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Brazilski
04-08-2011, 11:06 AM
What exactly does impact negation do compared to armor improvement? I've read on many fora that armor is for bullets and impact for other damage dealing effects world effects like falling and poltergeist-thrown objects. However, this is a typical example of a tier 3 impact upgrade:

"A ceramic outer layer can deflect armor piercing bullets that impact at an angle and cause armor piercing bullets that make a direct impact to crumble into fine dust.
Impact Negation -10%"

That would suggest impact does affect bullet damage. Can anyone provide some clarrification on this?

Custom333
04-08-2011, 12:58 PM
Yeah, impact = impact = bullets. All around armor effects all damage, not just impacts, if I'm not mistaken.

marie pavie
04-08-2011, 01:06 PM
impact/armor ?
I figure, kill them first. Less 'homework' that way.

Brazilski
04-08-2011, 02:11 PM
Well the reason Im asking is because for example tier 2 CS-3a armour has much much higher impact resistance than tier 2 Bulat armour whereas Bulat has a much higher Armor value than anything other than Exo. Yet if you check their respective Wiki entries for CoP nothing is mentioned about the difference in Impact resistance. In fact Impact isn't mentioned at all and it is implied that Bulat is generally far superior except for anomaly protection. If Impact does affect bullet damage this would simply be wrong.

http://stalker.wikia.com/wiki/Skat-9_military_armoured_suit

http://stalker.wikia.com/wiki/CS-3a_body_armour_(Call_of_Pripyat)

*By tier 2 I mean the armor with all tier 2 upgrades and the respective stats maxed.

Oliolli
04-08-2011, 02:26 PM
Pavie is right. If you see/kill them before they see you, you wont have to think about it, and can focus on those anomaly protection upgrades.

Brazilski
04-08-2011, 02:42 PM
Pavie is right. If you see/kill them before they see you, you wont have to think about it, and can focus on those anomaly protection upgrades.

In that case you might just as well not wear any armour at all most of the time, as long as you don't take a dump in a springboard.

You two've got a point though, but it wouldn't fit my playing style. I tend to not pick the best weapons and fight creatively. If I can choose between sniping the whole bunch or moving in spraying my PKM to provide my own supressive fire, duck behind cover, toss a grenade and finish them off the enemy Exos with my ceremonial Makarov,.. I will generally choose the latter.

bigbens6
04-09-2011, 07:53 AM
it is confusing, and i think the armor catagories are a little excessive for the game, you could go with 4 catagoriers imo, bullet, mele, physchic, anomoly IMO and call it quits....

Custom333
04-09-2011, 10:53 AM
it is confusing, and i think the armor catagories are a little excessive for the game, you could go with 4 catagoriers imo, bullet, mele, physchic, anomoly IMO and call it quits....

No realism is too much for Stalker. :cool:

IMO you should just try it out if you can't figure it out, upgrades don't cost that much, and there are certain points where you can do a lot of side jobs.

Brazilski
04-09-2011, 11:02 AM
No realism is too much for Stalker. :cool:

IMO you should just try it out if you can't figure it out, upgrades don't cost that much, and there are certain points where you can do a lot of side jobs.

In fairness I don't really notice any difference at all. Yeah, I notice doing X8 in a leather trenchcoat doesn't work, and I notice the Sawmill is a walk in the park in an Exo. But that's that; apart from general survivability, I don't notice specific bonusses against specific sources of physical damage (besides Rupture where you see the claws on your screen).

KarlMonster
04-09-2011, 11:26 AM
I understand the difference, but I dont know how either affects damage in Stalker. Armor prevents penetration, so more armor is somewhat less damage, but most importantly, less bleeding damage. Imp res, is padding to protect the wearer from impacts. A kevlar vest may stop a bullet, but you still have all the energy transferred from the bullet to you. So a well-armored person can still take impact damage from being hit. Impact resistance tries to mitigate that with padding to absorb the impact, or by spreading the force across a larger area.

Then there is suit durability which I guess means that your suit falls apart more slowly? The problem is that all of these qualities are more or less relative, which brings me to game mechanics. The militaries suit, Berill-5M is apparently vulnerable to buckshot and 9x18mm ammunition - because you manage (somehow) to take down about 18 soldiers at the Cordon in Clear Sky. (Normally I look high and low for ammunition for my starting AKm) So, if Berill-5m doesnt stop 9x18mm, then does any ammunition do some damage through any armor (exoskeleton, etc...) ???

It seems prudent to do something like this; low armor - use wound healing and health restoration artifacts, high armor and low impact resistance - use small health restoration, high impact resistance and low armor - use wound healing. Note that the first combination is not possible in CoP, since you are severely limited in number of artifact containers.

Custom333
04-09-2011, 12:08 PM
I found that Merc suit does almost no bullet damage difference at medium-short range. Bandit vest actually works better if it's just bullets you're worried about. It's all about testing.

Brazilski
04-10-2011, 03:05 AM
I understand the difference, but I dont know how either affects damage in Stalker. Armor prevents penetration, so more armor is somewhat less damage, but most importantly, less bleeding damage. Imp res, is padding to protect the wearer from impacts. A kevlar vest may stop a bullet, but you still have all the energy transferred from the bullet to you. So a well-armored person can still take impact damage from being hit. Impact resistance tries to mitigate that with padding to absorb the impact, or by spreading the force across a larger area.

Then there is suit durability which I guess means that your suit falls apart more slowly? The problem is that all of these qualities are more or less relative, which brings me to game mechanics. The militaries suit, Berill-5M is apparently vulnerable to buckshot and 9x18mm ammunition - because you manage (somehow) to take down about 18 soldiers at the Cordon in Clear Sky. (Normally I look high and low for ammunition for my starting AKm) So, if Berill-5m doesnt stop 9x18mm, then does any ammunition do some damage through any armor (exoskeleton, etc...) ???

It seems prudent to do something like this; low armor - use wound healing and health restoration artifacts, high armor and low impact resistance - use small health restoration, high impact resistance and low armor - use wound healing. Note that the first combination is not possible in CoP, since you are severely limited in number of artifact containers.

So what you're saying is that "impact" absorbs the energy from the initial hit and therefore limits the ammount of raw instant health damage you take, whereas "armor" affect penetration and limits how fast and how much you will bleed?

That sounds prefectly plausible to me. Thanks.

KarlMonster
04-10-2011, 09:06 AM
Again, I don't know how this translates to physical damage in the game. I'm making the big assumption that heavy resistance to firearms/bullets prevents penetration (bleeding), but that impact damage from the bullet's delivered energy may also cause damage.

Given the amount of realism elsewhere in the game, this sounds like a reasonable assumption. [Except for the part where you can magically remove recoil from firearms. In general, it can be mitigated, but not removed.]

Someone would have to look at the X-ray engine code to sort out if, and how, damage is broken down for certain.