I regret my purchase

[ajilejay]

[First Impressions]

I am about a hour in and the game looks beautiful. However everything in the game moves so slow, the cut-scenes, the battle sequences the dialog, everything. Besides that the battle system is boring they didn't improve upon the FF system they made it worse. I was a fan up until FF11 but the game-play here is so incredibly uninteresting. Avoid it even at 10$ unless you are really interested in aspects of the game outside of the battles.

[3 Hours In]
The job of a game is to keep the player immersed in the game. I own over a 100 games on steam alone this is the first one that has failed to keep me interested for more than a hour. I am up to 3 hours now and my opinion hasn't changed. The combat system is flat and boring from the poorly conceived initiation of combat to loot screen at the end. There is entirely way too much automation the game pretty much plays itself.The scale is way to large for me to give a **** about any of the characters and even if I did the character development is done in such a way that I don't get to enjoy my rewards because the AI will be selecting my specific combat abilities. The amount of cut-scenes, loading times, screen transitions, awkward pauses in dialog, and unneeded UI transitions draw the game out so unnecessarily and ruin any desire to know what is going on in the story.A bigger party definitely does not make a better game. This game is about on par with FF14 which is to say it's both beautiful yet terrible. Except this is a console port so the textures are **** and the animation looks like walking mannequins. In my eyes this game is pretty much indefensible in light of what square is capable. Really don't listen to the fanbois, you are better off playing any old FF you may have missed.

I do not always agree with the critics, but I feel this time the average of 66 was entirely warranted.
The Good
-The mining added a nice unique element to the game.
-The graphics and environment are very nice.

Just remember I tried to warn you...
The Bad
-Long awkward pauses in nearly every cut-scene and dialog.
-Excessive transition screens.
-Poor UI
-Really odd design and plot choices that don't make sense.
-Massive party systems with little substance.
-Simplified combat system that constricts strategy.
-High amount of environment recycling with no depth of content to redeem the repetition.

[zeebawa]

I am about a hour in and the game looks beautiful. However everything in the game moves so slow, the cut-scenes, the battle sequences the dialog, everything.

From I read you don't get to do anything super interesting until after 3+ hours. :)

[ajilejay]

unless it includes a revamp of the battle system i doubt it will make a difference. However I will update when i get to that point.

[Maxwell_Adams]

Combat has a turbo mode that makes all the animations about 2x faster.

[Protoss]

unless it includes a revamp of the battle system i doubt it will make a difference. However I will update when i get to that point.

Well, you get parties...

[chinonozu]

What a shallow way to look at it, you've only spent a meager hour into this game. You could have at the very least researched about the game first before you jump into it, it was quite obvious this game would need many hours to be fun.

I'm 4 hours into this game and stuff gets even better and better, not that the beginning was boring or anything, on the contrary I loved it since I've ran this game. To be fair, the prologue is evidently quite restrictive and it's mostly "event" battles which are meant to teach you the basics of the game. Get through that and maybe you can get a bit of enjoyment out of it.

edit: btw, why is everyone comparing LR with FF? You can't expect to get FF in a game meant to distinguish itself from just that.

[salad123]

How does the combat system work? Is it any good?

[BarrytheChopper]

Too many bad reviews even for the PC version. I wish I could feel good enough about what I've seen to spend $10. But I think I'll save that towards Skyrim.

I've been burned on weird combat systems too often.

[ajilejay]

What a shallow way to look at it, you've only spent a meager hour into this game. You could have at the very least researched about the game first before you jump into it, it was quite obvious this game would need many hours to be fun.

I'm 4 hours into this game and stuff gets even better and better, not that the beginning was boring or anything, on the contrary I loved it since I've ran this game. To be fair, the prologue is evidently quite restrictive and it's mostly "event" battles which are meant to teach you the basics of the game. Get through that and maybe you can get a bit of enjoyment out of it.

edit: btw, why is everyone comparing LR with FF? You can't expect to get FF in a game meant to distinguish itself from just that.

Really it's not I stated I had only played it an hour and I would update after I have played longer. However in my opinion the foundation of the battle system is incredibly dry and boring. You just select a vague command (magic attack, physical attack) the strategic details are all calculated by the AI for you. The best case scenario the game prompts you to push a few buttons during combat. Very dull gameplay IMO and I'm entitled to my own opinion.

[ColdBrew]

Really it's not I stated I had only played it an hour and I would update after I have played longer. However in my opinion the foundation of the battle system is incredibly dry and boring. You just select a vague command (magic attack, physical attack) the strategic details are all calculated by the AI for you. The best case scenario the game prompts you to push a few buttons during combat. Very dull gameplay IMO and I'm entitled to my own opinion.

Let me state that I have not played this game and have no opinion of it.

You are right that you are entitled to your own opinion, but the problem might be that you arrived at your opinion after only an hour of game play. That doesn't mean your opinion is wrong just that it might not be that reliable.

[SiMMENS]

I've really been looking for a good alternative to a Final Fantasy type game and I was really hoping this would be it. Some people really love it but not sure what to do about this one

[ChocoBalls]

TLR is not a game for everyone. Apparently even some hardcore JRPG freaks dislike it. Personally, I got bored with it about seven hours in; the combat system doesn't hold up to well after a certain amount of playtime, and the massive amount of cutscenes and loading screens are obnoxious (there's literally a loading screen for everything, from interior/exterior changes to dialog to combat to purchasing items to navigating the main menu, etc.).

A note for prospective buyers: if you want to play the game using a wireless Xbox controller, there's a chance it won't work. I bought the game mainly for use with a gamepad, and nothing Squenix tech support does for me will get my 360 controller to respond.

[Dirwulf]

I think you need to read a manual, because you can do more than what you state in battles, maybe not yet since you are only an hour in.

BTW, if you have an ATI card you need to turn some stuff off in the Catalyst Control center and then it will run smooth as butter. I forget what they are though, so you'll have to look it up like I did.

[Xeesheava]

Well, I spent a lot of time on this game, and I dont think you ever get a grasp of what TLR has to offer to you.

Let me tell you:

1: Battles
A non traditional Battle System with a lot of configurations to do and bonuses to get with formations and members in them.
Musical scores according to the moral gauge (And let me tell you, when you do a Reversal! you feel the power of the gods).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KPjPBCLaPg (Reversal!)

2: Party Management
Easy to use party management with semi-automatic equipment upgrades for your members.

3: Subquest
A lot of subquest leading to another places of the map continent, not simple fetching quests, fighting uncommon monsters, not reskinned ones.

[setadoon]

TLR is a huge gem of a game if you like an in-depth "find it all, do it all" game. Combat is great, skills management is great, story is great, replay options, oh ya! If you play this or ANY other game for 1 hr and make a judgement your an idiot son. this game is a hidden treasure of awesome. buy it. love it.

[ajilejay]

TLR is a huge gem of a game if you like an in-depth "find it all, do it all" game. Combat is great, skills management is great, story is great, replay options, oh ya! If you play this or ANY other game for 1 hr and make a judgement your an idiot son. this game is a hidden treasure of awesome. buy it. love it.

The job of a game is to keep the player immersed in the game. I own over a 100 games on steam alone this is the first one that has failed to keep me interested for more than a hour. I am up to 3 hours now and my opinion hasn't changed. The combat system is flat and boring. There is entirely way too much automation. The scale is way to large for me to give a **** about any of the characters and even if I did the character development is done in such a way that I don't get to enjoy my rewards because the AI will be selecting my specific combat abilities. The amount of cut-scenes, loading times, screen transitions, awkward pauses in dialog, and unneeded UI transitions draw the game out so unnecessarily and ruin any desire to know what is going on in the story.A bigger party definitely does not make a better game. This game is about on par with FF14 which is to say it's both beautiful and terrible. Except this is a console port so the textures are **** and the animation looks like walking mannequins. In my eyes this game is pretty much indefensible in light of what square is capable. Really don't listen to the Hammer Legion Members, you are better off playing any old FF you may have missed.

P.S. ________ is great. Filling in the blank does not make it so.

[Risingson]

What a shallow way to look at it, you've only spent a meager hour into this game.

That raises a nice question: how much time do you have to invest (or waste) in a game in order to uninstall it? Or, better said, how much of our very precious and little spare time do we have to invest?

[CrusaderGT]

Leave him be, that's his opinion. If he doesn't like it then he doesn't like it. He's only one person against a lot of us who enjoyed the game. He probably enjoy lurking in the forums more than playing his games. In the end it's his loss not ours.

[UMS]

That raises a nice question: how much time do you have to invest (or waste) in a game in order to uninstall it? Or, better said, how much of our very precious and little spare time do we have to invest?

Well, the most reliable and enjoyable game review site, namely GameSpot, has historically required a minimum of 35 hours in-game before even attempting a first-draft review. After the first-draft, the reviews are subject to a peer review system whereby the games are re-played (with save points this time to check accuracy of specific points) no less than 12 more hours PER peer (of which there must be at least 3). The original reviwer revises his work based on feedback. Finally, the editor makes sure the reviews are fair and balanced, and are free from all bias and malarky.

--

If it's fair for them, it's fair for you... How can you question perfection?

[Roddy225]

gamespot reliable? hahahaha

[Dragoonx1234]

Ignore the OP, he just likes to ♥♥♥♥♥, the game is worth more then the $10 that it is at.

[omninull]

The job of a game is to keep the player immersed in the game. I own over a 100 games on steam alone this is the first one that has failed to keep me interested for more than a hour.

First to fail keeping you interested in for more than an hour? That sounds like a lie.

[Soviet_j]

The job of a game is to keep the player immersed in the game. I own over a 100 games on steam alone this is the first one that has failed to keep me interested for more than a hour. I am up to 3 hours now and my opinion hasn't changed. The combat system is flat and boring. There is entirely way too much automation. The scale is way to large for me to give a **** about any of the characters and even if I did the character development is done in such a way that I don't get to enjoy my rewards because the AI will be selecting my specific combat abilities. The amount of cut-scenes, loading times, screen transitions, awkward pauses in dialog, and unneeded UI transitions draw the game out so unnecessarily and ruin any desire to know what is going on in the story.A bigger party definitely does not make a better game. This game is about on par with FF14 which is to say it's both beautiful and terrible. Except this is a console port so the textures are **** and the animation looks like walking mannequins. In my eyes this game is pretty much indefensible in light of what square is capable. Really don't listen to the Hammer Legion Members, you are better off playing any old FF you may have missed.

P.S. ________ is great. Filling in the blank does not make it so.

Im 13 hours in and I dont even know why i bothered getting this far.
Everyone seems to like this game for no good reason. I suspect people are just slogging it out (because they love the genre) and are actually unaware what makes a good game.

This game is boring to the extreme. It is poorly designed. From the constant loading for no reason. To the sterile enviroment. i.e. characters telling you not to leave a place but no triggers or hints of what to do while there. etc..

The story I barely care about. So abstract and so utterly unconvincing as to be a waste of time.

The characters I kinda care about. Vague characters with no real background or desires to speak of. You kinda just like a couple purely based on looks not because they have any type of soul.

Combat mechanics o god its so punishingly boring and detached. Like they say there is minimal interaction. ( an attempt at trying to be ogre battle yet failing) but its all automated. and then theres the instant button press bonus thingy. which even when done hardly is much of a bonus. I'm slowly reaching a point where im turboing all combats and turning off the button thingy. Cause the little interaction there is during the annoyingly boring combats is pointless.

I feel like im watching a bad anime movie which is being interrupted by a crappy game.

Because me and the OP have hundreds of games makes this polished turd look obviously bad.

People who like this game are either:
1) Hardcore Hammer Legion Members of the genre (whether they realise it or not)
2) So poor they bought this game and play very few games. So their frame of reference is dim to say the least.
3) Young kids who dont realize krap when they step in it.
4) Folks just plain happy to play anything (maybe they just woke from a coma who knows)


If you dont realize how bad this game is think on this:

Within 8 months after release the game went on sale for 75% off.
Don't believe me? Look at the steam recent news for The last remnant.

That means steam had so many licences to sell and no buyers they were panicking.
I myself bought the game indirectly through buying a square enix super developer pack sale.
I find it hard to complain about a game i essentially got for free.


FOR FREE


Yet it still sucks.


DO NOT BUY! (There are more better games by far then there are worse.)

[aegix drakan]

Personally, I like it. Yeah, the cast is kinda meh, and the plot is kinda meh, but the world is good, and the combat (and the in depth oranizing of unions and stuff behind it) is fun.

Yeah, I'm only playing this casually (usually to unwind before bed), but I still think it's pretty good, especially for the price I got it for.

That said, I understand why some people don't like it.

[wasteomind]

I have over 400 hours logged on this game in multiple play throughs and have enjoyed every minute of it. OP's opinion is his own, and everyone will get something different from this game. This game really seems to be love it or hate it. People don't seem to understand this is a jRPG from the developers of the Saga series. This isn't a fast paced action rpg.

I enjoy old school turn based RPG's and this is a decent thrown back to that kind of system, and still has hundreds of hours of things to keep you playing. Still ranks among my favorite games. In the end haters gonna hate.

[Soviet_j]

I have over 400 hours logged on this game in multiple play throughs and have enjoyed every minute of it. OP's opinion is his own, and everyone will get something different from this game. This game really seems to be love it or hate it. People don't seem to understand this is a jRPG from the developers of the Saga series. This isn't a fast paced action rpg.

I enjoy old school turn based RPG's and this is a decent thrown back to that kind of system, and still has hundreds of hours of things to keep you playing. Still ranks among my favorite games. In the end haters gonna hate.

You dont understand what the complaint is: nothing about the combat is innovative. its just a waste of time. With minimal interaction. And couple that to a "meh" story and characters and you get a waste of time. I honestly cant believe u spent 400hours in it . theres no game here worth that amount of time. Like i said i suspect people are liking it for the wrong reasons. THat does not make a game good. it makes it tolerable.

[armabe]

You dont understand what the complaint is: nothing about the combat is innovative. its just a waste of time. With minimal interaction. And couple that to a "meh" story and characters and you get a waste of time. I honestly cant believe u spent 400hours in it . theres no game here worth that amount of time. Like i said i suspect people are liking it for the wrong reasons. THat does not make a game good. it makes it tolerable.

And who are you to judge a reason to be right or wrong?

[wasteomind]

You dont understand what the complaint is: nothing about the combat is innovative. its just a waste of time. With minimal interaction. And couple that to a "meh" story and characters and you get a waste of time. I honestly cant believe u spent 400hours in it . theres no game here worth that amount of time. Like i said i suspect people are liking it for the wrong reasons. THat does not make a game good. it makes it tolerable.

So go play Gears of War or MW3 then. I have my own likes and dislikes, so how the hell you can tell me I have no reason to spend that much time playing a game or that I like it for the wrong reasons? Shows how ignorant and intolerant you are.

There has been nothing innovative in FPS games in close to 10 years, but yet year after year the COD franchise sells millions upon millions of copies. What exactly is your point about innovation again? Because I'm not seeing it.

[lirmont]

I've spent 476 hours playing it. I'm only posting to show 400 hours isn't an isolated case. If you like attainable challenges, learn the system and go after the optional bosses.

[Soviet_j]

I've spent 476 hours playing it. I'm only posting to show 400 hours isn't an isolated case. If you like attainable challenges, learn the system and go after the optional bosses.

I am and will. But that in and of itself still does not make a good game. All I am saying is from a design standpoint and from a player standpoint there is much much better.

[Soviet_j]

So go play Gears of War or MW3 then. I have my own likes and dislikes, so how the hell you can tell me I have no reason to spend that much time playing a game or that I like it for the wrong reasons? Shows how ignorant and intolerant you are.

There has been nothing innovative in FPS games in close to 10 years, but yet year after year the COD franchise sells millions upon millions of copies. What exactly is your point about innovation again? Because I'm not seeing it.

You know i am done with you. You claim I insult you. You choose to be insulted because obviously u choose to think you are in one of my categories. YOu sir in fact are constantly insulting me.

My point about innovation is in the definition of innovation it should be new or a variation of something so as to make it new. NOt some ♥♥♥♥ty version of something we had before. THats called crap.

There are good Fps and there are bad ones. because how they use the mechanics decides whether its worth playing and if it is in fact innovative.

There is nothing innovative about TLR other then it sucks to such a large degree it could cause people to sour on JRPGS.

I'm sorry you like it, i genuinely am. But im also glad you found something to keep you busy. Because game design and fun isnt in your vocab.

You probably like MMORPGs from korea or Diablo or titans quest. Good for you.

[Zloth]

My point about innovation is in the definition of innovation it should be new or a variation of something so as to make it new. NOt some ♥♥♥♥ty version of something we had before. THats called crap.
I've been playing RPGs since the friggin' pen & paper days and I have never seen this combat system used before. What game have you seen this system used in??

Everyone seems to like this game for no good reason. I suspect people are just slogging it out (because they love the genre) and are actually unaware what makes a good game.
Your very first post was insulting, Soviet_J. You're calling everyone who enjoys the game an idiot. Do you actually not even understand that this is insulting? There's a huge difference between "I don't like the game" and "Everyone who likes this game is a fool."

[wasteomind]

You know i am done with you. You claim I insult you. You choose to be insulted because obviously u choose to think you are in one of my categories. YOu sir in fact are constantly insulting me.

My point about innovation is in the definition of innovation it should be new or a variation of something so as to make it new. NOt some ♥♥♥♥ty version of something we had before. THats called crap.

There are good Fps and there are bad ones. because how they use the mechanics decides whether its worth playing and if it is in fact innovative.

There is nothing innovative about TLR other then it sucks to such a large degree it could cause people to sour on JRPGS.

I'm sorry you like it, i genuinely am. But im also glad you found something to keep you busy. Because game design and fun isnt in your vocab.

You probably like MMORPGs from korea or Diablo or titans quest. Good for you.

You are so dense and self centered you can't even understand the reality of what you are saying. You might be thinking one thing in your mind, but you aren't saying it with your words. You can be done with me all you want, it isn't going to stop me from pointing out how your opinion does not equal everyone elses, and no one wants you jamming your own thoughts down their throat then calling anyone who doesn't agree with you blind. You started the subtle attacks with your posts, I did not interpret them the wrong way. Others have pointed that out already. Shame you can't comprehend your own actions.

At what point did anyone, including Square, state that this was an attempt at innovation and a supposed reimagining and defining turning point for RPG mechanics? You seem to have it in your head that the game was developed with this world changing event in mind. It isn't the case at all. The devs stepped outside the box to try something new, and people like you who couldn't handle the change, difficulty, or style complained and ran them off future projects of this nature. You also need to understand there are different types of RPGs. This isn't the same type of RPG as say, Mass Effect, Oblivion, or Fallout 3. Kiddos these days seem to think if it says RPG it is an action RPG. Just not the case, especially with jRPGs.

I do enjoy some MMORPGs developed in Korea, and I enjoy some of the ones developed here in the west too. What is your point? Another insult you are cleverly trying to disguise and claim isn't an insult? Am I a terrible person or lacking knowledge about real games because of this fact? Do I need to enjoy a set list of pre-accepted titles to be on the cool kid list? Please, let me know which ones so I can gain your respect.

One game isn't going to sour people on a whole genre. Go back to whatever hole you crawled out of and let people decide for themselves what is junk rather than ranting here about how you feel you wasted your time getting something for free.

[tamalero]

Im 13 hours in and I dont even know why i bothered getting this far.
Everyone seems to like this game for no good reason. I suspect people are just slogging it out (because they love the genre) and are actually unaware what makes a good game.

This game is boring to the extreme. It is poorly designed. From the constant loading for no reason. To the sterile enviroment. i.e. characters telling you not to leave a place but no triggers or hints of what to do while there. etc..

The story I barely care about. So abstract and so utterly unconvincing as to be a waste of time.

The characters I kinda care about. Vague characters with no real background or desires to speak of. You kinda just like a couple purely based on looks not because they have any type of soul.

Combat mechanics o god its so punishingly boring and detached. Like they say there is minimal interaction. ( an attempt at trying to be ogre battle yet failing) but its all automated. and then theres the instant button press bonus thingy. which even when done hardly is much of a bonus. I'm slowly reaching a point where im turboing all combats and turning off the button thingy. Cause the little interaction there is during the annoyingly boring combats is pointless.

I feel like im watching a bad anime movie which is being interrupted by a crappy game.

Because me and the OP have hundreds of games makes this polished turd look obviously bad.

People who like this game are either:
1) Hardcore Hammer Legion Members of the genre (whether they realise it or not)
2) So poor they bought this game and play very few games. So their frame of reference is dim to say the least.
3) Young kids who dont realize krap when they step in it.
4) Folks just plain happy to play anything (maybe they just woke from a coma who knows)


If you dont realize how bad this game is think on this:

Within 8 months after release the game went on sale for 75% off.
Don't believe me? Look at the steam recent news for The last remnant.

That means steam had so many licences to sell and no buyers they were panicking.
I myself bought the game indirectly through buying a square enix super developer pack sale.
I find it hard to complain about a game i essentially got for free.


FOR FREE


Yet it still sucks.


DO NOT BUY! (There are more better games by far then there are worse.)

interesting, you yet again complained about the loading times.
despite saying you didnt..
anyway, did you ever tried to get into the quests menu in your screen? or you really just want everyone, to pull your hand and lead your character around the maps 24/7, trough the entire game?

I think if you expect this, you;be better playing Modern Warfare 2 and 3. and not a RPG or a game that requires exploring.

also, again.. you're pushing your tastes over anyone elses.. you're not god, you're not the final answer nor the final solution.. calling everything "krap" just because you think its "crap" is dumb.
Some people have certain tastes, some others have others.. some will like RPGS, others won't.

we get it, you dont like the last remnant, So why dont you use logic? We dont stop you here nor are forcing you to stay in this forum.. nor shoving the last remannt in your "precious" time.. go away!.. dont come back! we already know you dislike this game!. but not required for you to smear ♥♥♥♥ 24/7 with your pseudo "reviews" solely based in your biased view. Let others make their own opinion by trying the game (be demo or benchmark).

also love your ignorant and arrogant statement about "they only like this game because they're poor"
considering you got it for free.. I find that amusing.

Anyway again I repeat.. your typical reaction you wrote in here...is from a young immature child who had everything handed to him. You probably got defeated many times in the game, called it ♥♥♥♥ because you never knew how it worked. and then.... you had to blame everyone(including the game) so you dont feel bad about your arrogant failure in the game.

[ajilejay]

I think what me and Soviet are getting at is, Yes, It has been a long long time since a decent jRPG has been released and even longer for one available on PC. I understand there is a lot of people craving that 90's jRPG game, but this is not this game. Compare this against any decent SNES or PS1 jRPG and it is clear it has taken the genre several steps backwards. The only thing it really has going for it is it has no competition on PC. Not only is the gameplay lacking but the larger issue is the unending amount of technical mistakes in nearly every aspect of the game.

[wasteomind]

I think what me and Soviet are getting at is, Yes, It has been a long long time since a decent jRPG has been released and even longer for one available on PC. I understand there is a lot of people craving that 90's jRPG game, but this is not this game. Compare this against any decent SNES or PS1 jRPG and it is clear it has taken the genre several steps backwards. The only thing it really has going for it is it has no competition on PC. Not only is the gameplay lacking but the larger issue is the unending amount of technical mistakes in nearly every aspect of the game.

Your complaining about the gameplay but citing the errors to be technical of nature. Claiming they are technical gives the impression that the game code is to blame for the mechanics of the game which would imply undeniable fact, which I do not find to be true at all. I challenge you to name 5 instances if that is in fact your point.

If not I assume you are talking not about technical issues, but game play mechanics chosen by the developer, in which case you are talking about short comings that are based on your opinions based on expectations governed only by your previous expectations, experiences or hopes.

All I keep seeing in these posts is people who for some reason based all their expectations on the wrong things because they have been molded to do so.

I don't think the game took the genre back at all. I think it tried something DIFFERENT but ended up being a victim of its own ambitions and expectations of players. Its like when the bulletstorm developers wanted to make green barrels the explosive type in their games, but when people play test they ignore the green because all their experience and expectations tell them that only red barrels explode. The developers then are forced to use red because the gamers playing are reluctant to change or adapt without being force to, then cry foul over it.


Here is a good article worth a read : http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_310/8914-Green-Barrels-Dont-Explode

A representative of the Bulletstorm design team, known as Arcade, blogged about the process that went into making the exploding barrels in the game (http://www.peoplecanfly.com/blog/2011/01/we-had-to-use-red-barrels/). They initially wanted to go with green barrels to counter the red stereotype. In the heat of the action, however, they discovered players largely ignored the barrels; they would see a flash of green while running and it didn't register as "explosive." In this case, the team rightly decided that conveying an instant message was more important that making a style statement.Until then, however, you don't have to pity the developers who are caught in the constant balancing act of making the next new thing with enough of the same old conventions. They and their predecessors created us and must summarily tame us. But the next time you're tempted to call out a designer on a cliché, remember the words of Arcade:
"We tried not doing red barrels, but The Customer is always right."


The articles kinda makes a point about how expectations lead to disappointment because cliche mechanics are necessary to keep the majority happy. Branching outside this causes bad reviews and poor reception from gamers because they are unwilling to adapt.

[bad_conduct]

I'm 15 hours in now. Took a bit to think about it, but I figured out how the fighting system works. It's not explained overly well, but once you get the hang of it, this game is a hidden gem.

I didn't realize it used the Unreal engine either, which explains the combat a bit too.

Edit: The combat seems light, you don't feel like there's a lot of control. Once you start unlocking unions, and seeing what each unit does, you realize how different the system is, and what you need to do in order to win a tough fight. It's a lot to do with the position of your party. If your in a good position, than it unlocks their stronger moves.

[Zloth]

There are a lot of things (http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1386909) about the game I think they should have made obvious.

[bad_conduct]

I disagree. Now that I understand the game, I actually enjoy it more. I probably will play it through a second time, and try to fight some of the earlier challenging enemies sooner.

Making things obvious in an RPG is a waste. Final Fantasy II/4 was far from obvious. Took me 3 or 4 plays through to figure out everything. This game reminds me FF8. The first time you play it through, you're like "WTF just happened? Why Can't I kill the final boss?" and second time you're like "WTF that was so easy. I wonder why I couldn't beat it the first time through."

PS I didn't read anything in there. I didn't want to spoil anything.

[tamalero]

I disagree. Now that I understand the game, I actually enjoy it more. I probably will play it through a second time, and try to fight some of the earlier challenging enemies sooner.

Making things obvious in an RPG is a waste. Final Fantasy II/4 was far from obvious. Took me 3 or 4 plays through to figure out everything. This game reminds me FF8. The first time you play it through, you're like "WTF just happened? Why Can't I kill the final boss?" and second time you're like "WTF that was so easy. I wonder why I couldn't beat it the first time through."

PS I didn't read anything in there. I didn't want to spoil anything.

remember you can disable spells and other stuff in each character's options.. so you will end with the appropriate/desired/favored spells/actions more often when entering a right.

that should give you more control of the spells..
this is particularly important on Rush or when you want to focus on specific things.. but your chars already have other skills that create conflicts.

[ajilejay]

Your complaining about the gameplay but citing the errors to be technical of nature. Claiming they are technical gives the impression that the game code is to blame for the mechanics of the game which would imply undeniable fact, which I do not find to be true at all. I challenge you to name 5 instances if that is in fact your point.

If not I assume you are talking not about technical issues, but game play mechanics chosen by the developer, in which case you are talking about short comings that are based on your opinions based on expectations governed only by your previous expectations, experiences or hopes.


I am not talking about bugs.
I am talking about the things that plague the game from start to finish.
-Long awkward pauses in nearly every cut-scene and dialog.
-Excessive transition screens.
-Poor UI
-Really odd design and plot choices that don't make sense.
-Massive party systems with little substance.
-Simplified combat system that constricts strategy.
-High amount of environment recycling with no depth of content to redeem the repetition.

Final Fantasy 4 TYA is a better option for a jrpg.

[Zloth]

What the...? Are you trying to wait for everyone to move on to another game then come back in and get the last word? Not gonna happen.

Long awkward pauses in nearly every cut-scene and dialog
First, that's just not true. Second, in order to state that this happened in nearly every dialog, you must have heard nearly every dialog. That means you haven't just completed this game but you've actually dug up and ran all the sidequests in the game. Rather odd of you to do that with a game you hate.

Excessive transition screens.
Not true. The transition screens are pretty normal for games like this where the battles happen in their own little game worlds. Assuming your PC isn't a piece of junk, they should take less than 5 seconds. For me, they take maybe 3 seconds each.

Poor UI
Definitely true. Sometimes the UI feels like I've gone back to the days of DOS. Still, you get used to it eventually.

Really odd design and plot choices that don't make sense.
I'm not even sure what you're trying to say here.

Massive party systems with little substance.
Simplified combat system that constricts strategy.
Now you're going past false and into stupid. Little substance? The substance is subtle but it isn't even remotely small! This is a very deep combat system with tons of strategy.

High amount of environment recycling with no depth of content to redeem the repetition.
There's some recycling (particularly at the start of the game) but there's also lots of content. Many times you'll go back in to an area and find new sections have opened up inside them.

[Tangsta]

hi guys, new the forums here, would just like to add my 2 cents:

Only just finally got around to fully enjoying The Last Remnant and honest to God, I think it's the best RPG Square has made since FF12 - I arrived at this conclusion after spending 70+ hours into it thus far. The amount of content in this game is staggering and reminiscent of the greatest Final Fantasy titles.

Battle system is excellent fun, once you get past the annoying streamlining design (and edit the ini file to allow you to equip your party members manually), it's challenging and provides a great incentive to seek out the rarest components to upgrade your weapons and armor. Turbo mode is also very useful and I use it whenever I'm not fighting a difficult opponent (I prefer to manually do the Critical Triggers).

Characters are mostly great, with of course the exception of Rush and his Americana influence. Character costumes could've been better designed for some but nothing that makes me cringe. Also, The Conqueror is now my favourite baddie after Sephiroth in the Square canon of RPGs.

Lastly the music, it rocks! Some of the best battle music (especially the boss themes) I've ever had the pleasure of sampling in a RPG - period. I think I might order the OST online, something I almost never do for video games.

Such a shame all this was marred they shoddy XBOX 360 version, Square rectified this with the PC version but I guess by then the damage was already done. The pricing is a bit steep for this game atm, but as soon as it goes on sale I recommend every give it a go, so you can remember when Square once knew how to make a great JRPG.

[anubislord12]

Hey there. This particular offering Square made seems to be rather polarizing. I agree with several of your bad points but noticed a significant improvement on a newer system. While this may not apply I do notice that SE has had issues with many of their titles that they port to PC from console. The game play has its issues but for me I love this game due to the mining mentioned as well as the ability to let your characters upgrade themselves from loot earned etc you may not have seen this effect just yet but its nice even if a bit annoying pre BR100.

There are many issues but once again from someone whos played it ALOT it IS one of those games you love or you hate. Give it more time and it may come good I personally enjoy the story since that is what Square Enix does well. Try and find some good like with the mining and if it still isnt enough might not be for you :).

[Soviet_j]

I think what me and Soviet are getting at is, Yes, It has been a long long time since a decent jRPG has been released and even longer for one available on PC. I understand there is a lot of people craving that 90's jRPG game, but this is not this game. Compare this against any decent SNES or PS1 jRPG and it is clear it has taken the genre several steps backwards. The only thing it really has going for it is it has no competition on PC. Not only is the gameplay lacking but the larger issue is the unending amount of technical mistakes in nearly every aspect of the game.

Thats it exactly. I dont want people turned of fof the genre becaus ethis game isnt that engaging.

I am not talking about bugs.
I am talking about the things that plague the game from start to finish.
-Long awkward pauses in nearly every cut-scene and dialog.
-Excessive transition screens.
-Poor UI
-Really odd design and plot choices that don't make sense.
-Massive party systems with little substance.
-Simplified combat system that constricts strategy.
-High amount of environment recycling with no depth of content to redeem the repetition.

Final Fantasy 4 TYA is a better option for a jrpg.

Omg i love this list. Even better then mine. way bettter.
I prefer FF1 or chrono trigger or Dragon Quest or ogre battle. the original ogre battle. not tactics.

[Soviet_j]

Hey there. This particular offering Square made seems to be rather polarizing. I agree with several of your bad points but noticed a significant improvement on a newer system. While this may not apply I do notice that SE has had issues with many of their titles that they port to PC from console. The game play has its issues but for me I love this game due to the mining mentioned as well as the ability to let your characters upgrade themselves from loot earned etc you may not have seen this effect just yet but its nice even if a bit annoying pre BR100.

There are many issues but once again from someone whos played it ALOT it IS one of those games you love or you hate. Give it more time and it may come good I personally enjoy the story since that is what Square Enix does well. Try and find some good like with the mining and if it still isnt enough might not be for you :).

While i didnt like ur personal attack on me in my thread. it was quite rude. I do want to say this post of yours is great. I love it. Because its honest and understanding and really what gets to the heart of the issue:

The game is not great. its class is mediocre or maybe decent if u are a fan.

TBH i still have it installed even though i havent touched it in a year. cause i do want to wrap it up. I just hate that the illusion of game time is really a lot of unneeded loading or transitions makeing the game time a bit of a fallacy.


In other news i find it funny folks say "o its unreal that explains it" or "its real that explains the combat." Unreal is a grfx engine. u can literalyl do what ever u want. There is no excuse and u cant blame unreal.

Square Enix: The Unreal Engine made it very easy to work with cut-scenes and such in the early phases of development, which you can't really work on if you're using your own technology. The difficulty has been in overcoming the differences in development culture between Square Enix and Epic. But it's been a good challenge, one that we've enjoyed.

in case folks think im talking out of my ♥♥♥, here is my quote from earlier:

Square Enix reported that the game had sold 580,000 copies, including both PC and Xbox 360 versions, by March 31, 2009, which was less than two weeks after the game was first released on PC. The Last Remnant received a largely mixed reception. It received a more positive reception in Japan than elsewhere, something which the developers credit to different styles of reviewing between cultures. They also felt that the Japanese reviewers scored the game too high. (http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/22918/GDC_The_Making_of_The_Last_Remnant.php)

Another common complaint among reviewers was the battle system, which were described as "repetitive" by GamePro (http://www.gamepro.com/article/reviews/207945/the-last-remnant/), frustrating by IGN in their Xbox review (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/933/933121p1.html) and "boring" and the worst part of the game by 1UP (http://www.1up.com/reviews/the-last-remnant_2). G4 also criticized the battle system, saying that the game played itself. (http://www.g4tv.com/games/xbox-360/46007/The-Last-Remnant/review/)

[BobT36]

The game is not great. its class is mediocre or maybe decent if u are a fan.

A fan of what? It isn't in a series, and it is quite different to other games in this genre. Don't see how this would have a bearing.

[Zloth]

Omg i love this list. Even better then mine. way bettter.
It could hardly be worse.

While i didnt like ur personal attack on me in my thread. it was quite rude.
So was your first post there. If you want to dish it out then you better learn to take it.