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darth_brush
12-19-2010, 04:42 AM
hold your horses. we speed up the gates a bit and also did some nav-scripts to make it even without iteams "makeable" :P.

at the first gate (#1 in map 4) i used a timed button with a "closing" sign. so you see how long it takes. also you dont have to be so carefully by holding this button.

what we did so far for the DC is:

Map 1 Anna is gone (gas station map)
- created a new intro. it looks a bit like our stylized credit trailer: http://www.moddb.com/mods/dead-before-dawn/videos/dead-before-dawn-team-credits#imagebox
- deleted all explosion enities at the blocked tunnel, because some ppl get hurt there.
- colored many props darker cause we had some lighting props
- added a HUGE sign to warn player of the chopper blades :P

Map 2 The Mall
- colored all props in the safehouse cause they were also lighting
- made some delays shorter cause ppl had to wait too long (like opening doors etc.)
- added in dead end areas some gifts :P
- changed the lighting a bit in some areas

i just need to make some sounds louder, cause the zombies screaming like hell sometimes.

Map 3 Clean up
- added a moving camera for the toilette scene
- added more hints for player to know where to go
- added timed button on gate 1
- speed up gate 2
- did nav scripts

Map 4 Undead Center
SURPRISE! but if you dont liked the 1 millionst gate event, then you will hate this map :P

Map 5 New Dawn
- fixed some navs problems
- also fixed some delays in the escape script

Stagger Lee
12-19-2010, 06:41 AM
I had several versus matches since release of L4D 2 version now.
What I suggest changing is the button mechanic of the 1st gate closing map 4. It's easy for the infected to disturb the "button presser" constantly. He won't get to close the gate fence. You just need to attack one after another as SI. Dont attack all together as SI. They have like 5 good spots where they can pull it off. The 3 air vents, behind the hut and from the weapons corner. You dont need very good players to stop the survivors there, you just need to attack one after one only the "button presser".
The last time I played in a public regular versus game with strangers, both sides pulled this off and stopped the survivors with around 160 points in map 4 only.
Whatsmore bad of this is that this event takes place after only 20% of the 4th map which is a great map with tons of stuff to see. It's sad that you can stop the survivors so easily so early.

I'd make the button a "one press" button instead of constantly pressing.
Maybe you think about that point.


We have managed to get the gate closed the last 4 times we played this and we are playing in all friends games (good players on both sides) in Realism VS.

One player in each of the vents, one player handling the gate and one player right next to him keeping zombies off of him with a combination on a melee weapon and a sniper rifle. The two players in the vents are helping to cover them by keeping a eye behind the hut.

It isn't easy but it's certainly do-able. I'd like this event to stay as is because it's one of those map areas that seperates organized teams from teams that just run around in a panic shootting anything that moves or doesn't move.

CosmicD
12-19-2010, 01:02 PM
I think it's more about the mechanics themself than real "changes". Because with the timed button you can even look around and stuff, because its handling mechanic is different than a "local button" you have to focus on.

With the speed up of the second gates we would like to hopefully relax the frustration ppl have with that event a bit.

And I'm working on the new map's crescendo event to find the right rythm to it which is cruical for such a type event that we do.

engineer123
12-20-2010, 01:29 AM
We have managed to get the gate closed the last 4 times we played this and we are playing in all friends games (good players on both sides) in Realism VS.

One player in each of the vents, one player handling the gate and one player right next to him keeping zombies off of him with a combination on a melee weapon and a sniper rifle. The two players in the vents are helping to cover them by keeping a eye behind the hut.

It isn't easy but it's certainly do-able. I'd like this event to stay as is because it's one of those map areas that seperates organized teams from teams that just run around in a panic shootting anything that moves or doesn't move.

dont want start an arguement but just play it in public games no matter if reg vs or rvs, this tactic won't be understand or wont be executed right.
I also made the gate 1 closing weeks ago in a friends only game.
But the authors should question themselves:
"Do we want this event to be so difficult that it needs a friends only game and the knowledge of a specific positioning of the players?"
I stay by my opinion that the button should be a "one press" button in versus.

CosmicD
12-20-2010, 03:21 AM
we actually had considered that. At first it seems a bit elitist to have such events where certain tactics" seem to be the only way to make it trough. But you have to take 2 factors into account

- The stock campaigns are mostly run, shoot, hit button, wait for crescendo to end and run again. Part of the reason why so many rage quit in versus is that they can see just how things are going to turn out in certain areas because of clear cut strategy.

I was often thinking "hmm, players should be able to play it with bots from beginning to end easily" when I created the crescendo's, but the bots are so bad that when you do that, the game is going to be way too easy for expert players who will have no challenge in the game anymore.

Also the zombie apocalypse shouldn't be always about this ruleset that rewards players for just making it. There should be some dangers from the environment too to make it unexpected.

We have so many icons and instructors showing what's going on at the gate event. You can go out but not too far, you can use the weapon shop key to your advantage. It's just a take on what our zombie apocalypse looks like.

In versus, we would like to enforce valve's idea that "survivors arn't supposed to make it to the safehouse". In l4d2 it's more of e matter of distance traveled than survivors in the safehouse bonus, so why not sculpt the gameplay around that ? Players are so damn used making it to the safehouse all the time that it's seen as "strange" if people should strand somewhere else ?

Before the version went public we already made sure that the "nightmare room" is disabled, because it would be a bit stupid to just take vs players hostage there with this event.

Now in the director's cut version, we would like to try with a 15% faster gate + no spitters (and maybe no smokers, because playtests will have to rule that out). Because it's understandable that one shouldn't deliberately "trap" players in situations where there is almost definitely no way out. But with the zero tolerance on spitter rotation in that area, i think "skill" is the only means left to get trough the gate event. Because that area is so sensitive to "exploits" from these 2 infected but we really want to keep it.

engineer123
12-20-2010, 04:48 AM
I think it's more about the mechanics themself than real "changes". Because with the timed button you can even look around and stuff, because its handling mechanic is different than a "local button" you have to focus on.


Did I understand it right that you actually do change the button for the 1st? and/or 2nd gate closing?


What I like to point out is that this "constant button" only "bothers" me in versus, not in coop. It's fine in coop even in expert because the AI SI aren't so clever to pull off the right tactic.

Glass_Shatters
12-20-2010, 06:38 AM
Question. There is no ammo in the finale safe room. Is there a reason for this? I'd like to refill my laser sighted weapons you give us in map 4 (if you use the key card to go back and get them) but by time you get to the safe room in map 4 after a few hordes and normally a tank the gun is almost out of ammo and yeah.

darth_brush
12-20-2010, 11:32 AM
oh, sorry! we forgotten to add it. noobish, i know :P

Bindal
12-20-2010, 11:34 AM
Acutally, I find that a nice twist giving the players a choice. Either they keep their weapon but have low to no ammo (if they didn't conserve it) OR they pick a new one, but might loose some upgrades they had.

CosmicD
12-20-2010, 11:40 AM
it's the "player might want to use the same weapon" twist that I actually forgot. We were all like, yeah why does there always have to be ammon in the safehouse ? Maybe we can place it somewhere else:). BUt if you think of it, people are used to using their own trusted type of weapon that they find and it's maybe not so cool to mess with that...

darth_brush
12-20-2010, 11:54 AM
I thought people murdered kittens each day so we had to be carefully with ammo. :P

Zora-Link
12-20-2010, 12:07 PM
I don't get the difficulty people have with the map. Listen to the radio guy (Can't remember his name right now) and you'll be fine. Only part that I was dumb about was going "Hey guys, I wonder what happens if you wander out-" dead. This was at the 1 millionth event, before starting the radio so he didn't warn me. :p

Bindal
12-20-2010, 12:11 PM
I don't get the difficulty people have with the map. Listen to the radio guy (Can't remember his name right now) and you'll be fine. Only part that I was dumb about was going "Hey guys, I wonder what happens if you wander out-" dead. This was at the 1 millionth event, before starting the radio so he didn't warn me. :p
Actually, Andy (not CJ, who's usually talking with you) DID told you that you get shot.

Okay, I can help you guys. I've got plenty of guns and ammo here. I can shoot the infected hanging around the outside of the mall but don't come out yourself, it's hard to tell the difference between them and you.

darth_brush
12-21-2010, 09:58 AM
Yeah, Hank or lets call him CJ is the mall security. Andy is a hommage of the "Dawn of the Dead" character, the gun shop keeper.

Zora-Link
12-21-2010, 12:52 PM
Actually, Andy (not CJ, who's usually talking with you) DID told you that you get shot.

Yeah, but he doesn't mention it until AFTER you use the radio at the door. I was busy exploring, then all of the sudden WTFOMGINSTANTLYDEAD. I saw the little barrier as I died, so it didn't do much. :p Then, after coming out of the rescue closet:

"Hey, don't go outside guys, or you'll get blasted in the face."

darth_brush
12-21-2010, 08:17 PM
hmmm, maybe we should do there for survivors just a trigger_push to push them back and make a shot-sound. so it would look like andy shoting players and they go a bit back. :P

CosmicD
12-22-2010, 09:30 AM
perhaps it's better yes. Because even all the icons and instructors doesn't seem to create a sense of carefulness around that area... But I guess it would only be a better experience for those players that don't like to be careful :)

Alt
12-28-2010, 04:26 AM
B.T.W Great job darth brush best add on ever, hope you wil make more in the future plus rep 4 you

darth_brush
12-28-2010, 10:53 AM
thanks!

here you go, our teaser for the upcoming Dead before Dawn DC:
http://www.moddb.com/mods/dead-before-dawn/videos
or
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15qwMH073dM

Stagger Lee
12-28-2010, 10:57 AM
Darth and CosmicD, are you folks going to be making any new campaigns?

darth_brush
12-28-2010, 02:45 PM
we have no plans for a new campaign.

SalsaNChips
12-31-2010, 03:11 PM
I can get the doors to close in the mall, but not the gate. Sitting there holding the button does nothing; gate doesn't come down. Lights on panel indicate gate not closed but again, it won't activate. Tried it first time, quit, reloaded level, tried it again, same problem. I am playing single player with bots. Is this a bug in the game scripting and if so is it being fixed in the "Directors Cut" version I just read about earlier in this thread?

darth_brush
01-03-2011, 11:58 AM
well, it should work. at the second gate you first have to call andy over the walkie talkie then close the gates.

anyway, we did a little update about the upcoming Directors cut version:

http://www.moddb.com/mods/dead-before-dawn

CosmicD
01-08-2011, 03:39 AM
These are the final release notes for the director's cut version of Dead Before Dawn (only for left 4 dead 2) which we will release on january 26th:

Changes final list: for dbd2 Version 4 (Director's cut)


Citylights map (1) removed: Anna is gone is now map 1
New map: Undead Center added as map 4
New loadingscreen
Fixed 3/4 version of the loading screen showing the outrosreen

Map 1 Anna is gone:


Created a new intro similar to our stylized credit trailer
Deleted all explosion enities at the blocked tunnel, because some ppl get hurt there.
Colored many props darker cause we had some lighting props
Added a HUGE sign to warn player of the chopper blades
First half of the map has now only t1 weapons
Weapon spawn density increased by .500 pts to provide more weapons in the beginning of the map
Magnum pistol spawns

Map 2 The Mall:


Colored all props in the safehouse cause they were also lighting
Equalized mall supply door opening event with approximate crescendo duration
Added some gifts in dead end areas
Changed the lighting in some areas

Map 3 Clean up:



Added a slightly moving camera for the toilet scene
Added more hints for player to know where to go
The west gate "hold buttons" event is optimized to avoid glitchy button syndrome when playing on high ping servers
North gate speed increased by 15%
Nav optimization
Empty battlefield to ease up too much zombies during north gate event
Versus measures to ease up north gate event (director script adaptations)
1 more "event salvation" item in the locked gun shop

Map 4 Undead Center:



SURPRISE! but if you didn't like the 1 millionst gate event, then you will hate this map :P


Map 5 New Dawn:



Ammo in the start saferoom
Fixed some nav problems
Fixed FinaleEscapeVehicleReadyForSurvivors trigger delay (bots didnt get to rescue vehicle nav)
Finale hordes are slightly bigger

Thechuz
02-01-2011, 06:25 AM
Where is it? D:

CosmicD
02-01-2011, 06:30 AM
we wait 2 weeks untill i hate mountains had their prime time :)

misfit410
02-01-2011, 06:36 AM
Good deal, though I don't think we can have too many great maps to play.

PsyErotica
02-01-2011, 08:12 AM
we wait 2 weeks untill i hate mountains had their prime time :)

What 2 weeks wtf? Who cares, IHM has already had their day and then some, having your campaign out now won't hurt either campaign either way. This isn't a developer waiting for another popular game to come out before releasing theirs because they are afraid it will detract sales. Both are free and why can't people play both. Just seems kind of a cop out especially when it was supposed to be released on the 26th.

CosmicD
02-14-2011, 01:11 PM
It's 2 days before release and here's our extended story trailer about the campaign:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsrFmWuuRZA

JMantis
02-14-2011, 03:27 PM
Awesome trailer! Looking forward to the release!

Stagger Lee
02-16-2011, 09:50 AM
I am DLing the new release of Dead Before Dawn Directors Cut now. http://www.l4dmaps.com/details.php?file=7774

I doubt I'll find a server that has it since it was just released but I will plow through it and see if it looks like it will be a good one for RV play.

Thanks for your obvious hard work. It is appreciated.