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binlargin
08-11-2009, 07:26 AM
I've recently ditched Windows and have been playing some of my games in Wine, some work, some don't.

It would be really nice if you guys offered some kind of minimal support for Wine, like maybe swapping the built-in browser for WebKit so that we can browse the store without having a complete Internet Explorer implementation, and possibly linking to winehq.org so people can check to see if a game will be supported before buying it.

I'm not sure about the current state of Darwine, but it's only getting better as time goes along. In a year or so I'm guessing that most games will work in Wine without any tinkering. I'm not asking you to do loads of testing on Linux and Macs or provide any assurances that games will work, just the bare minimum by keeping us in mind and acknowledging that Wine is a viable alternative to Windows.

Also, my main system is Linux now and I don't see this changing in the future.. I won't buy any future games that aren't working in Wine, but as a hacker I may make the effort to help support the existing ones I own.

Master_Odin
08-11-2009, 01:37 PM
Would love to see this implemented even though I'm more of a CrossOver user than a WINE user.

Numerous
08-11-2009, 06:07 PM
/signed.
Definitely, it would mean that the mac would be a somewhat viable gaming platform. It would be more of an issue of getting WINE to support all the games, seeig as how there are so many of them, and Valve can't control all of them.

Master_Odin
08-11-2009, 06:16 PM
/signed.
Definitely, it would mean that the mac would be a somewhat viable gaming platform. It would be more of an issue of getting WINE to support all the games, seeig as how there are so many of them, and Valve can't control all of them.
While the games themselves would have to be either:
a) supported by the developers themselves (unlikely)
b) the current volunteer community (what's already going on),

VALVe, could though make it better for their system to work better natively on Linux by changing such things as their browser system to use WebKit and be (like I said) Linux compatible instead of forcing for tedious work-arounds.

L.o.D.
08-11-2009, 06:25 PM
There are a reason why this won't happen anytime soon.
1: Steam is strictly a windows platform. Until linux etc catches up to windows in the operating system market, there won't be a steam that supports it.
And because of that, you won't see support at this time.

hiroe
08-11-2009, 07:11 PM
There are a reason why this won't happen anytime soon.
1: Steam is strictly a windows platform. Until linux etc catches up to windows in the operating system market, there won't be a steam that supports it.
And because of that, you won't see support at this time.

I can play all source engine games at almost the same efficiency as in windows. the problem is that steam takes up all of my first processor constantly. when it's a matter of doing a relatively small code change in exchange for supporting EVERY OTHER X86 OS (at least when playing l4d/hl2/gmod/css/etc...) I think it's worth there while to simply do the code changes. hell simply making it wine compatible would be good enough, you can use almost all the same code just switch out your weird esoteric libraries.

the only thing keeping me from playing most steam games in linux is steams poor compatibility.

for anybody who's interested there's a petition here (http://www.PetitionOnline.com/steam1/) and you can vote for wine to support it better here (http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?bIsQueue=false&bIsRejected=false&sClass=voteManager&iId=176223&sAction=edit&sReturnTo=http%3A%2F%2Fappdb.winehq.org%2FobjectMa nager.php%3FsClass%3Dversion%26amp%3BiId%3D1554&sTitle=Vote&iVersionId=1554)

Puggsy
08-11-2009, 08:33 PM
really? LOL

If you want to do gaming.. use a gaming platform.
You're trying to cross breeds, and it doesn't really work.

You might as well substitute a baseballbat with a tennis racket.

hiroe
08-11-2009, 09:10 PM
really? LOL

If you want to do gaming.. use a gaming platform.
You're trying to cross breeds, and it doesn't really work.

You might as well substitute a baseballbat with a tennis racket.

you mean like a console? your a pc gamer and you complaining that somebody else want's to use odd software. you might as well say "use ati? just get an nvidia card, it will solve your problem" or "use an emulator? just get an nes" if you going to try to eliminate choice you might as well just get a console.

it does evidently work as seen here (http://wiki.winehq.org/BenchMark-0.9.5), wine actually gets better speed with some types of rendering, that will only improve.

amnesiasoft
08-11-2009, 11:42 PM
Last I checked, Wine doesn't reimplement Trident, it just hammers Gecko into its place.

hiroe
08-12-2009, 12:44 AM
Last I checked, Wine doesn't reimplement Trident, it just hammers Gecko into its place.

that's, uhh, true... steam is good at webdev though so all it's pages follow web standards pretty well. it really doesn't matter what rendering engine it uses. I'm not sure why using firefox's rendering engine instead of microsofts is bad...

amnesiasoft
08-12-2009, 02:18 AM
WEll, the original post was saying something about "using webkit instead" so he didn't need a full internet explorer implementation, which really, doesn't make any sense since I was apparently right.

hiroe
08-12-2009, 02:29 AM
ahh I see, the only problems I'm having with it is high cpu usage but I heard some people were having problems with store and community pages.

binlargin
09-20-2009, 04:09 AM
Just played HL2 to completion again in Wine 1.1.29, works perfectly.
Portal: seems to work too, a bit slow though. I didn't play it all the way through.
TF2: Crashes on game start.

If the other HL2 games work, then the Orange Box could still be a viable purchase for Linux users. I'll test them soon. :)

Other games:
Multiwinia: Works a charm, didn't play a network game though.
Project Snowblind: Need to turn off DoF and put a registry hack in to fix the mouse cursor to the screen centre, don't move the mouse when starting the game or it will crash. Other than all this, it is playable.
Blue shift: hangs while starting server, could be due to firewall settings.
GTA1: Ugly crash
Uplink, Darwinia: Fail to start

srg_13
09-20-2009, 04:14 AM
Just played HL2 to completion again in Wine 1.1.29, works perfectly.
Portal: seems to work too, a bit slow though. I didn't play it all the way through.
TF2: Crashes on game start.

I've had the same experience here - played through HL2 and most of Portal, but TF2 is really slow...

binlargin
09-20-2009, 04:32 AM
I've had the same experience here - played through HL2 and most of Portal, but TF2 is really slow...
I've seen people saying they get a 100% speed boost by disabling shaders and using DirectX 8 on the command line, but I don't even get that far, the game crashes with some sound error at startup.

WEll, the original post was saying something about "using webkit instead" so he didn't need a full internet explorer implementation, which really, doesn't make any sense since I was apparently right.

HTML rendering isn't the issue, it's that Steam uses some IE specific things. You can't scroll, navigate or search let alone buy anything from the store, these are prerequisites for new users who don't have games in their account. If Steam used a non-Windows specific browser we wouldn't have the problem of needing a full implementation of the IE ActiveX control.

You might as well substitute a baseballbat with a tennis racket.
I see you trollan, I'm biting. I use a computer, I won't go back to a speak-n-spell just because it can play more games.

Fuzz Bucket
09-20-2009, 10:16 AM
I'd skip over Wine and Crossover and go straight for a native port for OS X.

KSib
09-23-2009, 02:30 AM
Seems like a waste of time and money. The Linux hardcore gaming base is pretty small. Also, getting graphics drivers to work on a Linux box can be a pain the butt for some people... seriously. Even if they made a Linux version of Steam, you'd still have to worry about game compatibility. I'm not really sure why everyone is so concerned about getting Steam on Linux when that's not a big deal when the focus should be on the games. This sounds like a secondary thing to worry about. When you installed Linux, I'm pretty sure you were conscious of the fact that you're installing OS that is used in the minority and therefore won't have as good of support as Windows or even Mac. This is the price you pay since you didn't want to pay for Windows.

As for macs... no one is honestly going to get a mac and then expect to be running a bunch of quality games on it if they're using their head at all. That would be like throwing your money away. No... it is throwing your money away. Getting a mac equivalent of what I have is EASILY over twice as much than I paid. Don't worry, I just customized one on their site to make sure. If you're not creating a program, website, movie, or anything else like that then you're probably wasting money if you just want one and are going to be playing games and checking email.

I think it just boils down to there not being enough of a base of people for this to be worth anyone's time. Right now that petition has just over 3k signatures. That's not many at all. I'm not saying people who have Linux aren't important. I'm just saying it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to business people to invest in such a small audience who seem to be coming along fine with WINE and Crossover.

Fuzz Bucket
09-23-2009, 04:43 AM
Seems like a waste of time and money. The Linux hardcore gaming base is pretty small. Also, getting graphics drivers to work on a Linux box can be a pain the butt for some people... seriously. Even if they made a Linux version of Steam, you'd still have to worry about game compatibility. I'm not really sure why everyone is so concerned about getting Steam on Linux when that's not a big deal when the focus should be on the games. This sounds like a secondary thing to worry about. When you installed Linux, I'm pretty sure you were conscious of the fact that you're installing OS that is used in the minority and therefore won't have as good of support as Windows or even Mac. This is the price you pay since you didn't want to pay for Windows.

As for macs... no one is honestly going to get a mac and then expect to be running a bunch of quality games on it if they're using their head at all. That would be like throwing your money away. No... it is throwing your money away. Getting a mac equivalent of what I have is EASILY over twice as much than I paid. Don't worry, I just customized one on their site to make sure. If you're not creating a program, website, movie, or anything else like that then you're probably wasting money if you just want one and are going to be playing games and checking email.

I think it just boils down to there not being enough of a base of people for this to be worth anyone's time. Right now that petition has just over 3k signatures. That's not many at all. I'm not saying people who have Linux aren't important. I'm just saying it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to business people to invest in such a small audience who seem to be coming along fine with WINE and Crossover.
When did the price of the machine ever become a factor?

Vithigar
09-23-2009, 02:51 PM
Linux is a choice that involves giving up 99% of all commercial software support. If you're going to use Linux you have to accept that you do your own support or look to the community.

Yes, it's free and open source, but there are tradeoffs for that. This isn't a case of you being "forced" into anything, this is simply a matter akin to buying a microwave and complaining that it doesn't make very good toast.