Introduction to basic IFR/ILS Flight in MS Flight

[StratoArt]

Hello,

I'm over at AVSIM MS Flight forum a lot and I post mostly there, but I am a member of Steam (and recently a member to ms flight forum here now). I thought I'd post my video I made a while back of a basic explanation of IFR/ILS Flight with MS Flight.

You'll need either the RV-6A or the Maule to do IFR flight with.

But it shows that if you wanted to do more advanced flying with MS Flight you CAN Do it.

This basically has the descriptions annotated and set to music. Pause and replay as needed of course. Enjoy!! :)

http://youtu.be/hoLsb_8dZrs

[AzureWX]

Heads up to anyone that wants to try this in a Maule instead: you still tune the ILS into NAV1, but the heading and glide slope info will be on the gauge with the yellow arrow instead of the swinging needle.

Also, there's no glide slope signal for the runway 26L approach into Honolulu, you'll need the approach plate (http://155.178.201.160/d-tpp/1204/00754LDAD26L.PDF) (and a little luck) for that one. (If you're really clever, you can use the HNL VOR to help line up with the runway when you turn away from the localizer; that beacon broadcasts from the sombrero shaped building halfway down runway 8R/26L.)

[StratoArt]

Yes indeed, thanks for that correction. I still need to work on a new ILS vid. when I get the chance. :)

[StratoArt]

Also if anyone here on Steam is interested, you can listen to live ATC here: http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=hnl
This is Honolulu International ATC

And also you can look up the sectional charts for Hawaii here: http://skyvector.com/

and get all the airport information including charts here: http://skyvector.com/airports/Hawaii

[AzureWX]

If I thought my computer would survive running some kind of recording software and Flight at the same time, I'd try to do an approach plate tutorial, but that will have to wait for my inevitable upgrade some time in the future™.

In the meantime, good tutorials on how to do instrument approaches can be found here (http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/), though you won't be able to run the example flights unless you have FSX or they eventually release a New England pack for Flight.

[Oblivion_au]

Hello,

I'm over at AVSIM MS Flight forum a lot and I post mostly there, but I am a member of Steam (and recently a member to ms flight forum here now). I thought I'd post my video I made a while back of a basic explanation of IFR/ILS Flight with MS Flight.

You'll need either the RV-6A or the Maule to do IFR flight with.

But it shows that if you wanted to do more advanced flying with MS Flight you CAN Do it.

This basically has the descriptions annotated and set to music. Pause and replay as needed of course. Enjoy!! :)

http://youtu.be/hoLsb_8dZrs

thanks for the vid, i never noticed the radio option in free flight --> legend.

[StratoArt]

thanks for the vid, i never noticed the radio option in free flight --> legend.

You are very welcome!!

Also you can talk to people over specific frequencies too.

To talk to everyone use TAB on the keyboard or CTRL TAB to talk over a specific frequency.

Similar to talking within a group and outside of a group.

I have my radio talk to mapped to two buttons on my Saitek X52 controllers.

[FS Tester]

FYI, if you are interested in learning more about IFR & ILS flight, there are a number of free courses at AOPA that you may be interested in:

Single-Pilot IFR: http://www.aopa.org/asf/online_courses/single_pilot_ifr/
IFR Insights: Charts: http://flash.aopa.org/asf/ifrinsights_charts/
IFR Chart Challenge: ILS Approach: http://flash.aopa.org/asf/chartchallengeils/

IFR Chart Challenge: VOR Approach: http://flash.aopa.org/asf/chartchallengevor/
IFR Chart Challenge: RNAV Approach: http://flash.aopa.org/asf/chartchallengernav/

More AOPA Air Safety Institute Online Courses are at: http://www.aopa.org/asf/online_courses/

You will need to sign up at https://www.aopa.org/asf/osc/register.cfm, but it's free.

PS: The FAA also provides some free courses at: https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_catalog.aspx

[StratoArt]

Excellent!! Thanks!

[skimbo]

Thanks for the great vid - I've now got the hang of it but one question:

When you tune in your instrument to the correct airport/runway is there anyway to disable the constant morse code bleeping - been doin' my fruit right in it as' ;o)

Cheers in advance.

Skimbo

[J van E]

Thanks for the great vid - I've now got the hang of it but one question:

When you tune in your instrument to the correct airport/runway is there anyway to disable the constant morse code bleeping - been doin' my fruit right in it as' ;o)

Cheers in advance.

Skimbo

Below and a bit to the left of the switch button (which you use to make the standby freq the active freq) there is a little round ident button (on both radio's btw). When you hold the mouse over it, you will see something about ident: click to turn the morse code on or off when you see that little text message.

[StratoArt]

Yes. That morse code is activated/deactivated by the IDENT button. Just press to activate. And press again to deactivate.

[StratoArt]

Here is what a typical aircraft transponder looks like.

You'll see the IDENT button. It is just a simple push in stick and then push again to turn off the morse ID code.

http://www.avspec.aero/images/store/KT-76A_75899_WEB.jpg

[FS Tester]

...When you tune in your instrument to the correct airport/runway is there anyway to disable the constant morse code bleeping...

Yes there is. Just below the numeric digital readouts on the two NAV radios there is a little ID (stands for IDENTification) button. Click to enable or disable.

The purpose of the Morse code beeping is to:
a) confirm that you are tuned to the right radio beacon. In IFR (Instrument Flight Rules) conditions (i.e. when you can't visually see where you are going) , it would be a bad thing to accidentally tune to the wrong beacon and, unable to visually see where you are going, head towards the beacon, only to in actuality be heading totally in the wrong direction. :confused:

b)allow you to set the radio frequency in advance, when you are still out of range of the navigation beacon. When you get in range, the morse code beeps will start as a reminder that you can now navigate by them. You can then turn off the Ident once you have confirmed that you are tuned to the right frequency / beacon

Of course, that assumes you understand Morse Code, which is becoming a lost art these days!

[FS Tester]

Hah! I see StratoArt beat me too it as I was typing !

[wlayton27]

AFAIK there is no way to disable the tone playback, but the Maule's nav 1 doesn't play the tones so I usually use the nav 1 VOR filled to keep the Maule's HSI locked on the radial. Too bad the Maule doesn't have any glide slope instrument though, and the localizer instrument is tied to nav 2 which does emit tones.

Well I guess the IDENT button does work, I didn't get a little hand icon when I moused over it. There's your answer, and cheers guys.

[StratoArt]

Hah! I see StratoArt beat me too it as I was typing !

and J van E beat me, LOL!

:)

[EastCoastGuy]

Good thread for those needing some help with this. I'll be sure to look up the detailed instructions for longer flights.

[skimbo]

Brilliant stuff as always guys!

Thanks for all your replies.

Skimbo

[StratoArt]

Brilliant stuff as always guys!
Thanks for all your replies.
Skimbo


Anytime!!:cool:

[AzureWX]

AFAIK there is no way to disable the tone playback, but the Maule's nav 1 doesn't play the tones so I usually use the nav 1 VOR filled to keep the Maule's HSI locked on the radial. Too bad the Maule doesn't have any glide slope instrument though, and the localizer instrument is tied to nav 2 which does emit tones.

Well I guess the IDENT button does work, I didn't get a little hand icon when I moused over it. There's your answer, and cheers guys.

The Maule's glide slope indicator is tied to Nav 1. On the course gauge with the yellow line, there will be two small yellow arrows to either side of the gauge that provide glide-slope info. Fly an ILS in VFR conditions to get the hang of it at first, once you get it that gauge is pretty easy to use (heck, I prefer it to the swinging needles of the RV6A's ILS gauge).

[RoboRay]

A pretty good picture of an HSI with labels is on the Wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizontal_situation_indicator

As noted above, there is a glideslope pointer on each side of the instrument.

[wlayton27]

Well I'll be, cheers for that. I read a few rants about how an HSI instrument is so much better than the standard CDI or OBI display. Now I have a much better understanding of why the HSI display is the preferred cockpit instrument for ILS approaches.

[skimbo]

Me again!

I see there are other navigation aids on the map VOR I think they are called. I assume I can tune my radio navigation gadget to these to to get an indication of what I need to fly should I seelect one?

I notice there are a bank of 4 navigation/radio aids. Are the 2 stacked on teh right for navigation and the two on the left for radio communication? Iassume the navigation ones can be tuned to different VOR stations?

Cheers again!

Skmibo

[J van E]

Me again!

I see there are other navigation aids on the map VOR I think they are called. I assume I can tune my radio navigation gadget to these to to get an indication of what I need to fly should I seelect one?

I notice there are a bank of 4 navigation/radio aids. Are the 2 stacked on teh right for navigation and the two on the left for radio communication? Iassume the navigation ones can be tuned to different VOR stations?

Cheers again!

Skmibo
You can use VORs to get anywhere you want to without looking at the map. Very (VERY!) short explanation on how to fly to a specific VOR with (in this example) the RV-6A to get you started:

- set the VOR frequency in one of the NAV radio's

- each NAV radio is linked to a VOR gauge: when the VOR is active (within reach) you will be able to hear the morse code AND you will see a needle (called CDI) move on the VOR gauge.

- on the bottom left of the VOR gauge there is an OBS knob: turn it until the CDI is centered AND until the little white arrow you see is pointing to the top.

- the VOR gauge now shows the heading you need to fly to get straight to the VOR.

This is one basic example of how to use a VOR. You can use it to get anywhere you want to, even to airports that don't have a VOR near, but that's a more complicated matter. ;) Learn more about it here:

http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-nav.htm

Feel free to ask for more information if you can't make it on your own! ;)

O, about the radio's: yes, the two on the left are used for communication (only usefull in MP right now since Flight doesn't have ATC) and the two on the right are used for navigation. Both NAV-radio's are linked to their own VOR gauge. It doesn't really matter which one you use: you can for instance simply pick the one that uses a kind of VOR gauge you prefer. In more advanced VOR flying you will need both NAV radio's though, to get you anywhere you want to. For ILS landings you usually use NAV 1 because usually (and certainly in Flight right now) only the VOR 1 gauge has a glideslope indication.

P.S. There also are NDB's on the map but as it is now no plane in Flight can make use of it. The fact that they are there however gives me hope for the future. ;)

[skimbo]

Thanks again.

Was wondering whether anyone would be able to decipher my hastily typed post - was in a hurry this morning!

Oh and thanks for choosing the RV6 as the example - defeintely teh best plane in game at the moment IMO - always fly this!

Cheers J van E!

Skimbo

[J van E]

Picture of the RV-6a navigation setup:

http://www.swe-gaming.com/fsx/files/2012-04/210930_Nav RV.jpg

Picture of the Maule navigation setup:

http://www.swe-gaming.com/fsx/files/2012-04/210931_Nav Maule.jpg

Er... can't you post pictures on this forum...???

[skimbo]

Guess not - if you have a photobucket account maybe you can link directly from that - normally photobucket has some html code you can copy and post into forums so the pictures show up directly within the forums.

Not to worry though I'm currently viewing the pictures in separate windows and reading your tutorial/info. :)

Skimbo

[wlayton27]

To add more info to that:

The map shows VOR stations as blue hexagons with the dot in the middle and DME stations as blue squares with a dot. When you see both the square and the hexagon together, you have a VOR/DME.

Just below the radio and nav control heads on your instrument panel, there's a DME display instrument. The only button there you need to worry about is the nav 1 / nav 2 switch. Whichever control head you use to tune into the VOR/DME, you can switch that selector to match (typically nav 1) to get an indication of your distance to the DME station as well as your direction.

As J van E said, the OBI/CDI can provide you a bearing that will take you straight to the antenna if all you do is center your CDI needle with the OBS knob, but the OBS knob will center the needle in two positions. One is called a bearing and points you to the actual station, and the other is called the radial and it points directly AWAY from the station. This is where the DME can come in pretty handy, as it tells whether you're on the radial or the bearing.

You can also get creative with the VORs by shooting azimuths from the VOR to any point you want to find. I used it on the Hawaii Airstrip Photographs mission to help me spot Upper Paauilo Airstrip from the air without the destination marker enabled.

For this, I used the map before starting the mission and placed my plane directly on the VOR that used the tone MUE (113.3 MHz), and I used the plane's directional control to find a back-azimuth to Upper Paauilo (click and drag from the halo around the plane starting at the tail end, and mouse over the center of Upper Paauilo Airstrip on the map). The bearing I got on the map was 250. Basically, if I fly a bearing of 250 from Upper Paauilo, I will fly over the VOR that broadcasts at 113.3 MHz.

Now before runups and takeoff, I set NAV 1 to 113.3 MHz and set the OBS knob on the CDI localizer indicator to bearing 250. After I take the photos on the first three airstrips, I head northwest along the coast until the CDI needle is centered. Then I turn left to bearing 250 and start my approach towards Upper Paauilo Airstrip.

There's a lot you can do with the VOR navigation, but still I can't wait for an aircraft to come out with an ADF installed so we can tune into the NDBs.

[J van E]

to get an indication of your distance to the DME station as well as your direction.

but the OBS knob will center the needle in two positions. One is called a bearing and points you to the actual station, and the other is called the radial and it points directly AWAY from the station. This is where the DME can come in pretty handy, as it tells whether you're on the radial or the bearing.

Well, that's not quite right, actually. The DME shows your distance to the VOR and at which speed you are moving towards it or away from it. That's it. To know if you are flying to or from a VOR, you should always look at the TO/FROM indicator! That will give you instant and constant information about WHERE the VOR is! (The only time you would use a DME to see if you are closing in on the VOR or not is when you fly an arc during a VOR/DME approach (which we will save for later, haha!).)

When the CDI is centered and the arrow is pointing up and you are flying the heading shown, then you are flying towards the VOR. If the needle is centered and the arrow is pointing down and you are flying the heading shown, then you are flying ayway from the VOR.

Also the terms 'bearing' and 'radial' aren't names for the centered position of the needle, which you probably didn't mean to say, but it sounds like it. ;) Radials are the 360 lines that always and only go outbound from the VOR: they always point away from the station. Bearing is the heading that leads you to a VOR.

When you are flying TO a VOR with a heading of 90 you say your bearing is 90 TO the VOR. When you are flying FROM a VOR with a heading of 90 you say you are flying on radial 90 FROM the VOR.

I don't post this just to nitpick on your post ;) but using VOR can be quite complicated for newbies and so it is very important to start learning the proper terminology right from the start otherwise things will only get more complicated. ;)

Again, to learn everything you need to know, read all about it here:
http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-nav.htm

VOR is heavy stuff to get to grips with. Some people never seem to get it, so don't be discouraged if you don't get it right away. ;)

[wlayton27]

To know if you are flying to or from a VOR, you should always look at the TO/FROM indicator! That will give you instant and constant information about WHERE the VOR is!
Oh cheers for that, I never paid any attention to the arrow on the CDI/OBI instruments. I'll give it another look. So if I take a radial from the VOR, the arrow will point down while I keep the CDI needle centered, and if I take a bearing to the VOR, the arrow should point up until I pass the VOR and then flip around to point straight down ... good to know.

[J van E]

Oh cheers for that, I never paid any attention to the arrow on the CDI/OBI instruments. I'll give it another look. So if I take a radial from the VOR, the arrow will point down while I keep the CDI needle centered, and if I take a bearing to the VOR, the arrow should point up until I pass the VOR and then flip around to point straight down ... good to know.

You're welcome. That arrow is VERY important: in fact, without that little arrow the complete VOR would be totally useless!!!

Yes, when flying away on a radial (in which case your heading is the same as the radial number) the arrow will point down, or FROM or back: the VOR is behind you. And when you fly towards the VOR the arrow will point up or TO or forward and as soon as you pass the station it will turn around indeed.

Bonus lesson: when you fly TO a VOR your heading will always be the 'reciprocal' of the radial you are flying on. Say you are flying towards the VOR and your bearing is 90: in that case you will be flying ON the 270 radial! 270 - 180 = 90. As soon as you pass the VOR you will actually be ON the 90 radial!

[wlayton27]

You're welcome. That arrow is VERY important: in fact, without that little arrow the complete VOR would be totally useless!!!

Bonus lesson: when you fly TO a VOR your heading will always be the 'reciprocal' of the radial you are flying on. Say you are flying towards the VOR and your bearing is 90: in that case you will be flying ON the 270 radial! 270 - 180 = 90. As soon as you pass the VOR you will actually be ON the 90 radial!

Well, obviously it wasn't TOTALLY useless ... :cool: I've been doing just fine with it even without using the TO/FROM indicator arrow. ..But knowing to check for the arrow indicator sure gives it a bit of added functionality. :D

Being a math nut, I can't help but correct the usage of the word "reciprocal" as the number for the opposite azimuth. The correct term is "complementary" number. The two numbers (e.g. 90 and 270) always add up to the same value (360).

Edit: ^^^

Whoops. Opposite azimuths aren't really complementary numbers either ... they only share a common difference of 180 degrees. For instance, 50 and 230 add up to 280, but their difference is 180 degrees so they are opposite azimuths.

[J van E]

Well, obviously it wasn't TOTALLY useless ... :cool: I've been doing just fine with it even without using the TO/FROM indicator arrow. ..But knowing to check for the arrow indicator sure gives it a bit of added functionality. :D

Being a math nut, I can't help but correct the usage of the word "reciprocal" as the number for the opposite azimuth. The correct term is "complementary" number. The two numbers (e.g. 90 and 270) always add up to the same value (360).

Edit: ^^^

Whoops. Opposite azimuths aren't really complementary numbers either ... they only share a common difference of 180 degrees. For instance, 50 and 230 add up to 280, but their difference is 180 degrees so they are opposite azimuths.

LOL True about it being not totally useless, but not every VOR has DME and not every plane has DME... while a VOR gauge always has a TO/FROM indicator. ;) But in the case of the Maule and the RV you can indeed get around without looking at the arrow but it's not as easy as getting around with it.

Concerning reciprocals: well, I am no math nut at ALL, but I do know that reciprocal is the official term used when it comes to VOR and radials and all that. ;) Read this page for instance http://www.navfltsm.addr.com/vor-nav.htm and you will see that word pops up quite often. In fact, I doubt if 'azimuth', which you used earlier on, is a word that has its place when it comes to VORs, haha! ;) Again, I am not trying to say I know it better (I am quite new to all this myself) but as I said before, it's important to use the proper terminology and procedures to prevent confusion for newcomers! ;) Afaik when you talk about azimuth you are using math to calculate a corner between a certain radial and a place you want to get to... but (if that is so) that's not needed at all, because you can always simply use a radial to get where you want to. Wherever you are, there always is a straight line to a VOR (well, if one is within reach) so no need to calculate angles or anything... (again, I am no math nut... ;) )

[wlayton27]

Afaik when you talk about azimuth you are using math to calculate a corner between a certain radial and a place you want to get to... but (if that is so) that's not needed at all, because you can always simply use a radial to get where you want to. Wherever you are, there always is a straight line to a VOR (well, if one is within reach) so no need to calculate angles or anything... (again, I am no math nut... ;) )

I only use the word "azimuth" as a general term for an angle. Not necessarily a heading, bearing, radial, or even a full line, but just a straight ray starting at a fixed point and continuing indefinitely in one direction. An "opposite azimuth" is any ray parallel to the original but pointing in the exact opposite direction.

As to your second point there, I never attempt to shoot straight for my destination unless there is a VOR/DME/ILS antenna within just a few hundred meters of the runway. If I can intersect a radial with my destination, I'll fly towards that radial while aiming for some general area that I know will be either left or right of the actual destination. That way I will know that I need to take either a left or right heading along the VOR radial (or bearing) to cross my destination. I'm afraid that if I attempt to intersect my radial just over the destination, and I don't have a visual on it, I won't know if I missed by flying too far away from the VOR or to close to it ... so I won't know if I should follow the bearing or the radial to reach my next point. This kind of purposeful "missing" of the destination isn't necessary if I'm using the DME or if I have both NAV control heads filled to provide two intersecting radials.

[J van E]

I only use the word "azimuth" as a general term for an angle. Not necessarily a heading, bearing, radial, or even a full line, but just a straight ray starting at a fixed point and continuing indefinitely in one direction. An "opposite azimuth" is any ray parallel to the original but pointing in the exact opposite direction.

As to your second point there, I never attempt to shoot straight for my destination unless there is a VOR/DME/ILS antenna within just a few hundred meters of the runway. If I can intersect a radial with my destination, I'll fly towards that radial while aiming for some general area that I know will be either left or right of the actual destination. That way I will know that I need to take either a left or right heading along the VOR radial (or bearing) to cross my destination. I'm afraid that if I attempt to intersect my radial just over the destination, and I don't have a visual on it, I won't know if I missed by flying too far away from the VOR or to close to it ... so I won't know if I should follow the bearing or the radial to reach my next point. This kind of purposeful "missing" of the destination isn't necessary if I'm using the DME or if I have both NAV control heads filled to provide two intersecting radials.

Ah, ok, I understand about that azimuth now. ;)

Yes, I also do that quite often: I also like to be on a radial before I get where I want to get for the same reason. But er... I have to add though that even with two intersecting radials and DME distances for both VORs I sometimes miss some of those smaller airstrips (the ones that are used for crop dusting and so on) because you can hardly see them. The problem is: when a VOR is quite far away the difference between sitting exactly on the radial and flying 50 meters beside it can't be seen on the VOR gauge... but that 50 meters can be enough to make you miss the destination. ;) So I rather fly towards airports that can be recognized from a few hundred meters... :cool:

Still, flying with VOR is cool! I never did it before (in 25 years of flying on the PC) but Flight made me go for it and learn it all! It's very satisfying to find your destination without using the ingame map or a GPS!

[RoboRay]

Being a math nut, I can't help but correct the usage of the word "reciprocal"

Well, this isn't a mathematical usage of the word, it's a navigational use of it. ;)

"Reciprocal" is the standardized term for "opposite" headings in navigation.

[Corpulo]

This is a great thread, thanks! I've never gotten into a flight game before and I started with MS Flight when it was released just kinda flying about. Bought a P-51 and Zero and they were was fun, too. Couldn't understand the complaints about no cockpit. Big deal, different view. Then I hit this thread and started to realize how deep the game could be. I had never even seen the VORs on the map...didn't know they were there.
Now I really only fly the RV-6A (used to think it was boring) and am thoroughly enjoying learning about VOR/IFR flight. And am against cockpitless aircraft as well now! :) Thanks again for all the insight in this thread!

[Mickel617]

Well said. That, ladies & gentlemen, is why Flight cannot be allowed to stagnate around general aviation flying visual flight rules in uncontrolled airspace. Corpulo is the stated target market - those who have never flown flight sims before. This can get a lot deeper yet, without losing the essence of simplicity on the surface. As was said in one of the videos around release - I think the words were 'We can model anything.'.

[DDawg_1956]

So ... I am old and must be missing something.

Where do I find the Freq's I need to input, to know what heading I should be flying to/from? ...


signed:
Confused old fart ...

[Mickel617]

I probably shouldn't be pointing you in this direction, but it will save me a lot of typing...
http://forum.avsim.net/tutorials/article/39-vor-navigation-part-1/
There's quite a lot in this tutorial section. Hope it helps.

[lgrochal]

Where do I find the Freq's I need to input, to know what heading I should be flying to/from? ...

You can use the official frequencies. Except for the KOA VOR (Flight still uses the old and now defunct IAI VOR) they're all correctly modeled. You can also go to the map screen in-game, choose 'free flight' from the menu to the left, and then click 'legend' (fourth item of the submenu). Tick the "radio navigation" checkbox, and you're ready.

HTH

[Corpulo]

You can use the official frequencies. Except for the KOA VOR (Flight still uses the old and now defunct IAI VOR) they're all correctly modeled. You can also go to the map screen in-game, choose 'free flight' from the menu to the left, and then click 'legend' (fourth item of the submenu). Tick the "radio navigation" checkbox, and you're ready.

HTH

I would just add that the VOR's don't show up on the map if you're zoomed fully out, at least for me. They appear when you zoom in a bit.

[RoboRay]

That's right. You also have to zoom in closer to see some of the smaller airports.

Also, no affiliation, but you can get an expired Sectional Chart "For Training/Simulation Purposes Only" covering Hawaii at http://www.mypilotstore.com/MyPilotStore/sep/7089 for less than $5, shipped. The stock on-hand now is the last ones guaranteed to show the "old" Kona VOR in Flight, as it has been deleted from the current charts just published a couple of weeks ago.

It's nice to have the real thing, sometimes.

[SirStiggie]

I did my first flight today relying on IFR/ILS in foggy weather without using the map and was thrilled I didn't crash :)

Seriously though, it is a fun way to fly in the game without using the map. I just need to learn the right way to prepare a flight plan that takes all the variables into consideration. This will probably hold my interest for a few more days till I get bored and start talking about cockpit-less planes again :D

[lgrochal]

As a side note - a hint, if you want to make it more realistic: you don't normally fly IMC if you can help it. Normal mode of operation for small planes flying IFR is to get on top of cloud layer as soon as possible, fly VMC on top, and then descend through weather again for landing. This way you avoid most of the nastiness of flying a small plane IMC - icing, turbulence (wich along with spatial disorientation usually has funny effects on your passengers), embedded thunderstorms, to name a few.

An extremely nice series of articles on flying IFR in Europe can be found here (http://www.peter2000.co.uk/aviation/). I guess in US it's a lot less rigid, but you'll get the idea.

[DDawg_1956]

I probably shouldn't be pointing you in this direction, but it will save me a lot of typing...
http://forum.avsim.net/tutorials/article/39-vor-navigation-part-1/
There's quite a lot in this tutorial section. Hope it helps.

Didn't let me in ... I didn't have permission ... but thanks ...

I will try to figure this stuff out ... I want to fly like I live ... totally in a FOG .... :(

[DDawg_1956]

You can use the official frequencies. Except for the KOA VOR (Flight still uses the old and now defunct IAI VOR) they're all correctly modeled. You can also go to the map screen in-game, choose 'free flight' from the menu to the left, and then click 'legend' (fourth item of the submenu). Tick the "radio navigation" checkbox, and you're ready.

HTH

Thanks ... that was simple ... and made me feel stupid at the same time .... LOL