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View Full Version : Did I shoot myself in the foot by not researching explosive path?


kalirion
03-22-2011, 08:33 AM
How important are rockets & other explosives?

Just beat Mars without even researching one step into explosives. Is it too late to start now? Should I start now?

Last few missions I've been using a lot of powerups per mission too... Considering I use them faster than I acquire them that can't be good, right?

Spykirby
03-22-2011, 08:42 AM
mines are incredible usefull at the moon, because they can instantly kill those big titans that go for buildings, instead of your base :O I dunno about the rest, but I guess it's never to late ^^

Sylenall
03-22-2011, 08:46 AM
Mines dont take very long at all to research, and they are useful, so get them now.

Rocket launchers have a longer research path and are very powerful, but are about as much trouble as they are worth, because they will wipe out your entire defensive line in a friendly-fire bonanza if they shoot at even one titan that gets too close.

Spykirby
03-22-2011, 08:50 AM
Mines dont take very long at all to research, and they are useful, so get them now.

Rocket launchers have a longer research path and are very powerful, but are about as much trouble as they are worth, because they will wipe out your entire defensive line in a friendly-fire bonanza if they shoot at even one titan that gets too close.

rockets are awesome yea :) they do quite a lot of damage and have a huge splash zone. They care about nothing beside their K/D ratio and will aim for any titan. Even when they stand right next to your main base.

kalirion
03-22-2011, 08:54 AM
rockets are awesome yea :) they do quite a lot of damage and have a huge splash zone. They care about nothing beside their K/D ratio and will aim for any titan. Even when they stand right next to your main base.

So till now I've been massing turrets right around the base, and titans get close to it pretty quickly. I honestly don't see how rockets would do anything but hurt me - unless I plant them way away from the rest of my stuff, but then they'll be taken down by the titans, right?

Also, I usually start with 5000-8000 credits per level, so rockets may be a bit too expensive for me....

Spykirby
03-22-2011, 08:55 AM
So till now I've been massing turrets right around the base, and titans get close to it pretty quickly. I honestly don't see how rockets would do anything but hurt me - unless I plant them way away from the rest of my stuff, but then they'll be taken down by the titans, right?

Also, I usually start with 5000-8000 credits per level, so rockets may be a bit too expensive for me....

yea they are not that usefull in most cases, but if you got a big map and can plant the rockets somewhere out of range from your base with a view on the enemy they can do quite some damage ^^

mines however are always awesome :) their explosive range ain't that big, so your defences can be placed relatively near to them and they can get rid of the weaker titans without a problem. The quad mines can be placed in their path, while the normal mines can be used even more effective by placing them in the middle of a group of titans to cause damage to all.

kalirion
03-22-2011, 09:10 AM
The quad mines can be placed in their path, while the normal mines can be used even more effective by placing them in the middle of a group of titans to cause damage to all.

So basically use them as mini-smart bombs?

Are mines expensive?

I also don't have spread cannons or assault cannons yet - my weapons consist of light & heavy blasters, blast cannons, lasers, capacitors and droid factories.

Most maps I don't even bother putting up refineries because I try to get my defenses up as quickly as possible.

Honestly I must be doing something wrong - not a level goes by where I don't use up 3-4 powerups - soon I'll have none left!

Spykirby
03-22-2011, 09:19 AM
So basically use them as mini-smart bombs?

Are mines expensive?

I also don't have spread cannons or assault cannons yet - my weapons consist of light & heavy blasters, blast cannons, lasers, capacitors and droid factories.

Most maps I don't even bother putting up refineries because I try to get my defenses up as quickly as possible.

Honestly I must be doing something wrong - not a level goes by where I don't use up 3-4 powerups - soon I'll have none left!

no they are not that expensive. They are accually pretty cheap consider how destructive they are to the titans, but they are limited so you should use them as effective as possible. However you probably want to research the 2x damage and 2x radius aswell. They don't require any additional research, after getting mines.

kalirion
03-22-2011, 10:49 AM
no they are not that expensive. They are accually pretty cheap consider how destructive they are to the titans, but they are limited so you should use them as effective as possible. However you probably want to research the 2x damage and 2x radius aswell. They don't require any additional research, after getting mines.

Ok, so would you recommend researching / upgrading the mines as fast as possible, and leaving stronger turrets & upgrades for later?

I also only have the first wall researched right now - damn it runs out quickly. Not sure if shield buildings are worth it - $2500 is pretty expensive for 1 armor, or so it seems to me.

Edit: Hey, I just realized something - when I researched Lazers and Droid Factories for first time, I only got 1 to use per mission, but that number slowly went up to 5. However the walls are staying at 20. Is there a way to increase it with research? If I don't use the walls in one mission, will the surplus carry over to the next?

tb87670
03-22-2011, 11:41 AM
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1799923

Read through that link and there are many answers to many questions.

To be direct, things with limited number can have the excess stored and saved up for later use, concrete barricades for example make 20 barricades per level, steel barricades make 15 per level. So in 5 levels, if you don't use any of those barricades, you will have 100 concrete barricades and 75 steel barricades at your disposal. What I do is even when things are a bit rough I save about 5 of each barricade each level, that way I never run out because some harder levels I panic and have to lay down a few extra because of giant titans coming from the wrong way or bad planning, etc. Also space them out, like when you plant separate each barricade just one notch or two from the last and you can double your reach for those titans that run around.

On the Earth missions I tend to have Concrete and Steel barricades researched by the last mission, that's only 2 research points and they can really be handy anytime. Mines I went without until Mars, and as mentioned before you can really use them as a mini-smart bomb, especially if you get the Shaped Plastic Explosive upgrade that doubles the blast radius. Say you got a refinery all alone and one of the small numbers of smart titans go for it, put a few down in the path and you don't need to invest in a turret and it's boosters. Or if you have like one or two titans manage to walk around your barricades, past your turrets and are going to the base, just toss a few down. Mind you mines are like barricades, you get 20 mines each mission, so try to save a few for when you are pinched.

About your research, using Blast Cannons and Multiblasters for the majority of my dirty work is exactly where I am right now on the 9th Mars mission. For the 8th Mars mission, just for kicks, I built 2 laser cannons next to each other and made a deathstar base where Titan paths intersected. I boosted them with 4 scanners, 4 batteries, and 4 reloaders. I beat the level with a pristine medal because they didn't send a single armored alien at me by luck, the 9th mission I had to quit on because I ran out of time but the lasers couldn't go through the armored aliens on that level. I might even try restarting my campaign over and giving the spread-shot tech tree a try.

Again, read through that hints and tips section link a few users put up, in general that will lead you to a better game.

Sylenall
03-22-2011, 11:41 AM
Ok, so would you recommend researching / upgrading the mines as fast as possible, and leaving stronger turrets & upgrades for later?

I also only have the first wall researched right now - damn it runs out quickly. Not sure if shield buildings are worth it - $2500 is pretty expensive for 1 armor, or so it seems to me.

Edit: Hey, I just realized something - when I researched Lazers and Droid Factories for first time, I only got 1 to use per mission, but that number slowly went up to 5. However the walls are staying at 20. Is there a way to increase it with research? If I don't use the walls in one mission, will the surplus carry over to the next?

The heavy tech system works in that you get 1 per mission up to a total of 5 if you keep them alive or dont use them for 5 missions.

Walls unfortunately work the same(not sure what the hoarding limit is though), which isn't really good enough since 20 units of wall(I think steel walls get less than that for some reason) isn't really good enough to do much, and waiting and hording for something like walls just seems pointless given their disposable nature.

Cas mentioned that walls and mines would be getting a buff in the next update, for which I am grateful.

http://www.puppygames.net/blog/?p=857#comments

kalirion
03-22-2011, 11:56 AM
Ok, thanks both of you!

Guess I really need to research mines and Steel walls, so I can save them up a bit....

About 5.5 hours into the game so far, wonder how long until I hit a brick wall and have to start over from the beginning, with smarter research allocation?

Sylenall
03-22-2011, 12:03 PM
Ok, thanks both of you!

Guess I really need to research mines and Steel walls, so I can save them up a bit....

About 5.5 hours into the game so far, wonder how long until I hit a brick wall and have to start over from the beginning, with smarter research allocation?

I seriously doubt that you will have to restart.

Just make sure you have lasers for flying gidrahs and something (either x-ray or capacitors) to deal with ghosts. Good armor piercing weapons are a must too(blast cannon). If you find yourself really lacking anything you can go back acouple levels and research it instead.

kalirion
03-22-2011, 01:07 PM
I seriously doubt that you will have to restart.

Just make sure you have lasers for flying gidrahs and something (either x-ray or capacitors) to deal with ghosts. Good armor piercing weapons are a must too(blast cannon). If you find yourself really lacking anything you can go back acouple levels and research it instead.

I have lasers and capacitors. I gave x-rays a shot, but my turrets still didn't target ghosts, so I restarted the level and chose something else instead. I'm just worried at the fact that I'm using up my powerups at a much faster rate than I acquire them...

tb87670
03-22-2011, 06:25 PM
I try to never touch my powerups, sometimes restarting levels a few times to make sure so. I may use powerups once every 3-5 levels, but when I do I typically use a pair of them like freeze and berzerk, that way I can use less turrets in a pinch and save a few thousand $ on that level. And I got like 3 of each powerup on the right side on hand at all times too, which is handy since I'm at the last Mars level and I might burn 1-2 per level on the next area maybe.

kalirion
03-22-2011, 07:55 PM
Ok, just encountered the fliers. DAMN those things are annoying. My "defend only the base" strategy was a complete failure as those little bomber drop their load on dying. Even with a 4 scanner laser that means the bombs would drop right in the middle of my defense line!

Glad I had 18k starting money. Was forced to build a really expensive (7+k) secondary defense line just to catch the fliers away from the base. Too bad I must have missed some of the bonuses they dropped since they were so far away and you don't get the nice notifier when a monster drops a bonus. And one flier still got through, forcing me to use a shield powerup.

In the end, that level cost me just over 2k to my bottom line, but at least I only used that single powerup.

Still haven't figured out a good way to use mines though. Not sure where to place them - apparently you can't place them on top of an enemy like a smart bomb. But I don't want to waste them on the small fry, and I don't have time to zoom around the map looking for bigger titans to place mines directly in front of - I mainly spend my time sweating at the capacitor controls.

just_dont_do_it
03-23-2011, 01:56 AM
You cannot place anything *on* titans, but you can almost always place something just *in between* titans if you click enough.

kalirion
03-23-2011, 07:13 AM
You cannot place anything *on* titans, but you can almost always place something just *in between* titans if you click enough.

Hmm, would holding and dragging work? I just found out about this placement technique yesterday - really useful for barricades.

Actually now I just encountered the smart guys that go out of their way to hit the refineries, so I need to figure out an efficient way to protect them on one side of the map while I'm concentrating on defending the base on the other side. My normal defensive lines would cost way more than even buffed refineries could make over the map....

I don't suppose they'll get discouraged by seeing a minefield?

princec
03-23-2011, 07:30 AM
Hmm, would holding and dragging work? I just found out about this placement technique yesterday - really useful for barricades.

Actually now I just encountered the smart guys that go out of their way to hit the refineries, so I need to figure out an efficient way to protect them on one side of the map while I'm concentrating on defending the base on the other side. My normal defensive lines would cost way more than even buffed refineries could make over the map....

I don't suppose they'll get discouraged by seeing a minefield?

Handily no, they can't see mines :)

BTW mines (and explosives in general) are especially effective on the little bomb gidrahs with fuses...

Cas :)

kalirion
03-23-2011, 07:49 AM
Handily no, they can't see mines :)

BTW mines (and explosives in general) are especially effective on the little bomb gidrahs with fuses...

Cas :)

What about the big ones? Those seem to take a full capacitor charge to "disarm"! (I still don't have rockets)

I really wish there was a Pause function so that nothing moves or shoots or harvests, but you can zoom around the map to take stock of the situation, click on bonuses, and maybe even place structures.

Now if you tell me such a function exists, I'll feel really dumb :)

princec
03-23-2011, 08:40 AM
What about the big ones? Those seem to take a full capacitor charge to "disarm"! (I still don't have rockets)

I really wish there was a Pause function so that nothing moves or shoots or harvests, but you can zoom around the map to take stock of the situation, click on bonuses, and maybe even place structures.

Now if you tell me such a function exists, I'll feel really dumb :)

Sadly no there's no such function. It'd sorta be a bit like cheating, a bit :) Maybe somebody will make a mod.

The explosive gidrahs are especially vulnerable to explosions - the merest bang and they simply explode. Make sure they explode some way away from your stuff of course :)

Cas :)

kalirion
03-23-2011, 05:52 PM
Ok, I'm in Titan and have reached the point where I seriously need some help (no, I don't want to turn down the difficulty level :))

My problem is that I don't know what to do about the titans that go after my refineries! I can't afford to protect them the way I want to, so I'm left with the 2-3 crystals on each map that are far enough away for the titans to ignore.

Went into Titan with $25k, lost $5k first level, $4k second level. This obviously will not lead to winning.

These are the techs I have after beating level 41. I could really use some advice on what to do....

http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/5189/titanslevel42.jpg