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XmXFLUXmX
02-24-2011, 02:50 PM
Yep, that's how disgusted I was with this reboot H&S piece of crap.

I hope those of you emotionally attached to Bioware really do enjoy this game, because if you don't get a refund by March 11th you're SOL

Now why did I cancel you may ask, here is why:

Things that I think are good about DA2:

*Fast Combat [I also liked the old system. They both can work if made right]
*The new talking wheel and the PC has a voice now

Things I don't like:

*Cliche Writing
*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there


Far to many negatives outway the positives of a $60 dollar purchase plus OP DLCs.


I'm sorry Bioware but as a long time supporter I can no longer buy your overpriced games when you completely compromise your gameplay for more money. If I did support this I would be an enabler. This is how consumers speak: with their wallets.


There is a reason why the lead designer of 10 years left Bioware and was angry enough to make a blog about why he left.

CobaltyLOLOL
02-24-2011, 02:55 PM
I didn't preorder, but I can say I won't be buying this...

x181
02-24-2011, 03:08 PM
I suppose I would have cancelled my preorder had I made one, but I've been burned many times by EA produced games to know better; what's the point when you can have it day one without preordering? No, I don't want bonus items.

Consider this changing my mind about purchasing this game until it hits the bargain bin.

Solona
02-24-2011, 03:08 PM
Alright then, have fun.

dearlyblvd
02-24-2011, 03:30 PM
I decided to edit my post because I somewhat agree with these points:
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.

Now, everything else seems kinda stupid. You didn't have the opportunity to play the entire game. How do you expect to feel emotionally attached to a character in a 40 min demo?

I also find hilarious that pretty much anyone who have been following the development of DA2 know about these things:
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.

Grumpy181155
02-24-2011, 03:39 PM
Agree wholeheartedly. Really disappointed and my views are in a seperate post. I might buy it later after it has been released for a while and I read some after action reports.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 04:05 PM
I've blindly bought every single bioware game until now. This is the first time I cancelled my order for one of their games, though I will get it in a year or twos time when its in the bargain section.

epicphail
02-24-2011, 04:16 PM
yeah think im going to pass on this one at least until they have like a GOTY edition at like $30.

Kyrue
02-24-2011, 04:16 PM
I won't be buying it either, I am really upset with how the last year and a half has gone for gamers in general. Too much DLC to pay for when I already bought the damned game!

Check out this interview:
http://thegamingliberty.com/index.php/2011/02/24/tgl-interview-dragon-age-ii-producer-fernando-melo/

Synopsis: DA2 will be shorter BUT DON'T WORRY, you can BUY MORE DLC to extend the game.....wtf?????


I'm not boycotting only DA2, but all games that take this approach, and this thread had nothing to do with swaying my opinion.

Jonny5300394
02-24-2011, 04:27 PM
I love bioware games and I have a hard time believing that all the reasons I canceled my pre-order were because of them. I believe it's because EA made them do something they didn't want to do. I still plan on buying Bioware games. Maybe. I'm tempted to start boycotting EA's games forever. After ME3. :P

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 04:34 PM
I love bioware games and I have a hard time believing that all the reasons I canceled my pre-order were because of them. I believe it's because EA made them do something they didn't want to do. I still plan on buying Bioware games. Maybe. I'm tempted to start boycotting EA's games forever. After ME3. :P

It is because of EA pushing them too much to popularise the game. If Bioware werent working for EA, this game would have never been like this, and the lead developer wouldnt have left.

x181
02-24-2011, 04:47 PM
EA has been destroying games for the past decade.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 04:53 PM
EA has been destroying games for the past decade.

Westwood Studios / Command and Conquer, Alpha Centauri (Best strategy game ever, but EA stole the rights after sacking Firaxis for it not selling enough, so Firaxis cant legally make a sequel), and now Bioware.

Best ever example of how awesome EA are.:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westwood_Studios

In August 1998, Westwood was acquired by Electronic Arts for $122.5 million in cash. At the time, Westwood had 5% to 6% of the PC game market.[1] In response to EA's buyout, many long-time Westwood employees quit and left Westwood Studios. Because of this and EA's newly imposed demands, games being developed by Westwood Studios at the time were rushed and left unfinished upon their release, namely Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun.[2] All the subsequent games developed by Westwood were also heavily subjected to increased control by Electronic Arts, with some of them being cancelled.

Along with Westwood, EA had also acquired Virgin Interactive's development studio based in Irvine, California.[1] It was managed by Westwood and became known as Westwood Pacific, and later EA Pacific. Westwood Pacific developed or co-developed games like Nox and the Command & Conquer: Red Alert's sequel Red Alert 2, which takes place in an alternate universe to that of the original title Command & Conquer. One of the last games released by Westwood, Command & Conquer: Renegade (an action game, which mixed elements from first-person shooters and real-time strategy games) failed to meet consumer expectations and commercial goals Electronic Arts had set for it. In March of 2003, Westwood Studios (along with EA Pacific) was liquidated by EA, and all willing staff were assimilated into EA Los Angeles. Their last video game was the MMORPG Earth & Beyond.

x181
02-24-2011, 05:01 PM
The best yet is EA's attempted hostile takeover of Take-Two Interactive (Rockstar Games, 2K Games).

Take-Two may have rejected Electronic Arts’ first $2 billion offer to acquire the company, but EA is trying again, this time by reaching out directly to the shareholders in a hostile takeover bid.
http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2008/03/ea-makes-2-bill/

festa_freak
02-24-2011, 05:06 PM
Nothing prior to the demo screamed at me to pre-order. Now that I've played the demo I know I will wait for a GOTY edition that is less than $30.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 05:09 PM
The best yet is EA's attempted hostile takeover of Take-Two Interactive (Rockstar Games, 2K Games).


http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2008/03/ea-makes-2-bill/

Didnt know about that one. Basically they acquire as many game studios as they can, then make unjust demands on the games they produce to be consolised and dumbed down with really short release dates.

If the game doesnt do well, EA sacks the studio and keeps the rights to the games they produced under EA.

mr138
02-24-2011, 05:09 PM
*Cliche Writing
Fair enough, although it is an opinion.
*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.
They kind of remind me of Skeletor, and that's alright by me.
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
In the first game, only you could unite the lands to combat the darkspawn.
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
We'll just have to see when dx11 is fully implemented, but I can see your point. The visuals do not quite match the requirements.
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
Yes that sucks, but keep in mind this was only a limited demo.
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
Again, we'll see in the actual game how the relationships pan out.
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
Would it matter if it was day 3 or week 4? The game is basically complete, why not work on the dlc in the weeks that remain to have it available?
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
It's certainly a more stylized combat.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
Again, a little early (and subjective) to judge that.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
Wardens are just men and women who can sense, and in turn be sense by the darkspawn. You encounter many powerful humanoid non-wardens in the game.
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
And you deciphered all this from a 40 minute demo? One that even includes mention of the wardens.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there
Maybe next time bad elevator music then, idk?

Replies in yellow.

x181
02-24-2011, 05:19 PM
Didnt know about that one. Basically they acquire as many game studios as they can, then make unjust demands on the games they produce to be consolised and dumbed down with really short release dates.

If the game doesnt do well, EA sacks the studio and keeps the rights to the games they produced under EA.

They didn't successfully takeover Take-Two, but it goes to show you what they do. You are correct. They takeover companies, dumb down the game, engage in profiteering and generate marketing hype to appeal to console kids: angst, rage, unlimited power, ridiculous action.

I would even venture to say they somehow ruined Warhammer Online.

In fact, I was surprised that EA was involved with DA:O. I initially hesitated to purchase the game for that sole reason. I did notice a shift in quality in Awakening and every DLC. Probably EA's doing.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 05:25 PM
They didn't successfully takeover Take-Two, but it goes to show you what they do. You are correct. They takeover companies, dumb down the game, engage in profiteering and generate marketing hype to appeal to console kids: angst, rage, unlimited power, ridiculous action.

I would even venture to say they somehow ruined Warhammer Online.

In fact, I was surprised that EA was involved with DA:O. I initially hesitated to purchase the game for that sole reason. I did notice a shift in quality in Awakening and every DLC. Probably EA's doing.

100% spot on. I bought DAO due to all the hype, but for me it did live up to its claim as a successor to Baldurs Gate. It felt very similar and I enjoyed that.

now they've gone and dumbed the tactical aspect out of the game, resulting in Biowares lead designer leaving, and are going massively overboard with all the preorder nonsense and DLC content (30 hour game, but hey, dont worry, you can purchase DLC!), and the marketting stunts they are pulling off are such a joke.

MulkyBros
02-24-2011, 05:33 PM
Although I didn't pre-order the game, I was deciding on whether in the future I'd buy it through pc or the 360 and I do not like the controls for the pc. Maybe it was just the rogue only but the camera wasn't moving left to right to see the battlefield. Only the 360 I tried the mage and the game is better than DA:O. Of course will wait for a GOTY on the 360. PC version needs control improvements.

The discussion of EA is pretty pointless and redundant. I mean come on people, you think for a $60 you should be able to play the game for 300 hrs. That's usually reserved for the grindfest MMO's or FPS games.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 05:36 PM
The discussion of EA is pretty pointless and redundant. I mean come on people, you think for a $60 you should be able to play the game for 300 hrs. That's usually reserved for the grindfest MMO's or FPS games.

Its not actually.

How long do proper RPGs like Elder Scrolls games last? A lot longer than DA2 is expected to.

Even DAO was a lot longer, the length of that game was perfect.

Why do you think that $60 is worth a 30 hour game?

Also are you kidding that FPS games last 300 hours? Do you know your Genres? FPS games are normally very short and only last around 20 hours.

Proper RPGs are usually a lot longer with open ended worlds and have LOTS more content for your $60.

If you only want 30 hour games, then you should be playing FPS games, not RPGs.

x181
02-24-2011, 05:38 PM
DA2 has the "Army of Two" cheapness factor to it, a trademark of EA.

OurSacrifice
02-24-2011, 05:40 PM
Nothing prior to the demo screamed at me to pre-order. Now that I've played the demo I know I will wait for a GOTY edition that is less than $30.

It's going to have to win awards for that edition to be released.....


Also are you kidding that FPS games last 300 hours? Do you know your Genres? FPS games are normally very short and only last around 20 hours.

He's talking about the endless hours spent in multiplayer. Think for like, I dunno, 10 seconds before you reply?

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 05:42 PM
I really doubt that DA2 will ever get a GOTY award lol!

I think he / she meant an ultimate edition with all the DLC content. That will be worth it, for $10.

dearlyblvd
02-24-2011, 05:43 PM
He's talking about the endless hours spent in multiplayer. Think for like, I dunno, 10 seconds before you reply?
Give him a break. Just look at his posts. You can see that he isn't very bright.

EvilDonkey
02-24-2011, 05:53 PM
I am also not going to buy it. Pretty much for the same reasons as you, plus a bit more.

My warrior now has jedi jump attack, witch removes the tactical aspect of keeping x character close to y, and a to b. I can now just jedi jump from one enemy to another.

Ok, the demo was set on normal, I couldn't change it in any way. But I had 0 problems at all. Not even close to die at any time.

Tactical view is not tactical at all. Its more like a close topdown 3rd person view. Making it pretty useless.

The art style. It, to me, feels like I am playing an Asian MMO. The Dark Spawns look like people from Final Fantasy 8 and up lol.

They say that they will release a lot more DLC for DA2. So, we have pay more for the game, buy day one DLC plus a lot more DLC to get the ending of the story? Eh, no thanks.

Ill buy the Deluxe version of it at steams December super sale, for $20 with all the DLC.

Bhavv
02-24-2011, 05:58 PM
He's talking about the endless hours spent in multiplayer. Think for like, I dunno, 10 seconds before you reply?

Give him a break. Just look at his posts. You can see that he isn't very bright.

Wow, are you two people so blind that you cant read what I was replying to?

you think for a $60 you should be able to play the game for 300 hrs. That's usually reserved for the grindfest MMO's or FPS games.

I can clearly see the 'or FPS games' right there, cant you? Wow, you must be blind, I'm sorry.

Dazzled
02-24-2011, 06:01 PM
It's going to have to win awards for that edition to be released.....



GOTY awards are most often bought, not earned. And with a pimp like EA i'm sure DA2 will get it.

Sonris89
02-24-2011, 06:05 PM
GOTY awards are most often bought, not earned. And with a pimp like EA i'm sure DA2 will get it.


Sadly true, if you are a game critic you could get fired for giving a big donator's game a bad review. Which is why Kayne and Lynch 2 almost got passed off as anything other then complete crap in some circles.

x181
02-24-2011, 06:06 PM
Sadly true, if you are a game critic you could get fired for giving a big donator's game a bad review. Which is why Kayne and Lynch 2 almost got passed off as anything other then complete crap in some circles.

I had very low expectations for that game so for $5 on sale, it wasn't a bad play with a friend :)

NuclearKetchup
02-25-2011, 02:48 AM
I just came in to say you're all missing out.

Servitor
02-25-2011, 06:22 AM
How do I cancel my preorder? D:

XmXFLUXmX
02-25-2011, 06:27 AM
How do I cancel my preorder? D:

File a ticket at Steam Support.

GisleAune
02-25-2011, 06:28 AM
Things I don't like:

*Cliche Writing
different strokes for everyone - but what isn't cliche nowadays? Bioware knows how to write a good stroy. Guns are in a way cliche in FPSes - they still come in hordes to earn ♥♥♥♥loads.
*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.
That Ogre sure did look evil. And you've only seen darkspawn and humans.
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
You don't save the world. You're rising to power.
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
The texture resolution was improved, as was the lighting. Though it's sharp at times.
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
The part of the demo is set on a blighted landscape and a city.
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
Bioware wanted to tell the story of Hawke's rise to power.
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
Source? Noone knows every part of the plot yet.
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
It's 49,99$ on most stores. The Day one stuff is i think was included in the signature edition.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
A bit early to see every skill, ability and weapon in use.
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
The darkspawn were weird, but it's a bit early to tell if the rest are.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
We have only met the Hawke family, Isabella and barely Varric.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
Well the Wardne has just left Lothering. You can import the DA1 save in the full game to see his/her achievemnts in Ferelden.
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
It's just another story in the franchise. Not a reboot. A continuation of DA:O would be strange.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there
I didn't like Cassandra's VO, but Varric (dwarf) did well.

Here's my opinion on your points. Soem of your points seem to be just misinformed bandwagons mixed with a initial fixed bad impression before the demo booted up.

XmXFLUXmX
02-25-2011, 06:32 AM
Servitor, https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=1223-QROC-4460

Go there and click on contact support to cancel your pre-order.

evilhippo
02-25-2011, 07:33 AM
Steam are very good about cancelling pre-orders as long as you do so before the release date (for obvious reasons).

I am sure DA2 will sell well as this move to turn the game into an arcade fighter with a bit of dialogue will appeal to more people that it turns off. You only have to see the comments to realise that for many people combat animations that are REALLY REALLY FAST are 'cool' rather then cheesier that rancid Gorgonzola.

DA:O was fun but time to face the fact that in the end, Bioware was bound to get infected by the "EA Effect" and move their games down market where the money is. Bigger boobies and ludicrously faster combat... so rather that artful animations that make two handed weapons look ponderous and heavy, instead we see warriors who can wave them around like they are made of plastic. The artfulness is gone and the game belongs to twitch players now, so time to move on.

But do not despair, in May 2011, a real RPG is coming out that is 100% EA Games Free and you can buy it here on Steam...

The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings Digital Premium Edition. A game designed by developers who care about RPG and PC gaming. They intend to port PC to console, not console to PC and that, dear friends, really really matters.

x181
02-25-2011, 08:10 AM
Slightly off-topic but I just had rancid gorgonzola last night.

Cosmictrippin
02-25-2011, 08:13 AM
Yep, that's how disgusted I was with this reboot H&S piece of crap.

I hope those of you emotionally attached to Bioware really do enjoy this game, because if you don't get a refund by March 11th you're SOL

Now why did I cancel you may ask, here is why:

Things that I think are good about DA2:

*Fast Combat [I also liked the old system. They both can work if made right]
*The new talking wheel and the PC has a voice now

Things I don't like:

*Cliche Writing
*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there


Far to many negatives outway the positives of a $60 dollar purchase plus OP DLCs.


I'm sorry Bioware but as a long time supporter I can no longer buy your overpriced games when you completely compromise your gameplay for more money. If I did support this I would be an enabler. This is how consumers speak: with their wallets.


There is a reason why the lead designer of 10 years left Bioware and was angry enough to make a blog about why he left.

Well said.

Cosmictrippin
02-25-2011, 08:29 AM
Steam are very good about cancelling pre-orders as long as you do so before the release date (for obvious reasons).

I am sure DA2 will sell well as this move to turn the game into an arcade fighter with a bit of dialogue will appeal to more people that it turns off. You only have to see the comments to realise that for many people combat animations that are REALLY REALLY FAST are 'cool' rather then cheesier that rancid Gorgonzola.

DA:O was fun but time to face the fact that in the end, Bioware was bound to get infected by the "EA Effect" and move their games down market where the money is. Bigger boobies and ludicrously faster combat... so rather that artful animations that make two handed weapons look ponderous and heavy, instead we see warriors who can wave them around like they are made of plastic. The artfulness is gone and the game belongs to twitch players now, so time to move on.

But do not despair, in May 2011, a real RPG is coming out that is 100% EA Games Free and you can buy it here on Steam...

The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings Digital Premium Edition. A game designed by developers who care about RPG and PC gaming. They intend to port PC to console, not console to PC and that, dear friends, really really matters.

I'm considering on getting the witcher 2 I heard nothing but good things about it. I wouldn't be surprised if the witcher 2 does well because of whats going on with DA2

bes
02-25-2011, 08:37 AM
I will sit here and laugh my ♥♥♥ off at all the lamers here basing the final product off of a short demo..with limited options..

When the Demo looked just like DAO, but a little better due to the DX11 feature ..get your eyes checked

Combat takes a bit of getting used to...but its fun

Voice acting was good, seems to me about the same as DAO..

There are still tactics options and a pause...

There are still skill trees and stats...

Spells and abilities are better...

Take into consideration that this game was in development BEFORE DAO ....and it was not going to be a sequel to DAO, it was going to be called something else instead of Dragon Age 2..

The devs decided to go along with making the game a sequel to DAO after they saw what a total success it was...they were surprised..

They could not abandon the work they already did... so it is different than DAO in a lot of ways but also the same in others..

On a side note there are other games you can get that have better/more realistic combat like: Two Worlds 2 & Drakensang The River of Time... oh and the Witcher and possibly the Witcher 2

Cosmictrippin
02-25-2011, 08:51 AM
I will sit here and laugh my ♥♥♥ off at all the lamers here basing the final product off of a short demo..with limited options..

When the Demo looked just like DAO, but a little better due to the DX11 feature ..get your eyes checked

Combat takes a bit of getting used to...but its fun

Voice acting was good, seems to me about the same as DAO..

There are still tactics options and a pause...

There are still skill trees and stats...

Spells and abilities are better...

Take into consideration that this game was in development BEFORE DAO ....and it was not going to be a sequel to DAO, it was going to be called something else instead of Dragon Age 2..

The devs decided to go along with making the game a sequel to DAO after they saw what a total success it was...they were surprised..

They could not abandon the work they already did... so it is different than DAO in a lot of ways but also the same in others..

On a side note there are other games you can get that have better/more realistic combat like: Two Worlds 2 & Drakensang The River of Time... oh and the Witcher and possibly the Witcher 2

This is pure BS. you cant have the best of both worlds . You cant be Both different and the same as a previous game. Its a contradiction.

Mazena
02-25-2011, 09:45 AM
I won't be canceling my pre-order! :D I was a tad worried after the demo, but after studying a few video interviews I think it's still going to be pretty awesome. Oh, and I only paid 28 euros, so I think I'm getting more than my money's worth.

I might let you guys know how much fun I had after I have played the game through.

And people who are going on about The Witcher 2, sure it might be awesome, but most likely in a different way than DA2 and neither will steal glory over the other (well, maybe in GOTY awards). And I need something to play while I wait for Witcher 2, it still feels so far away - not to mention Skyrim.

evilhippo
02-25-2011, 10:12 AM
Slightly off-topic but I just had rancid gorgonzola last night.

And did it make you move REALLY REALLY FAST and leap around like a monkey on acid? :D

evilhippo
02-25-2011, 10:14 AM
I will sit here and laugh my ♥♥♥ off at all the lamers here basing the final product off of a short demo..with limited options.

Why? Will the final game have different combat animations than the demo or the same absurdly fast ones? If not, your remark makes no sense at least with regard to why I have given the game then 'thumbs down'.

coopersnow
02-25-2011, 10:18 AM
What the hell is wrong with this game? It's exactly the same and finally looks great. DA:O looked TERRIBLE imo, no style whatsoever, just a boring photo realistic model style. It was pretty bad that the women looked like cavemen and for some reason when you wear Morrigan's cloths the whole model suddenly changed.

This is also a demo so don't take it so seriously.

Devnant
02-25-2011, 10:19 AM
♥♥♥♥! Thank you SO MUCH! I didn't know I could cancel pre-orders! Just filed a ticket asking to cancel mine. After playing the demo I KNOW this game is no way near worth U$60. It felt like a major step back to DA:O in too many different aspects.

Gonna get a ultimate edition with all DLC too in a few years for US$10.

THANK YOU!

Servitor
02-25-2011, 11:15 AM
Replies in yellow. :P I agree with most of your counters, except the "Only you can unite" part. Loghain was doing a pretty good job at that himself? D:

XmXFLUXmX
02-25-2011, 12:01 PM
Oh, and I only paid 28 euros, so I think I'm getting more than my money's worth.




Yeah, you'll be buying all of the DLC as well. Whatever money you think you are saving is all an illusion. You'll still end up paying more than $100 for this game.

Andorxor
02-25-2011, 12:02 PM
You are the one who knows about the danger and has the documents.Anyone else in this position would have been probable successful at uniting.

real4xor
02-25-2011, 12:27 PM
Threw it off my wishlist after seeing what it is...
Is it even about Ferelden? Heck, is it even worthy of the title 'sequel to Dragon Age'? I wouldn`t even mind if it were a prequel, but this stuff seems off in more ways than already obviously displayed in the demo and gameplay vids.

Sure, there`s "dumbed down button mashing combat"... But I don`t mind, I can get used to that. At least it`ll up your reflexes a bit, rather than having to tinker on tactics.

It`s pretty much the rest that I really dislike.

And yea, the visuals and the enemies look... well... sad... compared to the nightmares you had to conquer in DA;O.

I`ll just wait until it`s thrown into the bargain bin. If the digital delux is 10 bux, I`ll think about it.

Neverpleased
02-25-2011, 01:29 PM
I was never a big Dragon Age fan. To me it was an average RPG that didn't take things far enough. Sure you had different stories but only the start up. Further in game much of the story just melded into one giant attempted dark story.

Now it's not even worth looking through. You want to know why?

Two Worlds Two is a better game than Dragon Age 2. Two Worlds Two is not a great game, but it is a game. Dragon Age 2 is a bastardization of the genre. A hack and slash RPG can't be all about the bloody hacking and slashing. There needs to be a system behind it. Now I cut through the ♥♥♥♥ing Darkspawn that look EXACTLY LIKE ORKS like butter. You used to have to fight and prioritize them.

Let's compare the two games shall we? What were your first reactions when you saw an Ogre in DA1? I think it was along the line of: O ♥♥♥♥! Run! Scatter and lure it to the tank.

What was your reaction to DA2 pulling the ogre out? I stood right next to it, took every single one of it's attacks, got damaged to maybe 75% health and just button mashed the heck out of the battle.

This game is really not impressing me. However I will still pick it up simply to see what results from all this. DA1 had me hyped at the start and left me feeling bored and tired. Maybe DA2 will have the exact opposite effect.

Kanten
02-25-2011, 03:23 PM
GOTY awards are most often bought, not earned. And with a pimp like EA i'm sure DA2 will get it.

Which is funny, because that would essentially cause a civil war in the Bioware fanbase, since DA2 winning GOTY would mean ME3 would lose it. There's also Old Republic sitting there trying to grab attention.

Yes, Bioware is releasing three games in one year under EA.

picary
02-25-2011, 03:57 PM
Yes, Bioware is releasing three games in one year under EA.

Don't they have different teams working on each game?

evilhippo
02-25-2011, 04:25 PM
Don't they have different teams working on each game?

I sure hope so :(

MunkiLord
02-25-2011, 04:27 PM
I may be in the minority in this thread, but I'm excited for DA2. If I love the game half as much as the first, I have no problem throwing extra money to Bioware/EA for tons of DLC.

DTKT
02-25-2011, 04:35 PM
I may be in the minority in this thread, but I'm excited for DA2. If I love the game half as much as the first, I have no problem throwing extra money to Bioware/EA for tons of DLC.

Dont worry. In most forums, its the vocal minority that you see everywhere. ;)

mr138
02-25-2011, 04:44 PM
:P I agree with most of your counters, except the "Only you can unite" part. Loghain was doing a pretty good job at that himself? D:

Just the royalty. Dwarves, elves/warewolves weren't aligned to him, and the mages would have been wiped out during the Rite of Annulment. I remember Oghren commenting on how they are outnumbered 3-1 at Denerim, even after I went and got all possible allies. Even considering he did all that, he outlawed the few remaining wardens so he wouldn't be able to kill the archdemon; he would have failed no matter what.

Draggeta
02-25-2011, 05:27 PM
Have to agree with most of your points. I like Mass Effect and liked ME2 more, but still missed the inventory and all that other stuff.

DA2 though, is a different game. It's not a BG. It is close camera Diablo, which is a great game, but not what I wanted from DA. And the changed style, going from a more realistic style to anime style and action.
This is from someone who likes anime. I really don't need to fly across the screen, don't need to twirl with my staff for auto attack, don't need to stylishly chop enemies cleanly in 2.
I just want a tactical overview and some sense of danger. Sure, the ogre looked a bit threathening, but only because he was big. All the other enemies looked like shambling skeletons.

Pro's:
The attacks seem to have more weight
Lip sync was great
Affirmed my assumptions about the gameplay

Cons:
Anime style and combat.
No strategic view. If a small rock is blocking your view, you can't give a command to go attack, first you have to move.
Still no queuing. Sure, enemies die fast, but if I have a group, I should be able to give queue orders. Pretty sure they won't die as fast in higher difficulties
Return of sexy female CQ armor. Was actually happy with the fact that DA:O had somewhat reasonable female armor.
Change in combat feel From "real" looking swings and firing to random staff twirling, stamping and jumps.
One hero type of thing. Sure, you had only your GW, but it was you and Alistair in the game. At the end there were 3 GW, and untill the other GW failed, you were not the one to kill the Archdemon. Then it was you or Alistair. You need not be the sole hero. You did not necessarily become king, you did not fight alone etc. The PC seems to become more Shepard like instead of leader in a war.
Stuff posted before.

Anyway, you can agree or disagree. It's all opinion and will probably buy it when it's cheapter than 30 euro's with most DLC.

tda-danny
02-25-2011, 09:59 PM
Nothing prior to the demo screamed at me to pre-order. Now that I've played the demo I know I will wait for a GOTY edition that is less than $30.

Much less than $30. After playing the demo, I will wait for one of those $4.99 sales...

I'm (unfortunately) disappointed with DA2 =(

Kanten
02-25-2011, 10:19 PM
Dont worry. In most forums, its the vocal minority that you see everywhere. ;)

Yes, because it's ALWAYS the minority. Let me guess, when legitimately bad games do come out, the people stating their dislike are automatically the minority, right?

DTKT
02-25-2011, 10:50 PM
Yes, because it's ALWAYS the minority. Let me guess, when legitimately bad games do come out, the people stating their dislike are automatically the minority, right?

I would contemplate giving this any thought but since DAII hasnt come out yet and everyone only played a demo of an old build, I wont.

Though, I will bookmark this and come back to it later.

Kanten
02-25-2011, 11:24 PM
I would contemplate giving this any thought but since DAII hasnt come out yet and everyone only played a demo of an old build, I wont.

Doesn't that raise a few questions though? For starters, why a company releases an obsolete, sketchy build of the game as a marketing tool?

DTKT
02-25-2011, 11:35 PM
Doesn't that raise a few questions though? For starters, why a company releases an obsolete, sketchy build of the game as a marketing tool?

Because people would have complained on both cases? I mean, it's far from perfect and if what you saw of core gameplay did not appeal to you, fair enough.

But going to the extent of calling DAII a "legitimately bad game" doesn't seem right to me. Wait for it to come out and for several reviews to be published. Or just play it at a friends house, but wait before dismissing the entire game.

There is a big different between a bad game and a product that strictly doesn't appeal to you. I feel that's where most of the complaints come from.

Mithridate
02-25-2011, 11:38 PM
Canceled my preorder but its likely that i buy this within a year (from steam, DOWN with EA!!!)

The things i reacted on are:
-The new darkspawn, they actually made me laugh.
Sure you will encounter cooler enemies later on and the cute darkspawn toddlers prolly makes them look meaner, but still a bad move as Im fairly certain both newcomers and hardcore fans preferred the old nightmare-like darkspawn.

-The troll had a baby face... cute
-The plastic weapons and rabid attack speed, sure making a two hander attack faster could have been a good thing but wtf was that?
-Isabella, i dislike all over the new GLIMPSE of her. Very different from in DA:O in a bad BAD way, will however be interesting to see how she develops.

And fix the "bugs", It looks very silly when a rogue for example cartwheels over and over in a spin of death when following enemies. Same goes for the warriors animation.

Adding a few more attack moves would be great and adding variation, so you dont see same combos over and over for example ending with the annoying magepose. And when fighting large enemies the way you "land" attacks is horrible, especially the rogues combo look hilarious poking the air around the trolls leg for example. (look at 1:48 in the GT preview for a reference http://www.gametrailers.com/video/preview-dragon-age/710303)

I smell the corruption of EA, but in the end BioWare may have turned it around into something good (ME2 is an example of that) where they stood strong against the filth only to grow stronger from the ordeal. (yes there where some drawbacks, but MAJOR gains)

Will obtain this by means unsaid, try it and buy if its nearly as good as i think it will be despite said things.

Un-related, If this is a flop I dont know what il do while waiting for ME3... Especially since it will prolly be ruined too.
Heh, The Witcher 2 will hit platinum instead of merely gold if it does flop.
Gona be interesting if Shogun 2 have been defiled, Empire n Napoleon merely showed very minor signs.

btw, my first post! ^^

Fizzman117
02-25-2011, 11:41 PM
Its definitely more action oriented then the first game. A lot of big explosions and easier fights so casual players will buy it. I am still going to get it since an average Bioware game is better then most videogames today.

Kanten
02-25-2011, 11:45 PM
Because people would have complained on both cases? I mean, it's far from perfect and if what you saw of core gameplay did not appeal to you, fair enough.

But going to the extent of calling DAII a "legitimately bad game" doesn't seem right to me. Wait for it to come out and for several reviews to be published. Or just play it at a friends house, but wait before dismissing the entire game.

There is a big different between a bad game and a product that strictly doesn't appeal to you. I feel that's where most of the complaints come from.

I didn't call DA2 a "legitimately bad game", I was speaking hypothetically.

DTKT
02-25-2011, 11:51 PM
I didn't call DA2 a "legitimately bad game", I was speaking hypothetically.

Then, why even make the observation. ;)

BenjaminFedder
02-26-2011, 12:19 AM
I'm scared I admit.

But I liked the previous games, and I like Bioware. I hope I will positively surprised.

If not, at least I will sleep well knowing that I have supported a franchise and a company that I enjoy, albeit the product itself was lackluster.

Dazzled
02-26-2011, 06:34 AM
Which is funny, because that would essentially cause a civil war in the Bioware fanbase, since DA2 winning GOTY would mean ME3 would lose it. There's also Old Republic sitting there trying to grab attention.

Yes, Bioware is releasing three games in one year under EA.

No, just no. GOTY awards are not like the Oscars. Every game magazine/review site gives out GOTY awards themselves so in the end there are a at least half a dozen different Game of the Year title holders each year.

Which just shows how worthless a GOTY award truly is.

Kanten
02-26-2011, 11:56 AM
No, just no. GOTY awards are not like the Oscars. Every game magazine/review site gives out GOTY awards themselves so in the end there are a at least half a dozen different Game of the Year title holders each year.

Which just shows how worthless a GOTY award truly is.

I didn't mean to say that there was just one GOTY. Just that the prospect of ME3 losing out to DA2 would drive many Bioware worshipers up the wall.

Bsc Nel
02-26-2011, 01:41 PM
how in the hell are you suppose to know it has cliche writing and you cant get attached to a character in a 30 min demo? i can put graphics on highest and ill tell you for a demo these graphics are VERY nice the enemy's look practicly the same like in Dao1 cept some of the darkspawn were changed. alot more gory and the attributes are way better. you guys needa stop flipping out just cuz the fact that they changed a few things in dao2 and you want it to be exactly the same as dao1 if this game was practicly like dao1 it probably would of failed and got boring somewhat during the storyline.

avorntur
02-26-2011, 02:06 PM
I didn't pre-order cause I don't really care about the bonus items, but after playing the demo I've decided to wait for the 'ultimate' edition and buy the complete thing in 2 years or such...

The main reasons:

Voiceovers for the main character - It lessens the RP element for me as the voice is generally quite flat and in no way relatable. it also causes you to sometimes mis-interpret the 'short' answer you choose which can completely break the immersion...
Human only - I think I only played human 2 times in DAO, it's so much more fun to play other races and the different origins stories really kickstarted the immersion for me.
the world seemed rather 'flat' to me in terms of graphics, I loved the distinctly different areas in DAO.


In the end da2 feels more like you're ordering your character about, rather than actually playing him/her. It's prolly still a fun game like ME and ME2, but not a real RP game like DAO, more an action game with RP elements.

baddos
02-26-2011, 02:11 PM
Ya I canceled my order too.

DA2 is a completely different game from DA1. I played the demo and was unimpressed with the change of art style and arcade style fighting. The UI was dumbed down for console players making it seem like a kids game instead of the adult story telling game.

I've played all of Bioware's previous games and hoping ME3 doesn't follow this games direction.

Kanten
02-26-2011, 02:14 PM
how in the hell are you suppose to know it has cliche writing and you cant get attached to a character in a 30 min demo?

Because if the developers' word is anything to go on, that's the beginning of the game. Carver/Bethany's death will be just as shallow and emotionless as the demo we just played.

avorntur
02-26-2011, 02:29 PM
Because if the developers' word is anything to go on, that's the beginning of the game. Carver/Bethany's death will be just as shallow and emotionless as the demo we just played.

and the worst part is that it isn't based on your moral choices, but on your class... yay for RP?

Mithridate
02-26-2011, 02:42 PM
and the worst part is that it isn't based on your moral choices, but on your class... yay for RP?

Amen to that!

Farlong
02-26-2011, 04:43 PM
-snip-
*List of things you can't really know since its only the demo*
And about the colors: we've played in dustcovered rocks and dustcovered city made out of rock. You've seen a few pieces of clothing. You don't know what the rest of game will look like or how all armors/clothing will look like.

Many of the things you list, you can't possibly know will affect the game in full, since ITS A DEMO.
Whining for whines sake.

jellyhurwit
02-26-2011, 05:07 PM
I'm not going to be buying this. I couldn't even make it through the demo. I understand that Bioware is all about the story and making a game that has a rich world, and really can never be bothered with animation...
But honestly, they are so unbelievably crappy about animation that they have actually hit a sub-Fallout 3 level here. Not to knock any animators that might be working with them (because I fully expect this to be a terrible design decision from the top). I hate mocap, but it can be done right and the combination of pure weightlessness, twitch and shake, and awkward starting-stopping motions really just made it impossible to feel immersed.

TL;DR: the animation is terrible to the point where I can't even play it.

x181
02-26-2011, 07:22 PM
Not to knock any animators that might be working with them (because I fully expect this to be a terrible design decision from the top)
DA2's nosedive is the work of the Public Relations and Marketing tools at EA.

OurSacrifice
02-26-2011, 08:58 PM
Wow, are you two people so blind that you cant read what I was replying to?



I can clearly see the 'or FPS games' right there, cant you? Wow, you must be blind, I'm sorry.

FPS games have multiplayer. Those have endless hours of fun for people. Think.

Lawliet89
02-27-2011, 06:53 AM
and the worst part is that it isn't based on your moral choices, but on your class... yay for RP?

You do realise that this is for party balance right?

MaxDA
02-27-2011, 08:45 AM
I didn't preorder DA2 since I rarely preorder any games, but I was ready to get it on day 1, expecting it to be a worthy sequel to DAO.

Well, after playing the demo I decided to pass. Not that the game is totally crap and I can see how the new game style and art direction may appeal to a wider audience than the original, but for my taste it's too big of a leap in the wrong direction from DAO.

I may buy it in the future as a "filler" game when they bundle all the DLC's, but not for more than $19.

I'm a bit disappointed, but there still plenty of great games out there.

Overt.Enemy
02-27-2011, 09:34 AM
100% spot on. I bought DAO due to all the hype, but for me it did live up to its claim as a successor to Baldurs Gate. It felt very similar and I enjoyed that.

now they've gone and dumbed the tactical aspect out of the game, resulting in Biowares lead designer leaving, and are going massively overboard with all the preorder nonsense and DLC content (30 hour game, but hey, dont worry, you can purchase DLC!), and the marketting stunts they are pulling off are such a joke.

30 hour game? Source? The latest PC Gamer, which reviews DA2 and give it a 93/100 says the game is 50 hours, and "on par in time with the first DA game". So where are you getting your information?

And about the colors: we've played in dustcovered rocks and dustcovered city made out of rock. You've seen a few pieces of clothing. You don't know what the rest of game will look like or how all armors/clothing will look like.

Many of the things you list, you can't possibly know will affect the game in full, since ITS A DEMO.
Whining for whines sake.

Agreed. Guess the good news is that PEOPLE THAT HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED THE FULL GAME, like PC Gamer, love the game. You can only judge so many things about the game based on the demo. Some of you people are assuming things based on part of what you're seeing.

Doesn't that raise a few questions though? For starters, why a company releases an obsolete, sketchy build of the game as a marketing tool?

Lol quite simply because the full game wasn't ready? Bad Company 2 was the same way, as were many other games with early demos. They're still working on the full game AND the demo so the demo can be released before the actual game is released. How exactly is it going to be a demo based on the final build which isn't even done? Explain that. You people should be happy you got a pre-release demo AT ALL.

dementedlullaby
02-27-2011, 10:10 AM
I'm going to keep my pre-order and enjoy it for what it is. Like Mass Effect 2. Nowhere near as amazing as the first because of too much change but still a good game if you take it in stride. I do wish they'd learn a lesson but with all the praise from the reviewers I don't see DA3 going back to the Origins roots either.

syrupwontstopem
02-27-2011, 10:40 AM
Eh.. I'm thinking about canceling my preorder. I think the demo is awesome, but from trying it I realize I can't really run it very well on my computer. Maybe better to save the money towards building a new PC. And I can just buy it later when it runs well!

Still though... I have the Signature Edition Preordered. Feel kind of bad canceling that ;)

Clock King
02-27-2011, 11:10 AM
30 hour game? Source? The latest PC Gamer, which reviews DA2 and give it a 93/100 says the game is 50 hours, and "on par in time with the first DA game". So where are you getting your information?

Agreed. Guess the good news is that PEOPLE THAT HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED THE FULL GAME, like PC Gamer, love the game. You can only judge so many things about the game based on the demo. Some of you people are assuming things based on part of what you're seeing.


Where are we getting the information - from SWEDISH PC GAMER who have already played the game too. They say it can be rushed in 20 hours, whereas skipping dialog and playing on casual in DA:O gave me a minimim of 40 hours. 65 with sidequests, dialogs and pause and play combat. But in any case, how reliable is PC Gamer, given that they are the first to get the game? Did they get that because they sent a very emotional plea to EA?;)

I DETEST the logic that you have to first buy a turdy product to have the right to say that you won't buy the turdy product because it was, in fact, turdy after all. We have ENOUGH information, demos, interviews etc to form an educated opinion.

I personally was going to pre-order, and if you had told me last May that I was not getting DA2, I would have probably assumed that it could only be because I was to die in a car accident before then. However in the meantime, we got information to lead me to the obvious decision that (fortunatly) many others have come to - ie, wait until it hits bargain bins in 12 months (including all the rip off DLC).

Any other course of action is a) a waste of money on a game genre I do not want (the way things sound, I'll enjoy Dungeon Siege 3 more) and b) sending a message to BioWare to go right ahead and dumb down DA3 even more. Otherwise, it is definitely RIP Origins, hello to another Diablo clone.

Kanten
02-27-2011, 11:20 AM
How exactly is it going to be a demo based on the final build which isn't even done? Explain that. You people should be happy you got a pre-release demo AT ALL.

The game was finished over a week before the demo came out. And at least for the two months before that it was pretty much exclusively bug testing. The missing features/visuals would have been implemented months ago.

Guess the good news is that PEOPLE THAT HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED THE FULL GAME, like PC Gamer, love the game.

Which is also amazing, considering the game wasn't finished when they wrote that either.

Numnums
02-27-2011, 11:31 AM
I never pre ordered in the first place.

The announcement of the removal of Ariel view from this game as well as no mod tool set said basically

"this will be a console port aimed more at that audience and why bother giving you a option to make mods....we want you to buy our DLC"

Now after playing the demo.....well i wasn't very surprised.


there doesn't feel much of a reason to buy this on PC anymore, I might pick it up for PS3 but not at launch.Maybe when they release a GOTY edition or if Steam gets one and a good sale like the last DA:O one they had I will pick it up.

Way i see it, consoles are the future of gaming as far as the bigger companies are concerned. I have my consoles for console type of games like Uncharted and Demons Souls but color me disappointed that this franchise is going that route.

DTKT
02-27-2011, 12:30 PM
Which is also amazing, considering the game wasn't finished when they wrote that either.

It announced gold 2-3 days after.

I wouldnt surprised if the game was actually finished a bit before that official announcement.

Kanten
02-27-2011, 12:34 PM
It announced gold 2-3 days after.

I wouldnt surprised if the game was actually finished a bit before that official announcement.

Yes, 2-3 days after the magazine came out. The article had to be written at least a few weeks before that.

I'm just skeptical because PC Gamer seemingly got a full copy of game and completed it for a review weeks before going gold, and not a single other publication has.

Hawat
02-27-2011, 12:34 PM
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.

Seriously? You used your crystal ball to determine this one? I think the rest of us only played a 30 minute demo that skipped giant sections of content. What did you play?


This kind of knee jerk reaction doesn't give the rest of us, who are disappointed with EA's policy towards Steam, a chance.

I never pre-ordered and I won't be getting the game until a complete/ultimate edition comes out on sale. I do this because I won't pay $60 for a vanilla edition. EA screwed Steam by letting other digital distributors sell the Signature Edition for $50. Steam can't even sell the same product.


No, I like the demo just fine. I think it fixed more things than it broke. Having said that, I still won't support EA's swindling ways against Steam. I'm waiting.

syrupwontstopem
02-27-2011, 02:37 PM
Yes, 2-3 days after the magazine came out. The article had to be written at least a few weeks before that.

I'm just skeptical because PC Gamer seemingly got a full copy of game and completed it for a review weeks before going gold, and not a single other publication has.

Eh it's probably just part of some exclusive deal, whose real intent is not to actually review the game, but rather to build hype for it.

I remember the "first official review" for Aliens vs. Predator was released before the game. The magazine gave it like an 88, and every other post-release review gave it 60-75.

It's just a common practice for companies that really want to build hype on their game. Hopefully DA2 delivers on that hype :P

evilhippo
02-27-2011, 02:59 PM
Yes, 2-3 days after the magazine came out. The article had to be written at least a few weeks before that.

I'm just skeptical because PC Gamer seemingly got a full copy of game and completed it for a review weeks before going gold, and not a single other publication has.

It would hardly be the first time 'PC Gamer' published a review that had to be filed under "WTF?" :D In this internet age there are oh so many better sources of independent reviews that it is a marvel anyone still reads those hacks at all :rolleyes:

Dazzled
02-27-2011, 04:23 PM
Why do people trust big game review magazines? Do you honestly have no clue about how they earn most of their money ?
Hint: it's not by selling paper copies, or even the digital ones. From half to up to two-thirds of their profit is thanks to advertising and writing positive reviews for AAA titles.

mr138
02-27-2011, 05:55 PM
I don't think the game was truly finished, otherwise the demo would have had things like full dx11 support and some of the (driver?) tessellation problems some people are experiencing probably wouldn't exist.

The major things, content, skills abilities and conversations were probably in place, and they probably have access to a rig powerful enough to get around non optimized dx11. I think there is definitely enough content in place to give a full review if you consider the tweaks they would be adding to the finished version.

Edit: If anyone has played Crysis 2 pre release you probably know what I'm talking about.

coopersnow
02-27-2011, 05:56 PM
I don't think the game was truly finished, otherwise the demo would have had things like full dx11 support and some of the (driver?) tessellation problems some people are experiencing probably wouldn't exist.

The major things, content, skills abilities and conversations were probably in place, and they probably have access to a rig powerful enough to get around non optimized dx11. I think there is definitely enough there to give a full review if you consider the tweaks they would be adding to the finished version.

I don't think they should have made a demo at all, but I guess they were kind enough to let us try the game out first. It just gave a bad impression of what's going to be a great game.

Kanten
02-27-2011, 06:04 PM
I don't think the game was truly finished, otherwise the demo would have had things like full dx11 support and some of the (driver?) tessellation problems some people are experiencing probably wouldn't exist.

My problem with the look of the game isn't the lack of tessellation or Dx11, it's the total absence of details in the settings. The Lothering Outskirts is something I'd expect to see from the PS2 era, and what we saw of Kirkwall was incredibly empty and cookie cutter, it looks like a video game dungeon rather than a city.

Dx11 won't make those places look any less phony.

mr138
02-27-2011, 06:19 PM
My problem with the look of the game isn't the lack of tessellation or Dx11, it's the total absence of details in the settings. The Lothering Outskirts is something I'd expect to see from the PS2 era, and what we saw of Kirkwall was incredibly empty and cookie cutter, it looks like a video game dungeon rather than a city.

Dx11 won't make those places look any less phony.

Is that being an opinion on the choice of aesthetics and atmosphere rather then the texture detail level though? I will admit I wasn't terribly impressed with some of the textures myself, but I can't say I really found them subpar compared to most other offerings. I guess most others aren't $60 though huh... All in all, will probably be a huge game, so you have to expect this in certain areas.

As far as your opinion on how desolate and generic it seemed, that is true for the first game as well. The Deep Roads and Fade (which was almost visually nauseating to play though on maxed) stick out (imo) as especially void of...funness.

Kanten
02-27-2011, 06:23 PM
Is that being an opinion on the choice of aesthetics and atmosphere rather then the texture detail level though? I will admit I wasn't terribly impressed with some of the textures myself, but I can't say I really found them subpar compared to most other offerings. I guess most others aren't $60 though huh... All in all, will probably be a huge game, so you have to expect this in certain areas.

As far as your opinion on how desolate and generic it seemed, that is true for the first game as well. The Deep Roads and Fade (which was almost visually nauseating to play though on maxed) stick out (imo) as especially void of...funness.

Yeah but The Fade and Deep Roads didn't make up 90% of the game like Kirkwall apparently is.

Denerim looked like a city where people live. Kirkwall looks like some architect went insane and put a bunch of giant concrete cubes everywhere.

Sonris89
02-27-2011, 06:27 PM
Is that being an opinion on the choice of aesthetics and atmosphere rather then the texture detail level though? I will admit I wasn't terribly impressed with some of the textures myself, but I can't say I really found them subpar compared to most other offerings. I guess most others aren't $60 though huh... All in all, will probably be a huge game, so you have to expect this in certain areas.

As far as your opinion on how desolate and generic it seemed, that is true for the first game as well. The Deep Roads and Fade (which was almost visually nauseating to play though on maxed) stick out (imo) as especially void of...funness.

The kirkwall portion of the demo was a night time instanced mission, things were the same way in DA:O (remeber those ambushes when traveling in Denerim in the empty portions of the city?)

And the poster above nailed my opinon of those two DA:O areas, the sloth demon area dragged on forever, the skill point additions were nice, but I wish I could skip deep roads and fade. Bleh. Redcliffe and the werewolf den were much more fun.

elitist.magi
02-27-2011, 08:36 PM
Sorry Bioware... but you've consolized DA too much. You got my money for Dragon age Origins and Awakening but $59.99 for this? No... its just Mass Effect set in a bad Dragon Age universe. Will be going with the Witcher with this one. At least they've not abandoned their PC community yet.

coopersnow
02-27-2011, 08:45 PM
Sorry Bioware... but you've consolized DA too much. You got my money for Dragon age Origins and Awakening but $59.99 for this? No... its just Mass Effect set in a bad Dragon Age universe. Will be going with the Witcher with this one. At least they've not abandoned their PC community yet.

How has this been that consolized? Game looks exactly the same just with a minimalist HUD. You still have all the spells they just look a bit bigger and everything looks cleaner at least. IMO, anyone trying to play Dragon Age on the console is a complete moron and I'm sure Bioware just wants everyone to be able to play it.

coopersnow
02-27-2011, 08:48 PM
I don't think the game was truly finished, otherwise the demo would have had things like full dx11 support and some of the (driver?) tessellation problems some people are experiencing probably wouldn't exist.

The major things, content, skills abilities and conversations were probably in place, and they probably have access to a rig powerful enough to get around non optimized dx11. I think there is definitely enough content in place to give a full review if you consider the tweaks they would be adding to the finished version.

Edit: If anyone has played Crysis 2 pre release you probably know what I'm talking about.

Keep in mind the DA2 demo was intended to be released and Crysis 2 wasn't. I still think that the DA2 demo isn't a good representation of what the final game will be and we should keep that in mind, but anyone complaining about Crysis 2 sucking right now is a complete idiot, like the people asking for patches and fixes for a game that doesn't yet exist.

velfarr3
02-27-2011, 09:10 PM
ITT: QQ

You hate the game enough to cancel your pre-order, yet you come here to make a long-winded thread about how much you hate it. Just move on, and play one of the other ZILLION games coming out this year. No. One. Cares.

coopersnow
02-27-2011, 09:12 PM
ITT: QQ

You hate the game enough to cancel your pre-order, yet you come here to make a long-winded thread about how much you hate it. Just move on, and play one of the other ZILLION games coming out this year. No. One. Cares.

I think anyone cancelling a preorder after playing a demo shouldn't even be playing the game at all.

Clock King
02-27-2011, 10:15 PM
I think anyone cancelling a preorder after playing a demo shouldn't even be playing the game at all.

*sigh* . We're not cancelling "just because of a demo". We have tried to ignore all the disappointing interviews, leaked videos, conventions, previews, blogs etc that talked of "streamlining" (dumbing down) "accessibility" (consolization) and shortened gameplay (25hrs per Swedish PC gamer - but "don't worry, there'll be lots of DLC"). We hoped these were overblown. Then we got the demo, and realized this was no longer a BioWare classic, it will probably be blown away by Dungeon Siege 3, ffs.

Look at all the other posts on these and other forums to see what exactly is wrong with DA2 - most of it is supported by exact quotes from the devs (if we haven't seen it for our own eyes in the demo).

spacemuffin
02-27-2011, 10:55 PM
i didn't preorder, but the demo was shockingly bad. i had no idea what was happening, and about half-way through the thrill of a new dragon age wore off and i stopped enjoying myself.

Porkdish
02-27-2011, 11:00 PM
Nothing prior to the demo screamed at me to pre-order. Now that I've played the demo I know I will wait for a GOTY edition that is less than $30.

Am I alone in feeling this might actually be out in 5 months or Less.

ZeroRawr
02-28-2011, 12:18 AM
I'm seriously debating whether I should cancel my pre-order or not. I've read so much about how Bioware is dropping the ball on DA2 and I'm beginning to see where all the hate is coming from. I fear that when the game comes out it's story will be lack-luster and that the combat will get boring and repetitive from it's over the top flashiness. More than likely I'm going to go to my local Gamestop and cancelling my pre-order or change it to something else.

Rubyfair
02-28-2011, 01:01 AM
Am I alone in feeling this might actually be out in 5 months or Less.

You do realize that this game has a confirmed release date, right?

March 8, just so you know.

ZeroRawr
02-28-2011, 01:09 AM
You do realize that this game has a confirmed release date, right?

March 8, just so you know.

He means the Ultimate Edition.

x181
02-28-2011, 01:09 AM
You do realize that this game has a confirmed release date, right?

March 8, just so you know.

He was implying the game will suck so much it will be in the bargain bin in 5 months.

lyravega
02-28-2011, 02:39 AM
I'm tired of greedy publishers butchering the PC gaming industry. Especially EA.

I'm sick of Day One DLCs, that are purely designed to get some extra money - or simply being cut from the original game, for the same intention. Both cases mean those: either you spend time & money on DLCs instead of the original game, while you should've worked on the title itself, or you butchered the game further, restricted & cut some features that was supposed to be in the game.

♥♥♥♥ off EA. I had enough.

chaintm
02-28-2011, 10:29 AM
Its not actually.

How long do proper RPGs like Elder Scrolls games last? A lot longer than DA2 is expected to.

Even DAO was a lot longer, the length of that game was perfect.

Why do you think that $60 is worth a 30 hour game?

Also are you kidding that FPS games last 300 hours? Do you know your Genres? FPS games are normally very short and only last around 20 hours.

Proper RPGs are usually a lot longer with open ended worlds and have LOTS more content for your $60.

If you only want 30 hour games, then you should be playing FPS games, not RPGs.

Even 30 hours is to much, take modern warfare, 6 hours single player and people paid 60+ for that game and still do. (I didn't and never will) , point being, it comes down to what they can sell to the market. You can make threads like this all day, won't change the fact the game will sell in droves. The only thing that will ruin this game is the game itself. Say DA2 is a fail, good luck selling a DA3, that's the way the gaming world works.

Seems the only time forums and word of mouth works is when something is better then most ever thought possible, prime examples, the witcher and rift.

c0rruptd
02-28-2011, 04:02 PM
Well, if you lot really want to cancel your pre-orders over a thirty minute demo and scavenged interviews and screenshots from the internet, feel free. Leaves more pre-orders for the rest of us that don't whine over such things as 'I can't get attached to the characters in a demo, this whole game is going to suck!' and 'the story is cliched and terrible, I've seen pictures!'. =P

Sonris89
02-28-2011, 04:35 PM
I'm tired of greedy publishers butchering the PC gaming industry. Especially EA.

I'm sick of Day One DLCs, that are purely designed to get some extra money - or simply being cut from the original game, for the same intention. Both cases mean those: either you spend time & money on DLCs instead of the original game, while you should've worked on the title itself, or you butchered the game further, restricted & cut some features that was supposed to be in the game.

♥♥♥♥ off EA. I had enough.

Haha, now that is rage I can agree with. EA is the destroyer of games (just look what they did to the great titles of bullfrog and Westwood) and day one DLCs are ugly money grabs. But I don't think Bioware has had the fan just yet. ;)

lyravega
02-28-2011, 05:04 PM
Haha, now that is rage I can agree with. EA is the destroyer of games (just look what they did to the great titles of bullfrog and Westwood) and day one DLCs are ugly money grabs. But I don't think Bioware has had the fan just yet. ;)

After they end their trilogies, I seriously doubt they'll survive. Especially after butchering their titles and bowing down to their masters without much resistance, annoying people that "loved" their games. Hell, even their lead left the team, shortly stating da2 is not the game he wanted to make - why not the people? To get 1-2 more customers, they're annoying 3-5 in the line.

If this goes on, same will happen - they'll disappear like Bullfrog or Westwood...

HottspittaJr
02-28-2011, 05:18 PM
Yep, that's how disgusted I was with this reboot H&S piece of crap.

I hope those of you emotionally attached to Bioware really do enjoy this game, because if you don't get a refund by March 11th you're SOL

Now why did I cancel you may ask, here is why:

Things that I think are good about DA2:

*Fast Combat [I also liked the old system. They both can work if made right]
*The new talking wheel and the PC has a voice now

Things I don't like:

*Cliche Writing
*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.
*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]
*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there


Far to many negatives outway the positives of a $60 dollar purchase plus OP DLCs.


I'm sorry Bioware but as a long time supporter I can no longer buy your overpriced games when you completely compromise your gameplay for more money. If I did support this I would be an enabler. This is how consumers speak: with their wallets.


There is a reason why the lead designer of 10 years left Bioware and was angry enough to make a blog about why he left.

Haha, funny but....
It is a lot harder to sell a lie when mathematicians run in the family. Please, no one cares why you canceled your preorder. It's a pathetic attempt, for whatever reason you have.

If you do research and add up the cons to facts. You will find that the cons list is a lot smaller.
Removing opinions and checking facts to remove others, will basically give all the true things that others should hate about it in common.

DTKT
02-28-2011, 05:20 PM
After they end their trilogies, I seriously doubt they'll survive. Especially after butchering their titles and bowing down to their masters without much resistance, annoying people that "loved" their games. Hell, even their lead left the team, shortly stating da2 is not the game he wanted to make - why not the people? To get 1-2 more customers, they're annoying 3-5 in the line.

If this goes on, same will happen - they'll disappear like Bullfrog or Westwood...

Where do your numbers come from? How can you make such grand prediction of the future?

Arguments are great, but when you start to just write stuff that have no grounds in reality, it gets a but harder to take you seriously.

Cosmictrippin
02-28-2011, 06:09 PM
Nothing prior to the demo screamed at me to pre-order. Now that I've played the demo I know I will wait for a GOTY edition that is less than $30.

smart man

OurSacrifice
02-28-2011, 06:20 PM
Where do your numbers come from? How can you make such grand prediction of the future?

Arguments are great, but when you start to just write stuff that have no grounds in reality, it gets a but harder to take you seriously.

It's what EA does to the good developers they buy. They force them into the garbage recycling line that is EA, making them puke out game after game without the developers previous levels of polish. Eventually that developers core fanbase leaves because the developer is no longer what it used to be. EA then shuts the company down and that's usually after a bunch of them quit.

EA bought bioware for one reason and one reason only. The Old Republic. They couldn't care less for their single player RPG division except for the fact it takes them too long to make their RPGs so they're being forced into the action/adventure genre for faster turn-around.

Hagen
02-28-2011, 06:30 PM
Please, no one cares why you canceled your preorder.
I do. Please don't speak for me.

I am interested by any message with arguments, be it for or against the demo and/or DA2.

Cosmictrippin
02-28-2011, 06:32 PM
It's what EA does to the good developers they buy. They force them into the garbage recycling line that is EA, making them puke out game after game without the developers previous levels of polish. Eventually that developers core fanbase leaves because the developer is no longer what it used to be. EA then shuts the company down and that's usually after a bunch of them quit.

EA bought bioware for one reason and one reason only. The Old Republic. They couldn't care less for their single player RPG division except for the fact it takes them too long to make their RPGs so they're being forced into the action/adventure genre for faster turn-around.


You speak the truth.

DTKT
02-28-2011, 06:35 PM
It's what EA does to the good developers they buy. They force them into the garbage recycling line that is EA, making them puke out game after game without the developers previous levels of polish. Eventually that developers core fanbase leaves because the developer is no longer what it used to be. EA then shuts the company down and that's usually after a bunch of them quit.

EA bought bioware for one reason and one reason only. The Old Republic. They couldn't care less for their single player RPG division except for the fact it takes them too long to make their RPGs so they're being forced into the action/adventure genre for faster turn-around.

I guess it comes to this, I agree to disagree on your perception of EA.

Xairtis
02-28-2011, 07:34 PM
Well TBH I was a bit frustrated by the demo I that I played off my pal but to just say a few things to the average complaints~

He isn't even a warden!?
Warden were just the men or women who desplayed prowess in martial/magical/tactical areas and were given the darkspawn blood to enhance the senses mainly the ability to sense the darkspawn.
(pretty much fact)

The darkspawn look like ♥♥♥♥ing skeletor!?
well with every <dont recall the name> rules over them affects the appearance and martial abilities of the darspawn
( my opinion)

Theres no customization!?
Look if you watch the demo footage play the demo it seems to me like there is a lot of customization within the abilities to fight and and such just not in race and orgins and it's still to early to tell.
(bit of both)

Theres no tactics!?
well yes it seems like it has been dumbed down a little and that the abilities have been injected with steriods but my opinion is that with new abilities new game of course the tactics won't be the same and I'm sure or really really hope that there are creatures that make you cry and scream :P
(opinion)

and before anyone asks I am no means a fan boy of any of the companies producing the game I am just an game :)

Edit: Yes there a lot of typos but it's readable

Cosmictrippin
02-28-2011, 07:58 PM
I guess it comes to this, I agree to disagree on your perception of EA.

Then you are a fool

DTKT
02-28-2011, 08:08 PM
Then you are a fool

I wish I could be so sure of everything! But alas, I cannot.

Mark_VI
02-28-2011, 08:10 PM
After playing the demo, DA2 feels to me like a Michael Bay movie. It tries to overwhelm you with noise and motion.

I know I'm only the 1000th person to complain about this, but what the heck was with them getting rid of the overhead view?

Iconoclast XVII
02-28-2011, 08:11 PM
Yep, that's how disgusted I was with this reboot H&S piece of crap.

Hack and slash? No. This is an insult to hack and slash. It is just like the same old Dragon Age boring combat... err... boring "click on enemy, wait for enemy to die, click on next enemy" rather, just sped up... I believe I should at least try a game before I decide it isn't worth it and trash it, and this isn't worth it. Just the same old thing again.

Not to mention the loading pause in the middle of combat and cut scenes...

DTKT
02-28-2011, 08:15 PM
Hack and slash? No. This is an insult to hack and slash. It is just like the same old Dragon Age boring combat... err... boring "click on enemy, wait for enemy to die, click on next enemy" rather, just sped up... I believe I should at least try a game before I decide it isn't worth it and trash it, and this isn't worth it. Just the same old thing again.

Not to mention the loading pause in the middle of combat and cut scenes...

Fixed in the main build according to the devs.

Iconoclast XVII
02-28-2011, 08:26 PM
Fixed in the main build according to the devs.

Yeah, even when typing it I figured it was just a demo issue that would be fixed when the game was officially released. My main reason for disliking it came when I was texting while fighting the Ogre and it was working as efficiently as it was when I was actually paying attention to the game...

Super Fun
02-28-2011, 09:23 PM
Good thing CD Project Red is still making great games, bioware certainly is not.

Sonris89
02-28-2011, 10:10 PM
Good thing CD Project Red is still making great games, bioware certainly is not.

Huh, I thought they were working on the witcher.

Are you confusing them them with Berthseda? :p

kurukx
02-28-2011, 11:14 PM
Judge the game on what it is.

If you want a graphic computer based role playing game or mortal kombat from the last century.

DA2 needs a greater story, greater cast not a console based swarm fest of click die click die rubbish.

Let the A.D.D kids click something else. Cant we have a quality AAA title to buy ?

kurukx
02-28-2011, 11:55 PM
What the hell is wrong with this game? It's exactly the same and finally looks great. DA:O looked TERRIBLE imo, no style whatsoever, just a boring photo realistic model style. It was pretty bad that the women looked like cavemen and for some reason when you wear Morrigan's cloths the whole model suddenly changed.

This is also a demo so don't take it so seriously.

DA:O looked TERRIBLE.

Really that never crossed my mind when a played and enjoyed it.

What do you need on a top seller game ? Pretty models and comforting words of encouragement ?

OurSacrifice
03-01-2011, 02:40 AM
I guess it comes to this, I agree to disagree on your perception of EA.

So you think EA didn't close Pandemic? They didn't close Origin? They didn't close Westwood? They didn't close "EA Chicago" (their best internal studio) because they couldn't get games completed fast enough? They didn't close Maxis? DICE "Canada" (closed literally HOURS after they purchased DICE.

What do you think this company does? Seriously...

Aemony
03-01-2011, 03:03 AM
Well TBH I was a bit frustrated by the demo I that I played off my pal but to just say a few things to the average complaints~

He isn't even a warden!?
Warden were just the men or women who desplayed prowess in martial/magical/tactical areas and were given the darkspawn blood to enhance the senses mainly the ability to sense the darkspawn.
(pretty much fact)

What have you been drinking? Grey Wardens are the only people capable of stopping a Blight since they are the only people to be able to kill an Archdemon (at least until Morrigan came along) without it ressurecting in another Darkspawn. When the Archdemon is killed its soul leaves the body to find the closest 'tainted' creature to inhabit. This is usually other Darkspawn but with the existence of Grey Warden it instead tries to inhabit them. And they with their resistance to the Blight will perish along side the Archdemon, making what is known as The Ultimate Sacrifice.

The darkspawn look like ♥♥♥♥ing skeletor!?
well with every <dont recall the name> rules over them affects the appearance and martial abilities of the darspawn
( my opinion)

Yet again, what have you been drinking? It's a well-known fact that Darkspawn takes on the apperance of their Broodmother's former race. A human Broodmother will spawn Hurlocks, an elven broodmother shrieks, a dwarven broodmother genlocks, and a qunari broodmother ogres. Each broodmother is capable of spawning thousands of darkspawn and their apperance has NOTHING at all to do with the Archdemon.

---

It's my guess that DA:II won't ever have anything to do with Darkspawns and Archdemons alike. The Fifth Blight in Ferelden is happening at the same time as the events in DA:II and I fail to see how two Blights on two different locations at the same time is possible.

Charli_2na
03-01-2011, 03:32 AM
Good thing CD Project Red is still making great games, bioware certainly is not.

Having recently played through The Witcher (Enhanced Edition) I too am going to place my faith in CD Projekt Red as the next big thing in PC RPGs.
I really enjoyed DA:O (the stains EA left on the rug were obvious but relatively minor), but IMHO The Witcher had a better storyline and surpassed DA:O in all but a few of the areas that I feel are most important in a PC RPG.
The storyline in DA:O was great, don't get me wrong, just The Witcher was excellent.

I played the DA2 demo and noted that nearly all of my gripes with the game seem to be the result of EA's demands for fast releases and dumbed down "hollywood style" console friendly gameplay.

Like what the hell is with that icon telling me what my dialogue choices mean? This is a joke, this is a peaceful response, this is a forceful response etc. It's like I'm being told what the consequences of my actions are going to be before I make them, and I think that kinda defeats the purpose of an RPG.
I'm not 5. I want to feel like my collective actions are gradually moving me in the direction I want to go, instead I feel like I'm putting gold stars on the happy/sadface chart.

I died a little inside the day I heard Bioware had been bought out by EA because I knew instantly that it was the end of the finely honed and balanced Bioware games I had come to know and love.

Bethesda and Obsidian both do good work and I love them for it, but their games tend to lack the quality of voice acting and visual design that the old bioware games had.

Speaking of which I don't think the quality of the voice acting in the DA2 demo is up to scratch either, considering how good it was in the previous post EA releases of DA:O and ME2.
Varric and Hawke are quite good, but there's nowhere near enough emotion in the combat dialogue, especially from the other characters who seem to be pretty flat the whole way through (go play Baldur's Gate II and you'll see what I mean).

Yes, I took into account the fact that DA2 is only a demo at this stage and I have reserved judgement on things like the storyline which are likely to be withheld until the full game is released, but just like I didn't buy Awakening I'm not buying DA2.

/end rant. I feel much better now :D

Sonris89
03-01-2011, 07:58 AM
Judge the game on what it is.

If you want a graphic computer based role playing game or mortal kombat from the last century.

DA2 needs a greater story, greater cast not a console based swarm fest of click die click die rubbish.

Let the A.D.D kids click something else. Cant we have a quality AAA title to buy ?

How do you know what the story is? even if you have been devouring nothing but media leaks and Q&A for the last year on the game I doubt any of us would have the ability to comment on how fulfilling or unfulfilling the story line is.

People are just throwing assumptions around it seems because they hated one or two changes but don't feel thats enough to register a full complaint about.

DTKT
03-01-2011, 08:37 AM
So you think EA didn't close Pandemic? They didn't close Origin? They didn't close Westwood? They didn't close "EA Chicago" (their best internal studio) because they couldn't get games completed fast enough? They didn't close Maxis? DICE "Canada" (closed literally HOURS after they purchased DICE.

What do you think this company does? Seriously...

From what I know, the latest Mercenaries wasn't any good. The last few C&C games were okay. I dont know about the rest of the studios you mentioned or what games they did.

OurSacrifice
03-01-2011, 08:59 AM
From what I know, the latest Mercenaries wasn't any good.

You can thank EA.

The last few C&C games were okay.

You can thank EA.

I dont know about the rest of the studios you mentioned or what games they did.

wow ... just wow

DTKT
03-01-2011, 09:08 AM
You can thank EA.



You can thank EA.



wow ... just wow

How about thanking the designers or the producers?

Edit: Oh the SIMS. Isnt the studio still active? It hasnt been closed down from what I know. DICE Canada was a branch that hadnt really published anything on it's own. It sucks to see people lose their jobs but that's all it was.

HydrogenHuman
03-01-2011, 09:10 AM
I love QQ threads, they make my day so much better.

Short and simple: Dragon Age 2 felt like an upgraded Dragon Age 1. Story is impossible to judge from demo, spells seem fun, graphics looked good for me. Dialogue system is still the same.

d0nk3y
03-01-2011, 09:15 AM
Choosing mage in the demo because I like mages most in RPGs I was excited at first.

Then I relized I was a bonafide ribbon dancer while watching my fireball cooldown tick.

The dialouge was laughable "You shall not have him!, They shall not have you." Really?

Having to run around in circles like a scooby-doo cartoon because the ogre smashed the healer in an uncontrollable cut scene was the deciding factor. Tactical combat where I plan where to drop spells to do the most damage has given way to running circles around waves of R-tard units waiting for my egg timer.

If the Demo is any indication of how DA2 will play (Which it is, it is the demonstration the developers chose to shocase the game with.....) then this game should bomb.

It will still sell a million copies becauase of the hype and the reviews EA is going to buy from the big gaming sites, but its still pretty much the death of the intelligent, tactical RPG I was hoping for.

OurSacrifice
03-01-2011, 09:17 AM
How about thanking the designers or the producers?

Because they can't do anything when their publishers tell them when and what to release. I guess you think developers/producers are their own bosses, but they aren't. When a publisher like EA owns you, you sacrifice quality for quantity.

Edit: Oh the SIMS. Isnt the studio still active? It hasnt been closed down from what I know. DICE Canada was a branch that hadnt really published anything on it's own. It sucks to see people lose their jobs but that's all it was.

Maxis was closed and relocated. They were offered no transfer packages and almost everyone except for Will Wright was jobless when it happened.

DICE Canada worked with DICE, and was responsible for expansion packs and patches, allowing the core DICE team to work on future games/engines.

But it's ok, you're an EA cheerleader - every publisher has them, even ones as bad as EA. After all, they're "just jobs".

Take care, clown.

DTKT
03-01-2011, 09:21 AM
Because they can't do anything when their publishers tell them when and what to release. I guess you think developers/producers are their own bosses, but they aren't. When a publisher like EA owns you, you sacrifice quality for quantity.



Maxis was closed and relocated. They were offered no transfer packages and almost everyone except for Will Wright was jobless when it happened.

DICE Canada worked with DICE, and was responsible for expansion packs and patches, allowing the core DICE team to work on future games/engines.

But it's ok, you're an EA cheerleader - every publisher has them, even ones as bad as EA. After all, they're "just jobs".

Take care, clown.

God damn, the hostility of some people is incredible. I do not consider myself a "cheerleader" for anyone but simply trying to provide another position.

If someone cant post without being hostile, please dont post. It's not worth your time and anyones attention.

greyghost515
03-01-2011, 09:23 AM
I'm going to miss DA:O. I only beat it once as a rogue (so I know full well about the jerky, somewhat off melee combat of the first game) but I completed almost every side quest and got my warden to level 28 with a little over 100 hrs game time.

However, I'm anticipating DA2 simply because the story and the new characters intrigue me and I throughly enjoyed the revamped combat.

The combat seemed fluid but still tactical during the Ogre fight. This was exactly the same as the normal setting of DA:O, even more so after the patches. Normal difficulty is somewhat easy while being a small challenge during bosses, while the harder difficulties required careful planning. The smoothness of the action was a welcome change to the stiffness of the combat in the first game, again, especially as melee. I enjoyed the fact that all three classes feel powerful as oppose to DA:O when it was basically that if you were anything other than a Mage set for heavy AoE and CC, you felt almost useless and little more than a Mana sponge for your healer. Now, my rogue FEELS like a bringer of death by shadow and the warrior just plays out right badass when they were even less than useful in DA:O in anything above normal except as a tank.

The story is what's really grabbing my attention, although we know only so much about it. Not quite like Mass Effect's continues timeline from the PoV of the main hero, but not like Elder Scrolls where your past endeavors in the lore wasn't ever acknowledged in a fulfilling way. Your warden is still active, in the background, while you're learning about the exploits of a new character, The Champion. The few characters shown, even Ivaline's reactions to Isabella during that short segment in the latter half of the demo, look like they'll be just as interesting and engaging as the characters in DA:O.

I won't be able to play this game at launch, however, I'll be in basic training. But I'm looking forward to digging into this adventure as soon as I can.

MunkiLord
03-01-2011, 09:45 AM
God damn, the hostility of some people is incredible. I do not consider myself a "cheerleader" for anyone but simply trying to provide another position.

If someone cant post without being hostile, please dont post. It's not worth your time and anyones attention.

Pretty impressive, you were directly insulted twice simply for stating(paraphrasing here) "EA isn't that bad."

I do often wonder how people like that function in a job situation or society in general when they call anybody that disagrees with them a clown or fool.

DTKT
03-01-2011, 09:56 AM
Pretty impressive, you were directly insulted twice simply for stating(paraphrasing here) "EA isn't that bad."

I do often wonder how people like that function in a job situation or society in general when they call anybody that disagrees with them a clown or fool.

I have honestly no idea.
:(

OurSacrifice
03-01-2011, 10:16 AM
Pretty impressive, you were directly insulted twice simply for stating(paraphrasing here) "EA isn't that bad."

I do often wonder how people like that function in a job situation or society in general when they call anybody that disagrees with them a clown or fool.

He's a clown because they're "just jobs" and he all but ignored the fact that EA has closed down almost every single studio they've purchased.

That's what makes him the EA cheerleader.

"Guys, EA isn't that bad!"
"But they close studios after they buy them."
"They're just jobs!"

DTKT
03-01-2011, 10:19 AM
He's a clown because they're "just jobs" and he all but ignored the fact that EA has closed down almost every single studio they've purchased.

That's what makes him the EA cheerleader.

"Guys, EA isn't that bad!"
"But they close studios after they buy them."
"They're just jobs!"

Isnt that what it was? It suck, I worked in QA for a 1 year. We are the sector where there is the most layoff and that's not from time to time. It's all the time. Hell, I got laid-off.

But it makes no sense to paint the picture of an evil corporation when you have no idea how it works and are just watching from the sidelines.

Clock King
03-01-2011, 10:50 AM
Isnt that what it was? It suck, I worked in QA for a 1 year. We are the sector where there is the most layoff and that's not from time to time. It's all the time. Hell, I got laid-off.

But it makes no sense to paint the picture of an evil corporation when you have no idea how it works and are just watching from the sidelines.

You got laid off by EA? I though I remember you from the BioWare forums no so long ago (at a time when they were purging dissent there a-la 1936 Stalinist USSR) explaining that despite your username appearing as cheerleader in other places, you were NOT 'connected' to EA or BioWare????

kozzy420
03-01-2011, 11:08 AM
This game looked HORRIBLE from the screenshots and videos... BUT... I trust Bioware (I have bought all there games all have been good).

There is alot of things I was worried about for this game, but the demo made me not worry about the combat or graphics.

THis is an RPG.. all that really matters to me is story, characters, rpg elements and gameplay.

I will be playing this game on day 1, I am still a little worried, but not as much now.

I think some people are jumping to to many conclusions without playing the game. Hey I loved Origins and wanted them to keep Dragon Age2 pretty much the same, but I am willing to try this one out.

Not to mention PC gamer said its BETTER then the first one in almost every way possible. PC Gamer is the only reviews that I agree with from time to time.

DTKT
03-01-2011, 11:10 AM
You got laid off by EA? I though I remember you from the BioWare forums no so long ago (at a time when they were purging dissent there a-la 1936 Stalinist USSR) explaining that despite your username appearing as cheerleader in other places, you were NOT 'connected' to EA or BioWare????

Ubisoft and EA. :)

If I had the same handle name, it was probably me. Though I would have a hard time remembering what I had posted several weeks ago.

Anyway, let's just cut it for now. I dont believe there is nothing else really worth to discuss.

SpiritWolf
03-01-2011, 12:46 PM
I have to say, I was more discouraged about da2 before I played the demo. Now I have I can't wait for it, and have placed my pre-order :)

KK_reborn
03-01-2011, 12:55 PM
*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your alliesNot sure if this was mentioned before but if you tried to customize your character at the beginning of the game, it said it was disabled for the demo (at least for the PS3 version of it).

Meanbud
03-01-2011, 01:47 PM
Well, I played the demo. I pre-ordered DA:O and liked it very much. Even did a second play-through, which I rarely do with any non-multi-player game.
They fixed my biggest complaint from DO:O and that is your main character being a mute while everyone else spoke and had speaking animations.
DA:O2 - no friendly fire? Ridiculous movements? monsters that all look alike? Ogre that goes toe-to-toe with a human fighter? All the complaints that others have mentioned, I agree with most.
I will probably get this game, but will not pre-order. I will get when 9.99, just like ME2.
Thanks go out to EA for destroying yet another franshise that I loved.

Mithridate
03-01-2011, 04:08 PM
Dialogue system is still the same.

Damn son :eek:


The darkspawn look like ♥♥♥♥ing skeletor!?
well with every <dont recall the name> rules over them affects the appearance and martial abilities of the darspawn


As said, no its depending on the broodmother and her origins.

I just dont get why they changed the looks on the darkspawn so much, especially since they´re supposed to be the very same as in DA:O. Sure sevral years later in the story they could have looked diff but either way... come on BioWare, thats the best you can do?

detroit022
03-01-2011, 07:10 PM
i agree, but the combat still kinda sucks. But its better than the origins combat, in that one, the combat was too slow and boring. Now its just too unrealistic.

Swell
03-01-2011, 10:23 PM
Did cancel my order just now. Bought the disk to save some money so I dont expect any troubles with my cancellation. Thou I like the action in the game it made me control one char all the time(I want to see the action). It looks and feel more like a console game than DA1 I think. Also the DLC advertising before gamerelease turns me off.

sit_on_it
03-01-2011, 11:54 PM
Not sure if this was mentioned before but if you tried to customize your character at the beginning of the game, it said it was disabled for the demo (at least for the PS3 version of it).

He's talking about the customization difference between DAO and DA2. No race to choose from, apart from human of course ;)

KK_reborn
03-02-2011, 07:12 AM
He's talking about the customization difference between DAO and DA2. No race to choose from, apart from human of course ;)Well he did say no customization whatsoever. The "whatsoever" part is wrong. There's customization, just not the customizing he wants.

Cosmictrippin
03-02-2011, 07:28 AM
God damn, the hostility of some people is incredible. I do not consider myself a "cheerleader" for anyone but simply trying to provide another position.

If someone cant post without being hostile, please dont post. It's not worth your time and anyones attention.

maybe you haven't been gaming long enough to have an opinion of EA. They are garbage.

Aemony
03-02-2011, 07:49 AM
maybe you haven't been gaming long enough to have an opinion of EA. They are garbage.

You mean having a 'valid' opinion? >_<

Sonris89
03-02-2011, 07:55 AM
EA can pump out some gems but the way it works is like this, EA publishes games, it dosn't develop them. Which is why EA has a few good games and alot of bad games. For ever bioware EA has it has a dozen or so other divisions pumping out lego harry potter 6 or such crap.

Granted the way EA might push for due dates can rush games out too early, and its marketing division can make crap games look good which I think are the two major complaints people get from EA.

For me I have a mixxed opinion of the company. I love Bioware games, and I liked Command and conquer Tib wars (but Red alert 3 and the other tiberium they made were crap imo)

Kanten
03-02-2011, 08:00 AM
EA can pump out some gems but the way it works is like this, EA publishes games, it dosn't develop them. Which is why EA has a few good games and alot of bad games. For ever bioware EA has it has a dozen or so other divisions pumping out lego harry potter 6 or such crap.

Uh no, we don't hate EA because they publish Harry Potter 6.

We hate EA because they buy out companies like Westwood, Bullfrog, Pandemic and Bioware and run them into the ground.

berggren75
03-02-2011, 08:47 AM
Uh no, we don't hate EA because they publish Harry Potter 6.

We hate EA because they buy out companies like Westwood, Bullfrog, Pandemic and Bioware and run them into the ground.

Nuff said.

My Preorder just got cancelled FOR me.

Turns out EA only can deliver 10% of the ordered copies to stores here in Denmark, so I got shafted.

Good thing though, as I were starting to lean towards cancelling it myself.

Ronlaen
03-02-2011, 10:16 AM
Was looking forward to it but did not preorder it. After the demo though I'm quite certain this is a no buy.

oikoumenikos
03-02-2011, 10:58 AM
Immersion gone IMHO (at least for Rogue) in combat. By using the mouse the flanking maneuvers and the satisfying backstabbing added a lot in it. Same with engaging with thanks and run to wipe out mage/bowmen. Yes, run risking some nailing. That's involvement. Jumping 20m and clicking for auto backstabbing, well, just isn't.
Of course, it's easy for playboxers to jump aboard. Pity...

Sonris89
03-02-2011, 11:03 AM
Immersion gone IMHO (at least for Rogue) in combat. By using the mouse the flanking maneuvers and the satisfying backstabbing added a lot in it. Same with engaging with thanks and run to wipe out mage/bowmen. Yes, run risking some nailing. That's involvement. Jumping 20m and clicking for auto backstabbing, well, just isn't.
Of course, it's easy for playboxers to jump aboard. Pity...


I dunno, I found rogues and the whole flank for crits mechanic dry. I felt like all my rogue did was stealth walk behind things and auto attack, use mark for death if I really wanted it dead.

I can agree they could do without the teleporting, but giving rogues more buttons to press for a rotation besides maybe a sustained mode and a debuff is a plus to me.

greyghost515
03-02-2011, 11:41 PM
Immersion gone IMHO (at least for Rogue) in combat. By using the mouse the flanking maneuvers and the satisfying backstabbing added a lot in it. Same with engaging with thanks and run to wipe out mage/bowmen. Yes, run risking some nailing. That's involvement. Jumping 20m and clicking for auto backstabbing, well, just isn't.
Of course, it's easy for playboxers to jump aboard. Pity...

Like was mentioned, it felt really....hooky in the first game. All I did with my melee rogue was keep certain auras up from dueler and assassin traits and just backstab to oblivion while occasionally stiffly CCin a mob that managed to break through the wall of AoE Wynne and Morrigan set up and was attacking one of them and every now and then reposition him for more backstabs. Staring at my character auto-attacking wasn't the most interesting thing in the word. I saw myself playing more as Morrigan than my PC for this very reason.

Maybe they could have revamped the melee combat without "simplifying" it, but I agree with the devs that it DID need a revamp regardless.

theflash083
03-03-2011, 01:38 AM
I like it much better than the original dragon age; graphics look much better at least on dx11 maxed out? O_o

The HUD is much nicer as well. Sorry i guess i dont see what the big fuss is about.

berggren75
03-03-2011, 01:41 AM
I like it much better than the original dragon age; graphics look much better at least on dx11 maxed out? O_o

The HUD is much nicer as well. Sorry i guess i dont see what the big fuss is about.


Good for you.

Aemony
03-03-2011, 01:46 AM
I like it much better than the original dragon age; graphics look much better at least on dx11 maxed out? O_o

The HUD is much nicer as well. Sorry i guess i dont see what the big fuss is about.

*sigh*

When the day comes when everyone actually begins to realize that feelings and opinions are subjective and not fact as seemingly believed today I will scream out my renewed belief in a bright future for mankind as high as I can in the middle of the day, while at the same time congratulating everyone around me and try to persuade them into a dance or two.

Until then I will keep on sighing each time I'm reminded of the current nature of mankind...

ManOhMan
03-03-2011, 08:47 AM
I loved DA:O probably more so then most people. I played the game five times. And Awakening twice. First time on hard, all other plays on nightmare.

I also played
Leliana's Song
The Darkspawn Chronicles
Return to Ostagar



I played this game for over 300hrs. That's right 300! Not afk time.
Here is the link to my steam games page, and my Bioware profile. With four lvl 22-33 characters.

I add this info so you can see it's not just talk. I LOVED DA:O
But I will not be buying DA 2.

I got the demo and played for maybe 3mins. That's all I need to see I did not like the new combat system. For all the other reasons some have listed idk. But for me CRPGs have always been about strategic combat, planing, placement and when to use such and such ability or w/e at what time. etc.. DA:2 is now a console RPG.

again "I add this info so you can see it's not just talk."

http://steamcommunity.com/id/ManOhMan/games?tab=all

http://social.bioware.com/playerprofile.php?game=dragonage1_pc&nid=2300413033&lang_id=1&persona_id=226177873

My registered DLC
Battledress of the Provocateur Dragon Age: Origins
Leliana's Song Dragon Age: Origins
Feastday Gifts Dragon Age: Origins
Feastday Pranks Dragon Age: Origins
Blightblood Dragon Age: Origins
Return to Ostagar Dragon Age: Origins
Darkspawn Chronicles Dragon Age: Origins
The Edge Dragon Age: Origins
The Lucky Stone Dragon Age: Origins
Blood Dragon Armor Dragon Age: Origins
Warden's Keep Dragon Age: Origins
Memory Band Dragon Age: Origins
The Wicked Oath Dragon Age: Origins
Collector's Edition Dragon Age: Origins
The Stone Prisoner Dragon Age: Origins
Blightblood Dragon Age: Awakening
Battledress of the Provocateur Dragon Age: Awakening

Bioware has to get back to it's roots before i buy another game from them.
And as you can see from my steam stats 250+games I vote with my $$.

yvu
03-03-2011, 09:00 AM
I played this game for over 300hrs. That's right 300!

I played DA:O for... 375 hours! Have all DLCs. It was nice, but DA2 seems better. I have I don't know how many games and I vote with my wallet.

Way to go, BioWare. ;)

ManOhMan
03-03-2011, 09:17 AM
So you like the new dumb combat? /shrug

yvu
03-03-2011, 10:23 AM
So you like the new dumb combat? /shrug

Care to point out what's dumb in it?

And so as not to waste our time:

1. Some people can't even go past first wave in after-legend play, on Nightmare.

2. Nightmare has friendly fire.

3. You can press SPACE to pause combat and SPACE to resume it.

4. You have different classes, "builds", etc so you can experiment with tactics.

Anything besides that?

SpectralShade
03-03-2011, 10:51 AM
I dunno, I found rogues and the whole flank for crits mechanic dry. I felt like all my rogue did was stealth walk behind things and auto attack, use mark for death if I really wanted it dead.

I can agree they could do without the teleporting, but giving rogues more buttons to press for a rotation besides maybe a sustained mode and a debuff is a plus to me.

They could have fixed auras without having to turn combat into a sped-up mortal kombat look-a-like. Designwise your argument doesn't cary weight as it is clear the intent of design was not to fix auras, but to cater for a marketshare that was more attracted to "awesome visual effects" ("if you click A, something awesome happens") than to the marketshare that prefers slow tactical combat where you spent time thinking about what to do. Which is somewhat puzzling, considering it is supposedly a sequel to a game that was targeted precisely to the market segment they are abandoning now.

It begs the question: Why make it a supposed sequel if it is a different game type?

What's next? Quick time events? I can see it happen, regardless of how much I loathe that kind of thing.

Trindogshow
03-03-2011, 11:14 AM
i havent followed da2 much but this thread sounds like kotor 1 vs kotor 2 where it wasn't a true 2.0 sequel but instead more like a 1.5

i have never paid full price for any bioware game although i haven't played them all i have found that a bioware game for $20 is generally a good investment.

lyravega
03-03-2011, 11:22 AM
It begs the question: Why make it a supposed sequel if it is a different game type?

It isn't a sequel. It is a spinoff like Fallout 3 for example. I'd have no objections if the game was called something like, Dragon Age: Chronicles of the Champion, rather than Dragon Age 2. But it just ain't Dragon Age 2.

sfade
03-03-2011, 11:35 AM
They wanted to take advantage of the momentum built by the previous title and expansion while also gorging on new console sales.

To fans of DA:O, this is Dragon Age: Cash Cow Console Catastrophe.

SpectralShade
03-03-2011, 12:20 PM
It isn't a sequel. It is a spinoff like Fallout 3 for example. I'd have no objections if the game was called something like, Dragon Age: Chronicles of the Champion, rather than Dragon Age 2. But it just ain't Dragon Age 2.

I would have prefered it if they had called it something along the lines of: "Dragon Age: Hawkes story" or something in that vein. That way people would know it wasn't a sequel to DA:O, but still something to do with the DA universe. The fans would still take a look at it, Newcomers wouldn't start out by tying it to the gamemechanics by the first, and nobody would get miffed at it not being the sequel then, as the name wouldn't imply it (aside the "Why couldn't you have done a sequel instead?!?!?" comments, but those would be less hurtfull to their reputation than the current ones).

Naming it DA2 seems, to me, a stupid marketing decision to try and milk un-needed on the success of the first game. In basic terms, it seems underhanded of them to name it something it shouldn't have been named at the hope of increasing sales. Ofc, given the interview that is rummagin around at the moment of a certain marketing guy, I guess I shouldn't be surprised at lousy marketing from their side anymore...

Sonris89
03-03-2011, 12:47 PM
Ofc, given the interview that is rummagin around at the moment of a certain marketing guy, I guess I shouldn't be surprised at lousy marketing from their side anymore...


I kinda want to see a response from Bioware and or EA for that, I dunno, I guess it would be cruel to say I want that ♥♥♥♥ fired, but at least an admition that he was an idiot and no one appreciated his commentary or perspective on the game. I haven't seen a game rep bomb that badly since the giant enemy crab fiasco :rolleyes:.

Meanbud
03-03-2011, 07:07 PM
sfade said:

"To fans of DA:O, this is Dragon Age: Cash Cow Console Catastrophe."

I love it. Nails it perfectly.

x181
03-03-2011, 08:03 PM
It isn't a sequel. It is a spinoff like Fallout 3 for example. I'd have no objections if the game was called something like, Dragon Age: Chronicles of the Champion, rather than Dragon Age 2. But it just ain't Dragon Age 2.

Dragon Age Arcade.

berggren75
03-03-2011, 11:43 PM
I loved DA:O, and have played it for a LOT of hours. I have every DLC that can be bought for it as well.

But the direction they're taking DA2 (I agree with those that think the game never should have been announced as a sequel), in, means that I'm NOT going to buy it.

I might pick it up from a discount bin eventually, but I'll not be paying anywhere near the retail price for it.

It simply lacks to much of DA:O for me to want that. I STINKS of a console port. A fact that I resent.

Mithridate
03-04-2011, 12:19 AM
It isn't a sequel. It is a spinoff like Fallout 3 for example. I'd have no objections if the game was called something like, Dragon Age: Chronicles of the Champion, rather than Dragon Age 2. But it just ain't Dragon Age 2.

Could not have put it in a better way

Zechnophobe
03-04-2011, 03:40 PM
Things I don't like:

*Cliche Writing

Er.. really? The demo didn't really have a whole lot of writing in it, and also specifically jumps around a bit in the stream of the plot, I'm not even sure if you could tell. I at least hadn't got this impression, and I'm generally a bit of a snob on writing.

*The enemies don't look like scary super mutant monsters anymore, they now look like the plural name for a cowardly man and a cat and die in hordes taking out any thrill or worry for the PC.


Disagree on the visuals, but I do agree that the paradigm shift of fighting 2 to 4 at a time, to fighting MANY at a time seems a bit odd. Not sure if that is a permanent change, or just one of those things that happens in the tutorial part of the game.

*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest


Meh, seems a pretty minor gripe. You don't know anything about the rest of the story here. It might be pretty reasonable.


*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.


I just don't understand this gripe at all. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'd be a lot more convinced by 'graphics are terrible' arguments if I had a good side-by-side to see. I get the feeling they are just using a different style and so it seems new and different at a glance.


*No customization whatsoever. [multiple races to choose from, customizing the loadout of your allies]


I don't know what the loadout situation is, so maybe that's true. But as far as I can tell, the only customization you don't have is race, which likely means they are going to have a stronger narrative that didn't allow such deviance.


*The "allies" of your character being nothing more than plot tools rather than actual gameplay assests

What are you basing this off of? I didn't see anything in the Demo that made me think that.

*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.

I'm pretty sure this is exactly the same as DA:O, isn't it? THey had day 1 DLC there too. I just won't buy it... no big deal.

*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class

Go watch a mage in DA:O shoot its staff at something. Now go play the demo again. Do you really think the previous had better animations?

*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.


Once again, I'd like to see a side-by-side of this, since I'm not convinced it is true.


*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.


IT WAS A DEMO! How the heck much emotional attachment are you expecting? You basically did half of the equivalent of the 'origin' part of the game. What attachment are you expecting? Were you that attached to your dwarven friend and sister in DA:O when playing as a commoner? Or... that uh, elvish friend as a Dalish?


*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll


This was true in DA:O too. Until the end, Logain was a lot stronger than you were, right? If you'd faced him early on, he'd have cut you down really fast. Same with that knight captain chick. The only reason it feels any different, is that now you are the protaganist AND a bad-♥♥♥ who isn't a grey warden.


* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there


I didn't notice, but it is possible I just missed it, so I won't refute it. I may play the demo again and see if I notice it.


_______________________


All in all, these just don't seem to be the kind of gripes that warrant boycot, or such anger. It isn't like femHawke wears a tutu and uses fancy ballet-based combat moves to defeat waves of darkspawn or something, or in the good ending you organize them into a rag-tag dance troupe to learn the true meaning of 'sharing'.

I'm not going to say you are wrong to HAVE these opinions, but it seems like:

1) You are putting too much weight on minor points
2) Are misremembering the quality of the first one
3) Making assumptions that don't seem strongly supported by the Demo.

Take from that what you will.

Nicodemus_MM
03-04-2011, 05:40 PM
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.

This is the proverbial straw that broke this camel's back.

Bioware... goodbye.

:mad:

iKai
03-04-2011, 10:25 PM
Things I don't like:

*The fact that "One man will save the world" where in the first game, the entire continent had to unite despite previous civil unrest
*The graphics are so ugly. DAO1 was so much prettier imo
*The colors of the game are ugly as well. The hair colors don't look right, and the color of the enemies and landscape are very very bland. Like eating a bowl of rice with nothing in it but the rice.
*The fact that Bioware is already going to sell Day 1 DLC with the extra character, on top of a $60 purchase.
*The animations of your characters are bland and over the top as well as there is not much variation between the 3 animations of each class
*Enemies animations are absolutely pathetic compared to DAO1 where they weren't all twitching and crazy.
*No variation between the characters and no emotional attachment to them.
*A regular guy is stronger and faster than superhuman Grey Wardens. Basically negating all Grey Warden accomplishments in the first game and practically being a Retcon. Once again Steamroll
* Like the previous point, feel more of a reboot of the franchise rather than a true sequel.
*The "Dramatic Hollywood music" played when the seeker is talking to the dwarf, trying to distract the user from the bad dialogue and pretty much trying to sound like every over hyped Hollywood movie out there

I'm sorry Bioware but as a long time supporter I can no longer buy your overpriced games when you completely compromise your gameplay for more money. If I did support this I would be an enabler. This is how consumers speak: with their wallets.

+1 OP, your points are my thoughts already.

defrisselle
03-04-2011, 10:28 PM
The Witcher II FTW!

iKai
03-04-2011, 10:31 PM
The Witcher II FTW!

The first doesn't even play well...uninstalled it after 5mins. Not the only one.

Combat system also was crap.

Sonris89
03-04-2011, 10:36 PM
The first doesn't even play well...uninstalled it after 5mins. Not the only one.

Combat system also was crap.

He meant skyrim. ;)

runtheplacered
03-04-2011, 10:48 PM
The first doesn't even play well...uninstalled it after 5mins. Not the only one.

Combat system also was crap.

Well considering the game is on an entirely different engine with a brand new combat system I don't really understand what your point is.

Oh btw, the first one was great. But that's besides the point.

iKai
03-04-2011, 10:49 PM
I'd wait for a demo of witcher 2.

DA2 & Crysis 2's demos are already a load different from the hype they've generated thus far.

Overt.Enemy
03-04-2011, 11:32 PM
Yes, 2-3 days after the magazine came out. The article had to be written at least a few weeks before that.

I'm just skeptical because PC Gamer seemingly got a full copy of game and completed it for a review weeks before going gold, and not a single other publication has.

You really have no idea though so you're basically just guessing.

doford
03-05-2011, 12:23 AM
From reviews I thought the game had changed too much. After playing the demo I was impressed.

The demo plays into the idea that hawk isn't really this one man saves the world kind of guy. Having his name as hawk was no different to been called grey warden. We can still pick a first name. The only major differences in the game was UI, lack of playable races and faster combat animations. Everything else is pretty much the same.

Sonris89
03-05-2011, 12:30 AM
From reviews I thought the game had changed too much. After playing the demo I was impressed.

The demo plays into the idea that hawk isn't really this one man saves the world kind of guy. Having his name as hawk was no different to been called grey warden. We can still pick a first name. The only major differences in the game was UI, lack of playable races and faster combat animations. Everything else is pretty much the same.

Pretty much my sentiments of the game.

Kodai2003
03-05-2011, 11:19 AM
I just wanted to add that I just requested to cancel my preorder due to the BS of day one DLC. I was looking forward to getting this game, but am kinda tired of having to keep buying more stuff just to get everything the developer's intended to be in the game.
Just my feeling's on it, you of course can continue with your own.

Oh and I saw someone mention of DA:O having day one DLC, I don't recall anything like that with Origins. However I do recall something like that with ME2, but the difference was that I got that DLC free with my purchase not an additional $7 after i already laid out $60 for the game.

Sonris89
03-05-2011, 11:29 AM
I agree the DLC is stupid, hell, all of the DLC for origins was crap to begin with to boot ( I think they averaged around a 65 for metacritiic and thats being generous)

But canceling an order because of a redundent archer companion?

Meh, I dunno, I don't want sebastion anyway, so I wont be getting his content.

On a funny note, Dragon age 2's steam page on my library had a news feed about someone complaining about day one DLC. Its like they are proud of it. I wouldn't be flashing negative press around if it were me thats for sure.

Voera
03-05-2011, 02:21 PM
-A whole twenty minutes and you have an opinion on the story? Probably not a very good one!
-I assume you're also mad because flemeth looks like a wtich of the wilds now, as well? there were garbage enemies in DA:O too, they just had their HP bars expanded to fit everything else's
-This is a valid critique on the plot. The first point is not. However, bear in mind that you've only encountered Humans and Darkspawn; You have no idea how demons look, do you?
-Firstly, there is no "DAO1." There is DA:O, its expansion pack Awakening (which people seem to regard as a standalone game?), and DA2. The graphics aren't ugly. You don't like the art scheme. The difference is comparable to Gamebryo and bethesda's games: Most of the bugs in Fallout 3/NV/Oblivion/Etcetera is a resul of game bugs, not engine bugs (EG a script not doing what it's supposed to do).
-For the first two thirds of the demo, you are fighting in a blight-covered mountainside. Rocks and death aren't very paletable items, are they? The other third takes place in a vivid (if dimly lit (it's night time get over it)) cathedral and the square below it. Not very bland.
-In DA:O, the only difference between being race X and being race Y was HOW you got kicked out of wherever you lived; besides that and a few race/origin specific dialogue options (that almost never change the conversation and feels more like something they stuck in there as filler), there was no real difference. THe only exception to this rule is being a Human Noble, in which you can marry alistair/that ♥♥♥♥♥.
-They serve the exact same function as DA:O, then? Each character could have been categorized by alignment between good and evil, and main class. The difference between Leliana and Zevran? One's naive, the other's an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Da2's companions still have their own plot lines, as well as their classes. What's so different?
-They have already stated that they created the character AFTER the disk had been locked and shipped out, which is usually months in advance for larger companies.
-It's much better than DA:O's samey "shimmey to enemy, repeat attacking animation" blandness. Just as well, the new animations give combat a much more visceral feel.
-The animations match the art style. In DA:O, darkspawn were clearly mutated humans, looking like they just finished a bath in a vat of radioactive sludge. As such, they moved and acted much more "meaty" than they do in DA2, since they resemble half-dead monsters instead.
-How can you get an emotional attachment to the characters in a twenty minute demo? The variation is the same as DA:O.
-Grey wardens were far from superhumans: All they could do was not get killed by The Blight (since they're already infected) and could sense darkspawn (because they ARE darkspawn and part of the "hivemind", in a sense). The act of becoming a grey warden is a high-risk version of using a small amount of snake venom to create vaccines. Do you find it even more outlandish that the companions from both games, of which there are very few grey wardens, are on par with them? Grey warden is just a title given to the people who sacrifice a lot of their life to sense when a blight is coming. They don't gain any extra "skills."
-The definition of a sequel is a story that takes place in the same setting as a previous story; It very much is a sequel.
-This is a matter of ambient soundtract design, but I think it fits; The air between them conveys a feeling of tension, and the soundtrack reflects

luckystalker
03-05-2011, 03:08 PM
I was just going to pre order the game and then I saw that the game length is 30 hours and we are going to get a DLC in the first day.

No purchase for me. Short story and hundreds of DLCs is not my cup of tea, especially for a full price. Go to hell EA.
I bet they are going to blame the piracy again.

Keak
03-05-2011, 05:03 PM
Yeah but The Fade and Deep Roads didn't make up 90% of the game like Kirkwall apparently is.

Denerim looked like a city where people live. Kirkwall looks like some architect went insane and put a bunch of giant concrete cubes everywhere.

Thats just brilliant man.I so agree.

MellonCollie
03-05-2011, 05:47 PM
TL;DR

It uses the same DRM that AC2 uses.

Mivo
03-05-2011, 06:01 PM
I pre-ordered it after playing the demo. :) No, I don't think it'll be as spectacular as DA:O, and it is going to be much shorter, but I like the voice acting and 40 Euro for 30+ hours of quality entertainment is worth it for me. It's pretty much the same entertainment/price ratio as for books, and much cheaper than going to the movies.

I understand the concern, but personally I'm interested in the story and don't mind the H&S approach. I'm not looking for a game that drags out over 100 hours or that I can play through five times. That's what MMOs are for.

defrisselle
03-05-2011, 06:10 PM
The first doesn't even play well...uninstalled it after 5mins. Not the only one.

Combat system also was crap.


Wow! You've played a game that isn't even out yet. Amazing!

m4dvillain
03-05-2011, 08:57 PM
the only issue i have with DA2 is that the combat feels alien aesthetic-wise from the first game; you now get hawke, who wields a giant-♥♥♥ sword and flicks it around like he doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥, what i like from the first game is that if you wield a giant hammer; it feels like it's heavy and it's very satisfying to swing it at someone; then pause the action to see the impact that hammer is going to make. the action i've seen in gameplay videos so far belong to another universe, imo.

apart from that; it's more of the same, and i'm a sucker for bioware RPG's.