Why cant Steam use Firefox ?

[Virus]

Why cant Steam use Firefox for Browsing in Steam :confused:

[Charax]

I don't really care what it uses for browsing internally, I just wish it would use the system's default browser when opening external windows (for paypal, for example)

[Virus]

No i mean steam itself his kore is the IE but why ?
IE sucks

[AciD]

This comes up frequently, so I'll address it again.

First, we use IE today because it's available by default on all Windows installs and it's relatively easy to embed. There are no major problems with it when used inside the Steam client, but there are some limitations it imposes on us when used inside our game engines or inside the in-game Steam overlay.

For the future we are certainly considering other options. While the IE control pretty much works fine in the Steam client itself, we would potentially be able to make the in-engine and in-game overlay versions of the HTML control work faster/better with a new control. The IE control pretty much assumes it's being embedded in a desktop window and gives developers no real control over rendering. As such we end up copying the entire window contents to a bitmap and rendering that to a texture in-game/overlay. If we had a control based on one of the open-source browser engines we'd most likely be able to hook in at a lower level and do finer grained rendering in-engine/overlay. However, switching to one of the open-source renders presents a variety of new problems as well, and it definitely means a considerable amount of new development work. As such it becomes a priorities exercise where we have to decide how important making improvements to the HTML control is vs other work we could be doing.

If we ever do switch away from IE it would mean bundling the code for the other rendering engine (Gecko/WebKit/whatever) with Steam itself. We wouldn't ever end up with a situation where we were dependent on Firefox or Safari or such being installed on a users computer, and we wouldn't end up with a situation where what you had installed determined what Steam used internally. That type of setup just involves too many different configurations and code paths to support. To make things reasonable for us to support everyone will most likely always have to use whatever browser is shipped with Steam, for now that's the embedded IE setup.

To save your time.

[Snoopyowns]

I swear, there's a topic on this every other day.

[amnesiasoft]

Everyone would love for Steam to not use Trident as the rendering engine, but Gecko is certainly not what would be my first pick of engines. Presto would be my first choice, but failing that, there's WebKit.

Anyway, the quote up above still stands regardless of my or your thoughts on this.

[ReBoot]

Why can't FF-users search???

[Fuzz Bucket]

You think they'd do something about all the "features" that simply open security holes. >.>

[michael89]

In-game IE is alright.

Just give me the tabs, and i'm happy! :D

[flashn00b]

Just give me the tabs, and i'm happy! :D

Agreed. It would be more convenient to implement tabbed browsing.

[GeneralTownes]

IE does not suck, ind i dont care what browser steam uses

[m-p{3}]

Why not use the back-end engine XULRunner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XULRunner), and bundle it in a Steam update?

There are a bunch of applications like Joost, Miro, MediaCoder that use XULRunner.

[tschumann]

I don't really care what it uses for browsing internally, I just wish it would use the system's default browser when opening externalwindows

I agree on this one. I don't care what browser it uses in Steam (as long as I don't need to install anything else), but it would be nice if external stuff went with the system default.

[yharrothar]

Steam doesn't use IE, it uses IE's rendering engine Trident. If Steam were to use Firefox it would use Firefox's rendering engine Gecko. I prefer WebKit, and use Chrome as my preferred browser; there is a plugin called Awesomium (http://princeofcode.com/awesomium.php) which is a library that makes it easy for developers to embed web-content in their applications. I think it would be ideal as Valve wouldn't have to maintain the plugin, and it's extremly easy to implement a feature rich browser using it. Want tabs, faster loading time, and a chance at having Steam cross-platform? Support Awesomium.

I have a thread going here that is discussion this option:
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=15

[ZeroSkyX]

It's always funny to see how some people who have no idea protest and demand just because they have too much time.

The Steam browser-component works flawlessly and is perfectly fine. Why use Firefox/Opera/Chrome/etc? There's absolutely no point in doing so.

[Pilk]

I don't really care what it uses for browsing internally, I just wish it would use the system's default browser when opening external windows (for paypal, for example)
This
10char

[jmccaskey]

I don't really care what it uses for browsing internally, I just wish it would use the system's default browser when opening external windows (for paypal, for example)

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

If you've noticed anywhere else where we don't respect the default browser when popping new windows let us know and it can be fixed.

[Plasma]

John I went to double check that the 'launch in browser' update news link (right click a game -> View update news) opened in Firefox, but the link (at the top right corner of the dialog) just reloads the page now instead of opening in a new window.

[Overheal]

Thanks for answering.

I much endorse the idea of a lighter integrated html renderer in steam. Firefox might be good among the browsers but you really dont need all that crap. I mean, I dont think we need a complete browser solution, just something to check email or do paypal on. Something that runs light and runs well.

[ReBoot]

Something that runs lightWell, Presto meets this criteria better than Firefox ;)

[m-p{3}]

It's always funny to see how some people who have no idea protest and demand just because they have too much time.

The Steam browser-component works flawlessly and is perfectly fine. Why use Firefox/Opera/Chrome/etc? There's absolutely no point in doing so.

Well, maybe it's the Overlay that is the problem, but sometimes when I enter some text when using the in-game web browser, using the Shift key doesn't work at some time, or take some time to register. I don't think the computer itself is the problem, as I use a QuadCore CPU.

I often use symbols and capital letters in my passwords, and typing them in the in-game browsers can be a PITA, especially since I can't see if I made a mistake due to the unresponsiveness of the Shift key under it.

Also if Valve finally decide to make Steam available natively under another operating system, they might have to consider an alternate rendering engine, because I doubt Microsoft will agree to port the Trident engine to another OS.

[ReBoot]

Using the system installed Firefox most likely won't solve the Shift problem (which I am also annoyed by, it's just all to slow). Especially would it be a madness to include queries whether Firefox/Opera/Chrome/Safari/Whatever is installed and using that. However, they announced that another browser component might get integrated.

[Fuzz Bucket]

Well, maybe it's the Overlay that is the problem, but sometimes when I enter some text when using the in-game web browser, using the Shift key doesn't work at some time, or take some time to register. I don't think the computer itself is the problem, as I use a QuadCore CPU.

I often use symbols and capital letters in my passwords, and typing them in the in-game browsers can be a PITA, especially since I can't see if I made a mistake due to the unresponsiveness of the Shift key under it.

Also if Valve finally decide to make Steam available natively under another operating system, they might have to consider an alternate rendering engine, because I doubt Microsoft will agree to port the Trident engine to another OS.
They did port trident to OS 7-OS X (as well as Tasman, later after Trident), Solaris, HP-UX, and Win 3.1-Me, ... They dropped all of them, though.
It looks like Gecko, GtkHTML, KHTML, Presto, and Webkit take the cake for being available across a wide variety of operating systems.

[PatPeter]

I swear, there's a topic on this every other day.

I KNOW!

10char

[napalmdest54]

No i mean steam itself his kore is the IE but why ?
IE sucks

lol, that is clearly a biased opinion. I use both FireFox and IE8, they both are awesome.

[razor851]

IE sucks
The story of my life...

[RobB]

Using the system installed Firefox most likely won't solve the Shift problem (which I am also annoyed by, it's just all to slow). Especially would it be a madness to include queries whether Firefox/Opera/Chrome/Safari/Whatever is installed and using that. However, they announced that another browser component might get integrated.

They don't even need to integrate a Querry which Browser is installed where, cause Windows can handle that itself through the URI Handler.

[Vinas]

I'd like to put my vote in for lynx at this time.

Thank you.

[ReBoot]

They don't even need to integrate a Querry which Browser is installed where, cause Windows can handle that itself through the URI Handler.It's not like they just call http://steamcommunity.com in the overlay. You actually have to embed the HTML rendering control.

[RobB]

Yeah, but I meant for Links opening new Windows, not within Steam.

[ReBoot]

Yeah, but I meant for Links opening new Windows, not within Steam.Then you wrongly answered to my post. I particulary talked about the overlay.

[RobB]

i missinterpreted. But they wont move away from ie for a while since that library is available on any and all windows machine.

[ReBoot]

i missinterpreted. But they wont move away from ie for a while since that library is available on any and all windows machine.There is an official answer on that topic which states that the IE control is not the last solution for Steam.

[michael89]

No i mean steam itself his kore is the IE but why ?
IE sucks

My opinions from IE 8, FF 3 and Chrome 2
(based on my experiences)

Internet Explorer 8

Pros:

- Secure
- Quite stable
- Add-ons

Cons:

- Crashes on pages, that contain lot of Flash
- A bit heavier than FF and Chrome
- Microsoft fixes all found security problems monthly
(gives hackers some time to do their nasty jobs.)
- When one page crashes, entire browser goes down



FireFox 3

Pros:

- Fast
- When security problems are found, they are quite quickly fixed
- Stable
- Add-ons
- Light
- Secure

Cons:

- When one page crashes, entire browser goes down



Chrome 2

Pros:

- Fast
- Light
- Secure
- Each page is it's own process: If one page crashes / jams, you can simply close the crashed / jammed page and continue browsing

Cons:

- no support for add-ons (yet)

[ReBoot]

My opinions from IE 8, FF 3 and Chrome 2
(based on my experiences)

Internet Explorer 8

Pros:

- Secure
- Quite stable
- Add-ons

Cons:

- Crashes on pages, that contain lot of Flash
- A bit heavier than FF and Chrome
- Microsoft fixes all found security problems monthly
(gives hackers some time to do their nasty jobs.)
- When one page crashes, entire browser goes down



FireFox 3

Pros:

- Fast
- When security problems are found, they are quite quickly fixed
- Stable
- Add-ons
- Light
- Secure

Cons:

- When one page crashes, entire browser goes down



Chrome 2

Pros:

- Fast
- Light
- Secure
- Each page is it's own process: If one page crashes / jams, you can simply close the crashed / jammed page and continue browsing

Cons:

- no support for add-ons (yet)Nice one, but you're wrong about IE8 at some places. IE8 is actually quite stable, at least I didn't have crashes on Flash. Maybe the Flash player just needs more RAM (I have 2GB). Also, not the entire browser goes down when one site crashes, IE8 separates tabs in own processes. In fact, the idea was in IE8 first and Google copied it for Chrome.

[brim4brim]

TBH there is one reason to use an open source engine and that is security.

They are usually patched much faster than IE when exploits are uncovered.

IE's update track record isn't very good nor is response time to security problems.

[ReBoot]

TBH there is one reason to use an open source engine and that is security.

They are usually patched much faster than IE when exploits are uncovered.

IE's update track record isn't very good nor is response time to security problems.Do you have a proof for FF being indeed more secure than IE or not? Also, you still have completely forgot that there are other renderers too. Besides, past examples for public security holes show that they get patched fast.

[Fuzz Bucket]

Do you have a proof for FF being indeed more secure than IE or not? Also, you still have completely forgot that there are other renderers too. Besides, past examples for public security holes show that they get patched fast.
Do you have any proof for security holes being patched faster? :D

[ReBoot]

Do you have any proof for security holes being patched faster? :DAs I did not claim that FF is more secure than IE due to the fastness of security leaks, I don't. However, there are studies about days with unpatched security holes for different browsers. Not surprising, IE was not more insecure than FF.

[Fuzz Bucket]

As I did not claim that FF is more secure than IE due to the fastness of security leaks, I don't. However, there are studies about days with unpatched security holes for different browsers. Not surprising, IE was not more insecure than FF.
Again, throwing it back at you, where is the proof?

[ReBoot]

Again, throwing it back at you, where is the proof?I do not remember the exact source, I can tell you that I have it from www.winfuture.de (you might need a translator for that). At least, I dod not claim that FF is more secure than IE just because it's open sourced, I did say that FF is not more secure than IE. So I don't lack that much of proof ;)

[Cruiser]

Sorry for the slight necro but:

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

Actually the paypal checkout works fine in Firefox. I can never remember my paypal password, and its only saved in FF, not IE. So whenever I hit the buy button and get the IE window, I just hit stop, copy the url on the steam forwarding page (the "Click here to continue" link) and then paste it into firefox. Once the payment has gone through, the steam page in the background updates and it proceeds as if nothing is different and I get my game.

Also, seeing as Windows 7 ships without IE installed in the whole of Europe, I guess support for other browsers will be necessary pretty soonish :)

[ReBoot]

Sorry for the slight necro but:



Actually the paypal checkout works fine in Firefox. I can never remember my paypal password, and its only saved in FF, not IE. So whenever I hit the buy button and get the IE window, I just hit stop, copy the url on the steam forwarding page (the "Click here to continue" link) and then paste it into firefox. Once the payment has gone through, the steam page in the background updates and it proceeds as if nothing is different and I get my game.

Also, seeing as Windows 7 ships without IE installed in the whole of Europe, I guess support for other browsers will be necessary pretty soonish :)You're serious about telling Steam users to use this complicated copy and paste method instead of the much easier "just click this thing"?

[Mangr0v3]

Also, seeing as Windows 7 ships without IE installed in the whole of Europe, I guess support for other browsers will be necessary pretty soonish :)

The Trident engine remains in Windows 7 E, just not Internet Explorer itself.

[A_Pickle]

I'm gonna have to agree with this. IE's engine is still less-than standards compliant, and has the unfortunate legacy of being a descendant of IE 6 and IE 7 (both of which weren't terribly good browsers). There's probably a lot of IE 6 code still floating around in there.

I wouldn't even recommend Gecko as a likely alternative, because there's something that is quite characteristic of both Internet Explorer AND Firefox: They're both quite slow comparatively speaking. Opera (Presto), Safari and Chrome (WebKit) whiz by both of them -- and that'd be a nice thing to have in the in-game overlay.

Xfire uses Trident in their in-game browser as well, but it has tabbed browsing.

I'll be honest here: I want a decent in-game browsing experience. When you put a web browser in-game, and then hamstring it by lacking multiple tabs (god forbid I go to more than one site while I play games), or any sort of bookmarking feature (what the hell is Steam Cloud good for?), etc...

...c'mon, Valve. Make the browser better. Go WebKit, add bookmarks that sync through Steam Cloud, and add tabbed browsing and you'd be golden.

[cryptodan]

- Crashes on pages, that contain lot of Flash


Then there is something wrong with your Flash install for IE, as i do not have the issues you claim here.

[Geister]

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.
Why not use the built-in browser for that instead of popping out a new window? I know it is very easy to do using IE's ActiveX/COM interface and popping out a new window, but I'm pretty sure it could be done by using another instance inside Steam rather than having to launch IE itself.

It could be interesting since if IE the application has a problem, but not the Trident engine, then it means Steam will have problems when buying with PayPal or Click and Buy. Okay, that is a pretty extreme case, but I had such problem on my other computer. IE did not exist anymore as an application, but the Trident engine was still on the computer. So whenever I wanted to buy something from Steam using PayPal, I had to get on another computer.

Also, with the upcoming new versions of Windows, one can decide not to install IE, which would ruin it all for those methods of payment. Better plan ahead and be safe than be late and sorry.

[lost_confused]

firefox? while we at it lets force everyone to use XHTML 1.0 Strict!
but seriously. EE is on most users rigs, (literally) forcing them to use and download FF(ver any) will cause chaos (do you really want another annoying updater? 3rd party updater going off in the middle of a game?) and version complications and underlying software and interface bugs. I use safari and opera. but EE for steam, equates to one thing for me = less hassle less updaters the better.

[Cruiser]

You're serious about telling Steam users to use this complicated copy and paste method instead of the much easier "just click this thing"?

No. I was merely proving that firefox can communicate paypal info back to steam, which was the reason given as to why Steam uses only IE for Paypal payments.

The Trident engine remains in Windows 7 E, just not Internet Explorer itself.

But Steams current way of working is to launch an external IE process. afaik, Trident cant be invoked as a stand-alone browser, so the current steam method wouldnt work if IE was not installed on the system.

[Skrrp]

No. I was merely proving that firefox can communicate paypal info back to steam, which was the reason given as to why Steam uses only IE for Paypal payments.

Totally this. I use FF for all my PayPal with Steam and it works 100% of the time. I have to wait for IE to boot, hammer ESC and copy and paste the first link into FF.

Why? And why don't I allow IE to do this?

When IE has decent enough script blocking to prevent XSS I might allow it to get to the PayPal main page. Until then it's FF all the way. IE is more insecure and the only word needed to describe why is NoScript.*

Valve: honour the mod comment above and respect the default browser for PayPal. FF works perfectly fine and I have never once processed a payment through IE.

*I'm not an evangelist and recognise the flaws of FF. Once other browsers have plug in engines to allow blocking and script management I'll give them a go.

OT: 1st post and all, big thumbs up to Valve for this forum not parroting my password in the plain to my email account. Too many forums do this.

[Epsilon]

If you really have a problem with IE, the *much* easier thing to do is just do the purchase from the website from your favourite browser, there's no need to do the purchase in the client itself at all any more.

Anyways, the reason they're sticking with IE is just because it made the most sense at the time, it's done now, and they've got more important things to do than the heavy-lifting necessary to graft an open-source renderer in there, even though that would have advantages. It's just pragmatism.

Personally, I'd say they should switch to WebKit. It's quick, light, and has very good standards support, but honestly it's not really that big a deal. I say this as someone who's used Chrome as my main browser since it came out.

[Skrrp]

they've got more important things to do than the heavy-lifting necessary to graft an open-source renderer in there,

Please read what I'm asking. I sort of trust Valve enough to not serve me XSS in the Steam store itself.

It's when the link goes external, they have to do more work to specify IE than to use the system default.

[Epsilon]

Please read what I'm asking. I sort of trust Valve enough to not serve me XSS in the Steam store itself.

It's when the link goes external, they have to do more work to specify IE than to use the system default. They already have the system in place to open other links from the Steam Store in your default browser. They don't need to hack out IE in the Steam client itself to do that, it works today, e.g. browse to a game in the Steam store, click the "Visit the Website" link. It's just a case of switching PayPal links over to that.

I'm no fan of IE myself, I might add. Been doing some web development lately, and runt of the litter that was always failing to render things properly was IE, the world would be a better place if it was scourged.

[Skrrp]

I'm no fan of IE myself, I might add. Been doing some web development lately, and runt of the litter that was always failing to render things properly was IE, the world would be a better place if it was scourged.

Yeah. It's a vicious cycle. When I do development I ignore IE compatibility and just go for standards compliance. Once I've got my W3C green tick I stop caring. If any IE users complain I tell them they need to get a standards compliant browser.

[Merkurius]

@skrrp, yeah that's exactly what i do too.

I support using the WebKit rendering engine, implementation of tabs is cool but not a "requirement".

Also doing this helps with expansion to well for example Linux, mac, and every other system out there :)

@mods: i realise this is a "old" topic but it is important...

[ReBoot]

Isn't it a little bit foolish to think that the HTML renderer is the biggest concern about non-Windows OS'?

[Corion]

Please, anything other than IE.

Nearly every time I'm browsing in-game I get minimized for some stupid debugging error or to download an image file (like PNG). This even happens when I'm just viewing the MOTD for a server I just joined.

[Fuzz Bucket]

Please, anything other than IE.

Nearly every time I'm browsing in-game I get minimized for some stupid debugging error or to download an image file (like PNG). This even happens when I'm just viewing the MOTD for a server I just joined.
This happens a lot with me.
I also experience a lot of overlay crashes caused by the browser.

[ReBoot]

Just repair your IE installation. It's not a problem of IE if you screw it up, it's your problem and it is solvable.

[Fuzz Bucket]

Just repair your IE installation. It's not a problem of IE if you screw it up, it's your problem and it is solvable.
Great idea! Oh, wait... "Repair" doesn't seem to do anything in Windows. :rolleyes:

[Pc_Madness]

I support using the WebKit rendering engine, implementation of tabs is cool but not a "requirement".


It definitely needs tabs, it can get pretty crazy when you've got 2 or so Web browser windows, friends list and 4 + chats opened.

[FlammableD]

It's always funny to see how some people who have no idea protest and demand just because they have too much time.

The Steam browser-component works flawlessly and is perfectly fine. Why use Firefox/Opera/Chrome/etc? There's absolutely no point in doing so.It clearly doesn't work perfectly: I'm having problems with it as we speak for instance.

[ReBoot]

Then let's work on the problems. It's not Valve's fault that you messed up your IE installation and it isn't a IE problem either. IE is not a problem by itself, the problems start when the user does something wrong.

[FlammableD]

Then let's work on the problems. It's not Valve's fault that you messed up your IE installation and it isn't a IE problem either. IE is not a problem by itself, the problems start when the user does something wrong.I didn't mess up my IE install. I never use it. IE was working fine for browsing, Firefox was working, yet Steam refused to browse. Cache clear later, everything is fine. This shouldn't even be causing problems, yet it does.

[ReBoot]

I didn't mess up my IE install. I never use it. IE was working fine for browsing, Firefox was working, yet Steam refused to browse. Cache clear later, everything is fine. This shouldn't even be causing problems, yet it does.Did you try to revert all IE's settings to default? And I mean using the "Default settings" button, not manually going through everything.

[emptc23]

IE should obviously be the default, but users should have to option to change it.

Interestingly, if you use Wine for Linux, you can install Steam and have it use the Gecko engine. I think it does this without modifying Steam.

[ReBoot]

Allowing users to change the rendering engine for Steam is really too much. It would hardly solve anything but it would create alot of hassle.

[emptc23]

Can you define really too much? The choice of browser is important. You might say that it's not important because it's not noticeable. However, if more people actually used the different parts of the steam interface (or if Valve expected more people to) then enough people would be unhappy about being forced to use the "default" browser to make it worth the effort. As has been mentioned earlier, people make this request all the time.

Whether Internet Explorer was being forced on people or not was a key point in an anti-trust suit against Microsoft. At one point, they were ordered to give users the option to uninstall IE. This was years ago and I am not sure if that is actually going to happen. Someone mentioned previously that future versions of Windows would not come with IE by default and it would be proactive to provide support for alternatives. I don't know how true this is because Windows 7 is out and this is not the case.

If you look at the market shares for browsers, Firefox is close to owning half the market. IE comes in second with their stats evenly distributed between IE6,7,and 8. Although Windows Update provides an easy update path, users for some reason have chosen to stick with an old browser. However, in terms of standards compliance and security, anyone will tell you that IE6 needs to go. It begs the questions if IE should be considered the accepted default when Firefox is clearly more popular and if sticking with the default just because it's easy is a good mentality.

[TempS]

I'd rather use Firefox...

[Pc_Madness]

Its not possible as far as I'm aware to automatically use the browser default browser of the system, Valve would have to bundle each one with Steam, which isn't worth the effort. Besides you won't see the difference anyway, I don't think it'll load extensions, so it comes down to rendering and stability.

Webkit is designed for this kind of job while Firefox isn't so much, plus Webkit is a better rendering engine. :\

[ReBoot]

The choice of the rendering engine for the Steam window is not important. If people feel offended by the fact that it's IE, it's their problem. If people damange their IE installation, it's their problem but the forum here is there to solve that problem.

[NickNR]

I'm a firefox user and tbh I don't mind ie being used for steams browser, the only thing I want is flash, because I hate havinh to lower my game window to view a youtube link I get in steam chat

[ReBoot]

Flash works in the overlay. You just have to install it. For IE of course, not (only) for FF.

[Anarith]

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

If you've noticed anywhere else where we don't respect the default browser when popping new windows let us know and it can be fixed.

i know im bumping a little old topic here but what about those windows which pop up while pressing screenshots in the steam browser? i just have to mention those

[Kailieann]

Well, those are stuck with IE for the same essential reason.

Although I've never understood why screenshots have to open in a new window.

In fact, that gives me an idea..

[phillipjfry6]

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

If you've noticed anywhere else where we don't respect the default browser when popping new windows let us know and it can be fixed.
It would be nice if you could view screenshots of games using the default browser in the store.

[Poks]

Steam should use something else to render web pages because everyone knows that IE is often thrown away and not updated which means that the security level for transactions is not respected and there could be issues in the future.

[ReBoot]

People refusing to keep their Windows installation secure are victims of their own stubbornness.

[Fuzz Bucket]

People refusing to keep their Windows installation secure are victims of their own stubbornness.
To a point... There is a point where it just gets stupidly ridiculous.

[noaksey]

i've uninstalled IE, and just use Chrome.

the only problem I encounter when browsing through Steam (now) is that clicking on a screenshot for example won't do anything.

[tragikos]

How about this (http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2009/06/windows-7-to-be-shipped-in-europe-sans-internet-explorer.ars) though. What if we Europeans don't install ie at all?

[Zefar]

How about this (http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2009/06/windows-7-to-be-shipped-in-europe-sans-internet-explorer.ars) though. What if we Europeans don't install ie at all?

It won't be shipped with it but the IE Engine is still going to be installed. Otherwise we wouldn't be able to get online unless we get a third party browser from someone else locally.

[Scared]

It won't be shipped with it but the IE Engine is still going to be installed. Otherwise we wouldn't be able to get online unless we get a third party browser from someone else locally.

If you click on screenshots in the store it opens them in IE even if you have a different preferred browser. I am not sure on the behavior if there is no IE at all (I assume it wont do anything)

[ReBoot]

If you click on screenshots in the store it opens them in IE even if you have a different preferred browser. I am not sure on the behavior if there is no IE at all (I assume it wont do anything)This has been explained dozens of times by different people already: nothing will happen.

[Krid]

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

Untrue, actually. I wait for the window to load to the point where I can copy the link, then I close that window and open that link up in FF.

So far I haven't had any problems doing it this way; firefox asks for permission to call the handler for steam:// links and Steam gets the message.

[Asenine]

the only problem I encounter when browsing through Steam (now) is that clicking on a screenshot for example won't do anything.

I have Internet Explorer removed with nLite, but the IE renderer is still there to use in other applications. This problem is particularly annoying for me also.

Branched this off here: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1119128

We do respect the default browser and pop new external windows in it except in the single case of PayPal or ClickAndBuy checkout during purchase. We unfortunately cannot use the default browser in those cases because the new window needs to communicate back to the in-Steam IE window as to the status of the purchase, and that isn't possible if the window is not a child IE instance.

If you've noticed anywhere else where we don't respect the default browser when popping new windows let us know and it can be fixed.

This is not true -- screenshots and the like are opened in IE too.

Surely you could just parse the URL and pass it to the default browser?

[SilverShot]

Yeah would like the option at least, some links open in IE some in FF, it's random, annoying and stupid! Consistency!

[jmccaskey]

I have Internet Explorer removed with nLite, but the IE renderer is still there to use in other applications. This problem is particularly annoying for me also.

Branched this off here: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1119128



This is not true -- screenshots and the like are opened in IE too.

Surely you could just parse the URL and pass it to the default browser?

Screenshots have to open in IE right now in order to be treated as pop-up windows without a toolbar, sized specifically to fit the screenshots, etc like they are right now. We could open them in the default browser but it would open in whatever size that you last used it, and it would treat the screenshots window like a normal page not a pop-up.

We'd like to change the screenshots to just not be popups to avoid this, probably using more of a light box style display, but we just haven't gotten to it yet as it's not a big priority.

[Xial]

Screenshots have to open in IE right now in order to be treated as pop-up windows without a toolbar, sized specifically to fit the screenshots, etc like they are right now. We could open them in the default browser but it would open in whatever size that you last used it, and it would treat the screenshots window like a normal page not a pop-up.

We'd like to change the screenshots to just not be popups to avoid this, probably using more of a light box style display, but we just haven't gotten to it yet as it's not a big priority.

Honestly, I don't care how it comes up. I just care that it DOES come up. And right now, on platforms where Internet Explorer does not have an install, it DOES NOT. I'm on one where Internet Explorer is not installed, and will not be installed.
This affects my decision to buy a game, because I won't buy something I can't see on impulse.

I don't think I'm the only person who thinks this way.

I think, in all honesty, that some priorities need to be rearranged.

[DarCowAlways]

The Steam browser-component works flawlessly and is perfectly fine. Why use Firefox/Opera/Chrome/etc? There's absolutely no point in doing so.

Whoa there. Steam's browser is flawless? Where have you been? Do you run windows 3.1?

[Bugerion]

My IE is broken somehow(cant watch videos on you tube,canty sign in)so I have to use Firefox so I cant do anything on steam :(:(:(:(

[Tummynomnom]

Steam will use firefox if you remove ie.

[Rubba Duck]

My steam works fine with IE deacctivated in add/remove programs --> Turn off/on Windows components.

About the only barrier I have come across is that preview screenshots in the Steam Store do not work. (Since it relies on an IE popup)

You can still view trailers, browse the steam store, use the friends service and community pages perfectly. (Haven't tried purchasing a game yet)

[Fuzz Bucket]

My steam works fine with IE deacctivated in add/remove programs --> Turn off/on Windows components.

About the only barrier I have come across is that preview screenshots in the Steam Store do not work. (Since it relies on an IE popup)

You can still view trailers, browse the steam store, use the friends service and community pages perfectly. (Haven't tried purchasing a game yet)
Steam will use firefox if you remove ie.
There is quite a bit of misinformation in the thread.
Steam uses Trident, the same layout engine used by IE.
"Removing" IE will not do anything to keep Steam from using Trident.

[t0wardz]

And it will not be moer easy to use the engine of Firefox that is a free-code web browser?

Or chrome?

[EiNZTEiN]

Steam's new UI uses Webkit (which is a way better engine than Gecko) ;)

[cyberwolf80]

I think the biggest problem here is lack of reading. I've read several threads on this topic and one precise question is ignored each time....
Why can't Steam use the default browser for external links? If it's opening a browser window that is NOT Steam itself, it should be using the computer's default browser, not defaulting to IE. And users should not be forced to "disable" IE for it.

[Epsilon]

I think the biggest problem here is lack of reading. I've read several threads on this topic and one precise question is ignored each time....
Why can't Steam use the default browser for external links? If it's opening a browser window that is NOT Steam itself, it should be using the computer's default browser, not defaulting to IE. And users should not be forced to "disable" IE for it. Won't be an issue much longer. The next version of Steam now in beta uses its own internal Webkit-based browser for any links it needs to open itself.

[Kailieann]

I think the biggest problem here is lack of reading. I've read several threads on this topic and one precise question is ignored each time....
Why can't Steam use the default browser for external links? If it's opening a browser window that is NOT Steam itself, it should be using the computer's default browser, not defaulting to IE. And users should not be forced to "disable" IE for it.

As Epsilon stated, this won't be an issue for too much longer.

But to answer your question, the (non-beta) Steam browser IS IE.
It can't open pop-up windows in Firefox for the same reason IE can't open pop-up windows in Firefox.
Just like Firefox can't open pop-up windows in IE, Chrome can't open pop-up windows in Opera, and so on and so forth.
The default browser has nothing to do with it.

[Mangr0v3]

Sure it could.

1) Look in registry for Firefox/Chrome/Safari installed location
2) launch exe
3) ???
4) Profit!!

[ultradude25]

It can't open pop-up windows in Firefox for the same reason IE can't open pop-up windows in Firefox.
Just like Firefox can't open pop-up windows in IE, Chrome can't open pop-up windows in Opera, and so on and so forth.
The default browser has nothing to do with it.
Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong.

[SilverShot]

Sure it could.

1) Look in registry for Firefox/Chrome/Safari installed location
2) launch exe
3) ???
4) Profit!!

Exactly, nothings impossible, theres always a way...

I hate all web browsers so can you VALVE provide me a personal one? great thanks.

[Kailieann]

Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong.

When was the last time you clicked a link in Firefox and it opened an instance of IE? Without any plugins installed.

I know IE sure as hell doesn't support that feature. Which is really the only thing that matters for the purposes of this discussion.

[ultradude25]

When was the last time you clicked a link in Firefox and it opened an instance of IE? Without any plugins installed.

I know IE sure as hell doesn't support that feature. Which is really the only thing that matters for the purposes of this discussion.
You see that's the thing; if you can do it with a plugin it could come standard with Firefox.
All Firefox would have to do it find "C:\Program Files\Internet Explorer\IEXPLORE.EXE" to launch a link in IE.

The same would be for Steam launching things in your default browser. Check your default programs settings, grab the directory to the program and launch it.

[Mr.Pringles]

If it works fine,
why are they changing their browser-component then ?