those any more, let alone BUY any.

I was looking at this game months ago to perhaps use as a test bed of what might be similar to build off of when I finish my project in a few years, but I'm simply throwing it away as pure garbage for gameplay mechanics.

[fpsware]

I agree wholeheartedly with the original poster. I had such high hopes for this game and was sorely disappointed after the first five minutes.

The enemy AI is extremely disappointing; if I can't see through dense bush at 100m why should the enemy be able to do so. Is the enemy AI is using a wall hack?

So I shoot enemy AI at 100m and get a perfect head shot and every other enemy within the area knows exactly where am?! It's that wall hack again isn't it?

Long-range stealth combat really? It might be long-range combat until you fire the first shot. Stealth? Yeah well enough said on stealth.

I'm sorry to say but 30 minutes of gameplay is more than enough to be inflected with by this game, until there is a major update this game will forever sit on my shelf.

Great concept, shame about the implementation.

[SqS.Hyden]

i love the game

[beno639345]

If you treat the AI as you would a opposition player in muiltiplayer you might stand a better chance of completing the mission.
IMO the AI is the most advanced Ive seen.
example, in a real life situation the enemy would be trained merc's on a high state of alert. There for is not surprising if you get spotted rustling through the bushes. IRl solders have communication systems, so of coarse they can alert each other in the presence of an enemy attack.
IRL a ghilli suit makes you harder to see but its not an invisibility cloak.
IRL if you heard the sound of a shot you would have a good idea where it came from, so to the AI.

as for bullet drop, wind effect ect... obviously this long distance effect has been compressed into a short distance to enable the playability of the map.( in other words, yes the bullet drop dose seem a little unrealistic for the distance but you cant have a map 1.5 K long other wise the enemy would be the size of 1 pixel.)
this game is not MW2, so don't play it like MW2 change your tactics use your brain and treat the AI as real people. you will have much better experience if you play the game the way the developers designed it.

[Tearjerker]

The only "see all" I've experiment with the AI is the last mission, where just after you killed the guy in your path, there is a guy behind a wall, watching the other direction. Even tho I was on the ground, behind the wall, he saw me. But hey, I was playing on Easy.

[flickenmaste]

I rushed the first half of the singleplayer and alerted the entire country the game its in and was annoyed by it, but in the last half of the SP I took the levels painstakingly slow and rarely got caught. The AI only spots me if they are looking in my direction.

The AI does look over its shoulder everyone once in a while and if ur somewhere in their FOV they will see you. It looks like they are facing the other way but if you look closely they turn their heads over their shoulders.

I have not had as big of a problem with the AI as some people have.

[USMC_Viper]

Maybe this game is too realistic for the runners and spammers that play the COD games.
If you got urself into a ghili suit with a rifle ,pistol,ammo and a couple grenades tinkling around ur ♥♥♥♥ and snuck into an army base, how long do u think ud last b4 somebody spotted u and shot the **** out of you if u wernt slow and stealthy. Obviously the AI has been programmed to react to more than just line of sight and other factors such as movement ,speed ,stance "noise" shots, corpses all of which affect the spawn and alertness of the opposition .
I agree with Beno639345 that if u adapted ur game style in single player as if u were playing against real ppl uwould have more succes in the missions.

Forget the single player ♥♥♥♥♥ it's way too easy even on hard mode ... got all secrets ... i have to agree about your runners and spammers ... i call them rushers tho ... made the multiplayer sucky

[oscar123123123]

4) Sniper rifles are terrible. Bullet drop at 50 metres? Please. And I'm no stranger to scope sway, but this guy's scope dances around like he's drunk during an earthquake. Oh and on the same lines as bullet drop at absurdly short ranges? Let's also talk bullet travel time at short ranges.


Agreed, I couldn't hit ANYTHING because I go to the range often, and if City is gonna make a sniper game, at least do SOME form of research and learn that the bullet drop dont take effect until 100m

[beno639345]

for a 30$ game with graphics the same or better than farcry 2, realistic physics, a muiltiplayer with dedicated servers and no hacks (so far)
its a decent game.
obviously their will be faults no game is perfect.
for 30$ you have got a good deal, for that kind of money you could pick up a slab of beer... that would last you a weekend and you would feel like ♥♥♥♥ the next morning. its made by a small company that haven't done many FPS, it will give every one something to do for a few months until Black Ops comes out.

IMO they have done a good job, remember this not not a big company, i agree with some of you its not a COD game i don't think it ever Will be.
take it for what it is a small company development so stop complaining

[beno639345]

Agreed, I couldn't hit ANYTHING because I go to the range often, and if City is gonna make a sniper game, at least do SOME form of research and learn that the bullet drop dont take effect until 100m

as for bullet drop, wind effect ect... obviously this long distance effect has been compressed into a short distance to enable the playability of the map.( in other words, yes the bullet drop dose seem a little unrealistic for the distance but you cant have a map 1.5 K long other wise the enemy would be the size of 1 pixel.)

[KubanitoS]

I have to agree with OP. I really like these type of games. I enjoy using stealth, hiding in bushes, waiting for a patrol to move so I can continue my way to take out someone undetected. But this game doesn't properly support stealth. I mean I'm hiding in the jungle perfectly camoflaged just to see someone starts to shoot directly at me. I can't even shoot back, because I simply can't see anything just the plant in front of me. It is almost impossible to play this game properly. Enemies can see through bushes/trees like there was nothing there. And sometimes if I am detected every single enemy knows my exact position and starts to shoot me from a mile away and again I can't see anything...

This game is a huge dissapointment for me, because the atmosphere, and the graphics are really good, but it is missing the whole point. I guess I'll have to install Splinter Cell again if I want to play a good stealth game.

[Cloudfisher]

as for bullet drop, wind effect ect... obviously this long distance effect has been compressed into a short distance to enable the playability of the map.( in other words, yes the bullet drop dose seem a little unrealistic for the distance but you cant have a map 1.5 K long other wise the enemy would be the size of 1 pixel.)


Ok. but your forgetting "The most realistic sniping experience"

And you very easily can have a 1.5km map, since thats is a acceptable range to be using a sniper from, so wouldnt be like shooting at a pixel unles its the same as real life, in which case... you simply move closer? This game is suppost to be based around reallife after all so those reasons just dont stand strong.

[poontangcream]

And you very easily can have a 1.5km map, since thats is a acceptable range to be using a sniper from, so wouldnt be like shooting at a pixel unles its the same as real life, in which case... you simply move closer?
indeed, there are other games out there that have much larger maps.

is this a limitation of the engine used here?

[Greyscale]

Any game like real life would suck. Do you want to be completely immobilized after a pistol shot to the leg? There are some things that just can't be realistic. I don't want to aim at a guy's head, without him knowing, and just blast him away, and then repeat 1000 times. I want to account for wind and bullet drop from 50 m away. It's more fun and it's irrelevant when it comes to the quality of the GAME.

I think the game was definitely worth the $30. It's half the price of MW2 and actually requires skill.

Anyone here who thinks these programmers suck, I want to see you create a game from scratch and release it in perfect condition, ON TIME. Do you think they can take all the time in the world to test and fix? Programmers have deadlines, and I bet these guys had plenty of all-nighters working on this game. And they are probably working on it right now.

So thank you City Interactive for this game, it exceeded my expectations for the price it was. And if you release another sniper game I'm definitely buying it, because I like having to use my brain in a video game every once in a while.

[HAO]

boy am i sure glad i decided not to buy this :D

[Greyscale]

^^ If you like sniping, buy it. Everyone talking ♥♥♥♥ just sucks.

I think the AI is perfect. If your buddy gets his head blown off you're going to be looking for someone, so don't expect to kill and then crawl past the guys right next to them. The grass is excellent camouflage when they aren't look for you.

[beno639345]

Any game like real life would suck. Do you want to be completely immobilized after a pistol shot to the leg? There are some things that just can't be realistic.
I agree with you, if people wanted this game to be a realistic as possible they would have to sit through every day activities eating , drinking , pissing , cleaning the weapon.

and it would take the fun out of the game by being shot once and u cant walk anymore.
they have added some realistic elements in this game and they seem a bit of, but its a 30$ game so i thing you have done alright.

[Tearjerker]

Just one simple thing: Do you really expect a 30$ game to be perfect when 60$ ones aren't perfect either?

[poontangcream]

i dont care about the price.
a game is a game, its a product and i expect it to work.
i spent as much on several other games - some cheap ones that work, expensive ones that dont, cheap ones that dont and expensive ones that do.

price is not justification for not producing an end result that works for the intended audience.

i am speaking from en ex dev experience, and yes, deadlines and problems arise, and yes i worked on some ♥♥♥♥ titles, released in frankly ♥♥♥♥ty states.
i didnt have control over that, other people in other companies and departments did [producers, distributors, bean counters, etc you name it - anyone but the people actually making the games]

but, i dont want my experience and knowledge to be an excuse for a product that doesnt work.

on an end note, i like this game, but its buggy and needs fixes.

on another side note, games like OFP and AA model in 'damage/injuries' that impair your performance, as indicative of you being hit. still far from realistic it does show that attention does get paid to aspects of this in other games. OFP also deals with long ranges btw.

[Mr. Saturday]

i dont care about the price.
a game is a game, its a product and i expect it to work.

It DOES work.

I can't see what the problem is. Stealth segments in first person shooters inherently sort of suck, and I think the game did a good job of balancing it out with the proper AI and the awareness meter. Although, on that note, I could stand the UI elements to be a bit larger and not scale down with resolution - I play at 1280 and it's a bit of a pain in the butt keeping track of everything.

But back to the enemies - the AI works exactly as I'd expect it to. I'm okay at keeping stealth, but using the noisy guns tends to attract attention, and, well, I'm a fan of the SVD in any game I can find it, so, there you have it. Needless to say, I have to snipe under pressure a lot. But that's turned out to be what I'm enjoying most about the game - sniping under pressure.

For people trying to keep stealth, there are a few little things I've noticed.

-If the bullet passes through a guy and ricochets off of something nearby, it seems like nearby enemies will hear the ricochet and go on alert. I haven't confirmed this, however.
-Sprinting does genuinely have use for stealth. If you're rushing from cover to cover it's invaluable. (This especially helps on the Sneak Through The Camp segment.)
-In the event you do get discovered at long range, take cover. They never shoot what they can't see, and eventually they let their guard down.
-In the event you take hits, don't use up all your med juice right away. Your health, at least in Easy mode, can regenerate up to 30 HP, and a single shot doesn't take away that much at all.
-Survey an area before taking a shot. Training your scope on a baddie long enough makes him appear on your radar.

Anyways, I'm enjoying this game - for people whining about bugs, this is usually why you wait a couple weeks for patches to come out before buying a game, unless you're like me and bugs don't irritate you. :P

[novafaen]

using the noisy guns tends to attract attentionI found no difference at all of what gun you used. Hit a guard with silencer or not will trigger the surrounding guards dependent on who you shoot at.

As for the game, found it quite buggy, but it took me two evenings to complete which is pretty good considering all games that is released today that have about 1.5-2h game play.

The game was all in all pretty much what I expected. I'll give it two major patches and the multiplayer will be good, by then the game should be worth what I payed, hopefully.

[Mr. Saturday]

I found no difference at all of what gun you used. Hit a guard with silencer or not will trigger the surrounding guards dependent on who you shoot at.

It's sort of a weird thing for me using silencers. Like I said, I THINK if the bullet ricochets off of something it will attract more attention, but I'm not sure. I've had some pretty good luck with it myself. Either way, I'm sure there are other factors.

[poontangcream]

It DOES work.
i'm not saying the game doesn't at all - did you not read my post to the end?

i think, i am speaking in general terms, hence the reference to price and expecting 'a product' to work.
i've played and finished the game, and i'm pretty much just playing the MP - there isnt alot of replayability to the SP side imho.

and yes, bugs do annoy me.

and no, i dont like waiting for bugs to be ironed out - that should - ideally - have been done before the game went gold.
the worst for this, in my recent experience, iirc is Empire: Total War which is still majorly buggy despite oodles of patches and bug fixes, several months down the line - maybe even a year [i cant be bothered to check] - but i dont think its credible for the average user to be asked to 'wait' until the game is patched after its release before they actually buy it.

[Mr. Saturday]

i'm not saying the game doesn't at all - did you not read my post to the end?

i think, i am speaking in general terms, hence the reference to price and expecting 'a product' to work.
i've played and finished the game, and i'm pretty much just playing the MP - there isnt alot of replayability to the SP side imho.

and yes, bugs do annoy me.

and no, i dont like waiting for bugs to be ironed out - that should - ideally - have been done before the game went gold.
the worst for this, in my recent experience, iirc is Empire: Total War which is still majorly buggy despite oodles of patches and bug fixes, several months down the line - maybe even a year [i cant be bothered to check] - but i dont think its credible for the average user to be asked to 'wait' until the game is patched after its release before they actually buy it.

But it will happen. Anyone who's played PC games for more than a year knows that. In a perfect world, games would be released flawlessly, but that *never happens*, because this is not a perfect world. I'm not saying that it's not the producer's responsibility to make sure that it doesn't, but it happens, every time. I don't see the point, if bugs truly irritate you, in banging your head against the wall by buying every new PC release the very day it comes out. If you absolutely must do that, then set the game aside for a while until it does get patched. I don't know why you're talking about bugs in another game that have existed for a year when this game hasn't even been out a week. It's not unreasonable to ask for someone to have a little patience as far as a friggin' video game is concerned. It's small potatoes. Play something else till it's fixed to your liking, and if it isn't, well, live and learn. You've probably made worse buys before, and you'll make bad ones in the future. It's not a big deal.

[poontangcream]

still doesn't sound like you read my previous post - shall i reiterate? i do like it, and i am playing it.
understood?
there is no head banging - its buggy and needs fixes [and i'm pointing them out as i go along] - i didn't say i'm having a tantrum and throwing things out of the window.
i also said i'm an ex dev and so therefore i have a little behind the scenes knowledge too, so i also know how frustrating things can be, on both sides of the wall as it were.

seems to be the bigger deal here is being made by you about my short post that was simply to do with expecting things to work, and in reference to another post that seemed to indicate the expectation of a product working equating to the price you pay for it, which i decided to post about - thats all.
calm down.

[Tearjerker]

Even WoW, a game where millions of people are paying per month to play, have bugs in it, and it's out for 5 years now.

[poontangcream]

and..?
E:TW, as i had said, was merely an example of a personal experience. That game too has sold lots and is popular.

doesn't change the fact that people would *prefer* their games to come bug-free, does it?

what, am i saying something radical?? i haven't said this game is awful, have i? have people lost the ability to read? i said i like it and i'm playing it. lol

[Melanism]

I like some elements of gameplay.
Other elements, like the fact that in stage one when your support sniper says "You're good to go" and as soon as he says that, three guys start shooting you, even if you don't move and are completely hidden, just makes me say wtf...so much for stealth.
Crawling around two yards away from the enemy is not my idea of a sniper game.

[Greyscale]

I will admit sometimes the AI pisses me off. I wish I could snipe a guy when no one is looking at him and get away with it, but it seems like anyone in a certain radius goes on alert and usually sees me.

Another tip for stealth; snipe in the head, or they let out a cry when shot.

[watermonger]

I find that stealth is impossible, even when noone is on alert, when I move, regardless of cover (aside from buildings), distance, and stance, the AI will see me

[Greyscale]

Well if you are standing then they will see you, but if you are crouching or prone and NO ONE (it only takes one bastard) is alerted then they will only become alerted if you go in their direct line of sight for too long, stand, or kill someone.

Stealth definitely works though and if what you said is true then we're playing different games.

[watermonger]

Well if you are standing then they will see you, but if you are crouching or prone and NO ONE (it only takes one bastard) is alerted then they will only become alerted if you go in their direct line of sight for too long, stand, or kill someone.

Stealth definitely works though and if what you said is true then we're playing different games.

Nope, it doesnt work at all for me.

[poontangcream]

stealth can work a bit silly though - like when i was in view of a patrol, the visible bar went up, bt all i had to do was move behind a jeep and it went down and they didnt care to investigate, even though i was in full view a second ago.

the funniest is when i can hide behind a 2 inch metal pylon - clearly a human, with kit and a large rifle is not completely hidden by such a thing - but i was. however, one nudge to the right or left and i was fully visible again...

i think as someone else said, in the beginning the stealth didnt seem to work, but much later on it did.

also, its scripted in the game for you to be visible as well, so you get them chasing after you...

[Arngrim]

It's not a bad game, i just wish they had gone fo the Sniper Elite route, rather then the Call of Duty route.

Also, this would have had awesome Co-op. At least i'd hope they had a MP mode, where you are in teams of 2, one spotter and one sniper, and you have to take out the others.

Also, why is it that the assault rifles in the game, can't hit anything at 1 meter? aim and putt 10 bullets in a guys head, and he doesn't even notice it.

[nimrodblack]

Its not aweful...

But, I have lots of the same issues. I expected to have to glass around a lot more to find targets. I expected well over 1000m to be average. I expected to crank in wind-age.

The average Marine can put rounds in a man sized target at 500yards (457~ meters) with a piece of ♥♥♥♥ M16 that rattles when you run with it using iron sights that are not conducive to long distance shots.

At my current point in the storyline the only thing a trained person would need a scope for was to hit that guy on the escaping boat. And i was pretty disappointed in how much run and gun there has been in the story. Its a sniper game....let me snipe.

and snipe means 1000m plus not under 100m.

[Verwandlung]

Thank you for pointing out these (major) flaws, you just saved me from wasting 30€ :-)

[StingingVelvet]

I quite liked the demo... bought the game, quite like it too.

On the sneaking front one this to really remember is that hiding in a bush loses all its effectiveness basically when you are seen. Once seen and that meter is climbing, the best thing to do is break the line of sight.

[cyborg3ero]

I also agree with the OP, with all the points he states, even the bullet drop is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Also where is my spotter? Don't snipers have a fellow with special binoculars that give info to the main sniper?

The game AI is horrible - end of story

After you miss the general in the first mission: ALL the guards are pro snipers with auto detect, and some soldiers were shooting the floor and I was being hit. Changing sniping positions has no effect whatsoever

I deleted the game after the first mission, just because it was not a sniper based game. The slow bullet time is glitched with the bullet backtracked and moved funny.

[jiminator]

bah, I enjoyed the game.
part of making it work is figuring out the mechanics.

1) no arrows = invisible, you can sneak in bush without being seen
2) red arrow = person on alert, if they have a line of sight to you regardless of cover they will aim in your direction then call out some 2 seconds later.
3) there are always extra invisible people that NEVER go on alert
4) if someone sees someone die they will call out an alert
5) you have a creep bar, if it starts to fill, move out of the line of sight

[Product]

I didn't even finish the first mission.

After taking the shot on the target (with a silenced rifle; from the bushes, wearing a Ghillie Suit, from distance) and having every enemy in the base know my EXACT position, made me realise this is not the game I thought I was buying.

And unless I'm mistaken; it's running on the same engine as CoD4?

[novafaen]

And unless I'm mistaken; it's running on the same engine as CoD4?you are; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrome_Engine

Call of Duty 4 runs on Infinity Ward's own engine "IW Engine"

[Product]

you are; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrome_Engine

Call of Duty 4 runs on Infinity Ward's own engine "IW Engine"

Ahh yep so it is; although I think I'm thinking of CoD3 actually (which runs on Treyarch NGL anyway).

[StingingVelvet]

I love the Chrome engine actually... Bound in Blood is an amazing looking game for its performance.

[Dutchie56]

this game is far from finishd, so many blind borders, where you can t get trough while your bullets can!! Shame they brought it on the market this way.
Oh hold your breath while aiming by pressing left shift makes u a little less drunk and watch the red dot!!! Single player is far too short and the multiplayer is terrible!!

[StingingVelvet]

this game is far from finishd, so many blind borders, where you can t get trough while your bullets can!! Shame they brought it on the market this way.
Oh hold your breath while aiming by pressing left shift makes u a little less drunk and watch the red dot!!! Single player is far too short and the multiplayer is terrible!!

It is a budget game though... City Interactive does a lot of these short, rough around the edges games. If you really love FPS games they're worth the $20 to blow through in a weekend... if you don't, you probably shouldn't buy them.

[DarkFenix]

Except they're not marketing it at a budget price. It's £30 here in the UK, full retail price.

[Product]

30 Squid for this game? Sheesh.
Wasn't so bad for us Aussies - $30USD; still too much though.

[novafaen]

I mostly agree with most posters here, but remember that many (I would almost say most) games are released unfinished.

I recall how annoyed I was when I bought Battle Field: Bad Company 2 for my PC. The single player looked good, and worked fairly good. Though, It was HEAVY scripted, just like Sniper: Ghost Warrior. The writing and story telling was just plain bad. It kept taking the controllers from you, sometime let you play/run 10m between cutscenes. The single player was just awful (if you don't think so, you are a fanboy).

On top of this, the menus was not at all finished, and it still needs work after what, maybe three major patches?

I miss the old days when games was released finished, and the companies patched them instead of this new money driven DLC!

Considering this, I would give City Interactive a couple of months before complaining too much about bugs and little content; it's unfortunately how the industry works these times :(

[XtremeDogg]

I think it copies "Sniper Elite" bullet spins and all... really nothing new here then a bargin game.

[StingingVelvet]

Except they're not marketing it at a budget price. It's £30 here in the UK, full retail price.

Well... it's not worth that, certainly. It's $30 for some reason on Steam here, and it's not worth that either... boxed retail is the normal City Interactive price of $20 though, which is how I got it.

[Tearjerker]

Steam isn't free, they take a cut.

[Zukabazuka]

I don't like how his heartbeat was up in 80 beats per minute, while in prone and haven't moved for a while. Isn't that kinda bad? Shouldn't it normally be around 60beats? and then just jogging for a short time it spikes to 100 beats.

You need to be trained to be able to move up on a rope pretty good, and his heart seems kinda bad right there.

[Tom Baumker]

I think it copies "Sniper Elite" bullet spins and all... really nothing new here then a bargin game.

You mangae to insult Sniper Elite by putting them in the same forum as this. 10 fold better game and actually has an AI that works reasonably well. I wasted my $29.00 US, hope people read these threads and save their money...If you want a reference, I have been around a long time and played many FPS games, this reminds me of 1980's...sad that Steam would even offer it but then again it's all about the money...

[hammerman47]

Sry boys and girls.. I got 7 hrs fun out of the game...sure the ai's have perfect vision but they cant see if there dead. I only had a few probs sneaking round em.. no biggy and please dont hate me but i loved it :/

[iOwnYou]

Because I certainly do. I am basically venting frustration over the game, but my problems with the game are far from unreasonable.

1) The AI has magic X-ray vision. The tutorial makes a point of telling you to hide in bushes, yet in actual play the AI simply sees through bushes 90% of the time.

2) The AI has magic bullets. Another game where the AI is magically accurate through dense visual cover at an absurd range.

3) Stealth mechanics are arbitrary and possibly broken by design. Ok, so here's an example of what I mean. First mission, after the explosion screws your shot. The enemies are alert but haven't seen you, in fact they clearly have no idea snipers are present, but they all look in your direction and your direction alone. Furthermore, certain guards can be eliminated (I used quickloading to test it out) but certain guards if eliminated will arbitrarily trigger all the area's enemies to instantly know your location.

4) Sniper rifles are terrible. Bullet drop at 50 metres? Please. And I'm no stranger to scope sway, but this guy's scope dances around like he's drunk during an earthquake. Oh and on the same lines as bullet drop at absurdly short ranges? Let's also talk bullet travel time at short ranges.

5) The game seems determined at every stage to stop me having fun. For starters the example from point 3, I had the opportunity to stealthily eliminate most, if not all, of the enemies in the area, but the game's design steals that fun away immediately. A mission or two on, I'm supposed to provide sniper support for Delta 3's assault, what do I get to do? Shoot 3 immobile enemy snipers then it's called off and I don't get to do anything fun.

I only played as far as the oil rig level (which was the last straw, I mean, a level where you're not even a sniper, and stealth is not an option at all), but I gave the game a few chances after it determinedly screwed up every level in turn. This game has potential to be great, but awful AI, weapons, level design and stealth mechanics ruin it completely.

Most of these are true except the scope sway. I've played some of it, and you can "focus" similarly to holding your breath in COD if you press and hold shift while scoped in.

[Fl4k]

Nope, I love it. Having a blast! (other than the guys who whine like little girls)

[Evil Kerek]

Yes the bots are a bit super vision but think to real life, its not hard to see a camo guy in some plants , if they just shot somone and you look hard enough.

Dude, you need to watch sniper school on the military channel.

Seriously.

[ArcAngel33]

Nope, I love it. Having a blast!Indeed, people seem to miss the point. You need ruthlessly observant AI or else people will just run and gun their way through, bypassing the entire experience the devs are trying to create. This game does stealth better than Conviction (which is still a great game IMHO) and the satisfaction when sneaking past enemies and quietly taking out opposition is fantastic. Sometimes you get yourself into inescapable situations, you simply have to load an earlier game and approach it differently, that's all.

It should be lauded for its attempt at realism; you can't just rambo your way into a camp and expect to survive or drop a body ten feet away from another enemy and expect that it won't make a sound. If anything, I'd rather more realism. A guard gasping out when he dies has a greater chance of alerting others thus forcing you to target specific body areas to minimize noise.

It's a hearken back to oldschool games like Rainbow 6 and Chaos Theory where the gameplay doesn't get all hand-holdy and forgiving, doing everything for you: You screw up, you reload.

[RendiaX]

I haven't really had any of these issues at all and I'm already through half the game and haven't been spotted once because of "Bad AI", but because of my own actions. I've had more fun with this one than most other FPS games. Maybe it's because it actually requires you to think for a bit before every action if you want to stay hidden.

1. Stay on your belly and keep still if they look at you. The ghillie suit isn't an invisibility cloak. If you move when someone is watching the area(red arrow on map), you will be spotted. it also doesn't work in just any grass, it needs to be fairly thick and you need to blend in with everything around you including your background... In other words, if I'm correct, hiding in a otherwise useful patch of grass with a gray rock wall behind you will make you stand out.

2. If you need to get from cover to cover across an open area look around first. If the coast is clear crawl anyways, if there is a guy that just turned his head run and kiss the ground as soon as you hit cover. If you see no opening, backtrack and find another route.

3. Don't go killing every guy in sight. People make noise when they die by bullet, be it a yell or a thud as they hit the ground, and any person near by that isn't deaf will hear it. A silenced weapon does not mean EZ kills. If you must kill them do it when they are alone while you are in very good cover. Also, if there is a pair, taking them both out very quick will save you from alerting the rest of the camp so long as they are far enough away.

and that's about all the tips i can think of at the moment that haven't already been said.

I'm not saying the game is perfect by any means. There are a number of issues that I agree with such as the huge number of invisible walls and areas you can't pass while prone, the AI's ability to pick you out so well at long distances, and multi player needs a lot of work. The AI however, i see no real issue with and can't help wondering how many of the people crying "Bad AI" just don't want to admit they find the game hard or don't even try to stop and think about their actions for more than a second. You wanted a realistic game so start thinking realistically and not about what has worked in every other FPS you have played.

[Product]

It's a hearken back to oldschool games like Rainbow 6...

Rainbow 6, the original, had better AI and it was released in '98.

[poontangcream]

Rainbow 6, the original, had better AI and it was released in '98.

dozens of games, then and now, are better than this game.

people compare it to cod/mw/etc, but i think those games are no better than this, imho - the original ghost recon, rainbow 6 early series, ofp and arma had stealth and tactical application nailed better than this.
the early splinter cell series has better stealth than this.

i consider this no more an arcade shooter than cod/mw/etc or the bf series.

and for all those saying its ok for the price, it is full price here in the uk.

thats usd$46 !!

so no, it isnt a budget game at budget price!


i tweaked with the ai settings and its obvious that certain npc's in the game are actually scripted to see you - they dont behave as standard game ai.

[Blade01]

Hey creamy, i'd love to tweak the ai settings too, tell me, how did you do it?

[ranger052]

WHAT about eyefinity?? this game doent work with eyefinity COME ONNNNNN we are in 2010 WE USE 3 MONITORSSSSS DAMN 30 DOLLARSS for nothing

[Acid Burn NL]

I just finished the game. I found the game to be.. ok.. I had high hopes before it came out. Oh well. The end was very dissapointing though.. just "The End"... seriously..wtf.. they couldn't be bothered to create an endscene/epilogue?

[Kincaid]

WHAT about eyefinity?? this game doent work with eyefinity COME ONNNNNN we are in 2010 WE USE 3 MONITORSSSSS DAMN S for nothing

I can't say I'm surprised by this. First off, the game is from City Interactive. When I think of big name blockbuster releasing developers I do not think of City Interactive. Secondly, big name games frequently get released without Eyefinity support so Sniper: Ghost Warrior not having it most definitely shouldn't be a shock. Some games get released without the support and add it in a future patch.

For a list of Eyefinity Validated and Eyefinity Ready games refer here: http://support.amd.com/us/eyefinity/Pages/eyefinity-software.aspx. The list appears up-to-date since All Points Bulletin was just released and is listed. Nonetheless, look at just how short the lists are considering the enormity of the number of games that exist. That list is definitely short.

Btw, I'm not saying Eyefinity support wouldn't be nice and it'd be great if it was but it's not shocking that the support wasn't there on release. Hopefully City Interactive will add it but I won't hold my breath.

[Racou]

Ever actually tried to pick out a ghillie suit in a square kilometre of vegetation? It's not easy even up close. At long range it's nigh impossible.

just reading reviews to see if I want to buy. In reference to what is said here, I read an article about a real life sniper in a quality magazine (people? hard to remember now) and he said it is REALLY hard to find a man in a guillie suit. Once someone was looking for him, walked up to him so close he could have kissed him! And no..he didn't knife him. Can't remember why but he wanted to stay invisible.

Just retelling a real life story for those who haven't read about it.

Peace,

Racou

[RageMonkey]

Wish I would have read the forums before I bought. I've found that nearly all the complaints here are true for me as well. The game really, really, really sux.

I own dozens of games from STEAM...as I recall...there have only been 2 purchases that I've regretted...and both were bought w/o research and all on hype (this and Majesty 2).

=== DO NOT BUY THIS GAME!! ===

This game is full of shortcomings. It is NOTHING like the marketing trailer.

[vqsnapp]

I find this game frustrating and disappointing, and both for the same reason. This isn't really a sniping game, if I'm a sniper in the jungle why would I sneak THROUGH a village full of guards when I could just go around? A couple of times I tried flanking or not going the "scripted" route I guess and got blocked by invisible walls.

I agree with everything the OP said as well, one section of the game when you are planting things at the plantations or whatever you have no choice but to go down one path. I stuck to the grass and bushes, was crouched and moving slowly, my waypoint was something like 180 meters away when I started taking fire from guards dead ahead that I couldn't see AT ALL until I saw a tiny bit of their red glow through the 4 bushes between me and them. I had to use my scope fully zoomed to see that little bit of red glow yet they spotted me before I even crested the hill and knew there was a base there. Its pretty lame. That's when I quit the game and actually came here to see a lot of people with the same opinions as me. Wish I had done that before purchase.

[Zarunil]

I'm glad I didn't buy this!

[swaaye]

Crysis models some levels of bullet physics. Is the precision rifle of Crysis a more realistic simulation?

[Bartholo]

Agree with the OP. Its a pile of Horses-it!

IGN.com Editorial:

“…hugely satisfying, especially for gamers that enjoy sniping in first-person shooters.”

HA HA HA

Gamespot.com:
“In game terms, stealth is a big part of Sniper's challenge. Because many of the missions take place in the Amazon jungle, there will often be plenty of thick vegetation to hide in.”

SNICKER SNICKER

Destructoid.com:
“Blending elements from many different shooters and stealth games, Sniper: Ghost Warrior ties everything together through the theme of shooting people from a distance.”
“…Oddly, it was the fact that enemies can actually see you and respond realistically that was the most impressive element to Sniper: Ghost Warrior.”
“The great thing about Sniper: Ghost Warrior is that the “vision cone” of the game is insanely huge, so even though you might be hundreds of feet away from an enemy, they are more than capable of seeing you through a crack in a fence, or from across a canyon. It's a weird little element of the game that I found to be very impressive, something that was oddly realistic.”

What can you say? Simply LOLOLOLOL

Saves the best one till last...

Sniper: Ghost Warrior delivers an extended stealth game play experience that challenges players with a variety of strategic and tactical choices that affect how they approach their objectives and eliminate their targets.

Key features:

The most realistic sniping experience in a video game ever, right down to managing your breathing for increased accuracy of sniper shots
Enjoy a fully realistic ballistic system that accounts for bullet trajectory, including bullet drop and environmental effects such as wind, fog & rain


^^^LIES LIES LIES ^^^

[NC37]

What did you all expect. Really its $30 and its using the Chrome engine. If thats the same engine Chrome uses then it was doomed from day 1. City Interactive is also not a powerhouse company. I admit I enjoyed their Combat Wings game but aside from that, I haven't seen reason to go nuts on anything they make. No matter how the teaser shots look, if you want to be sure of your money, don't preorder or initial release buy except from blockbuster franchises.

[Saijin_Naib]

What exactly is wrong with the Chrome Engine?