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Old 07-23-2010, 12:21 AM   #31
d10sfan
 
 
 
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Why do you like DRM so much, this is to the people who are "defending it"? What has it done for you that has made it worthy of that?

To me, DRM-type nonsense has been nothing but a headache almost all the time. Steam's hasnt given me much issues, because it has the offline mode among other things.

Securom is just plain annoying, having to insert your CD just to play a game. Ubisoft's DRM, relying on some servers to be on all the time just to play your game is a bit ridiculous. Plus, sometimes I like to be able to play my games offline.

The biggest failure I have seen in DRM is the failed amount of money thrown at it. Developers and publishers spend quite a lot to try and get these systems up and running, annoying the customers more than pirates, and then said pirates find a way around it a couple weeks later.

So basically, the costumers are stuck with weird and annoying restrictions, like not being able to install the game on more than 4 computers (especially on a Steam game, that is not right), or having to be online all the time. Then the people they are trying to stop, the pirates, are able to play their games illegally, for free, with none of those restrictions.
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Old 07-23-2010, 01:21 AM   #32
BroflMouth
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quint View Post
@Brofl

"distribute content and updates easily" (wow)
"Steam cloud and it is the only program that if a game has achievements on it I actually try to get them." (orly?only 1 program?)

I bet UPlay has almost all these so called "extras" that steam has.Plus,Ubisoft would add these in no time.My argument was in terms of DRM effectiveness on piracy,not "extras" or any of that stuff.

Saying "You don't have the slightest clue what you are trying to say in this specific case" or "Wow, you know so little of what you speak" isn't applicable because you didn't even get my whole view nor answered my questions lol.You're right,debating with YOU isn't worth it cause there's nothing to debate.
I did answer your questions, you asked who thinks Steam is an effective DRM. I said it isn't supposed to stop piracy like this DRM. Than you asked if I would still support it if they made it harder to crack, since that isn't their goal that doesn't matter. And to simply answer your question, that depends exactly what they did, if they made Steam very intrusive than I would not support it. I said those things about you not having full understanding of the topic you are trying to discuss because you were discussing Steam as a form of ineffective DRM when DRM is not what it aims to be.

Steam is great for easy updating but I don't think that I really need to explain why. And I don't achievement hunt if my friends and such can't see my progress and all the ones I have unlocked, in other games that have achievements integrated into the game I know as soon as I delete that game I lose all my hard work on those things. I know I can back up my save file usually but Steam just simplifies and adds other people seeing it to the equation.

Ubisofts DRM is intrusive, and isn't as community based as Steam now is. So even if they added those things (Ubisoft does have a sort of Steam Cloud where it syncs up some save files or something) I still won't be using it. Also, I am curious about what your whole view is? I would be perfectly fine with discussing this issue with you if you would give me more of your point of view.

Steam's effectiveness as a DRM doesn't stop piracy, that is completely true, but as I said Steam isn't trying to stop piracy so a comparision between DRM effectiveness with Ubisofts DRM and Steam isn't fair. Steam does have a few perks that don't stay with pirated versions though, achievements don't make the translation, along with co-op games that require inviting people on your friends list to play with them.

Please tell me your whole view. Re-reading your posts I can no longer tell exactly what you are trying to tell us, are you trying to tell us Steam doesn't work as DRM? Or are you trying to tell us Ubisoft DRM DOES work well and using Steam as an example of inferior software? Please give me a hand here.

If under some bizarre circumstances I completely mis read both of your posts and have created an argument out of a post that's intention wasn't to put down Steam or support this DRM I completely apologize.
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Old 07-23-2010, 02:08 AM   #33
mriguy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quint View Post
you're right...its not possible

but let me chip in one point here...who ever said steam is a successful DRM?are you all brain dead on something?Steam DRM gets cracked within 24 hours.

If VALVE decides to take away the offline mode or make the drm quite strong to crack by pirates(they can do it if they want btw),would you still support Steam?I bet the pirates here(or elsewhere) won't.
That's why 2K, SQUARE ENIX, SEGA and Activision used Steam exclusively on some titles. Even EA removed third party DRM on most of their Steam releases. You better tell all these publishers that Steam's DRM is insufficient. Besides, DRM has never been about stopping pirates. All DRM gets cracked. It is about providing a significant level of protection with a minimum impact on your customer. Ubisoft has lost touch with its customer base. The executives sit huddled in a dark corner seeing every pirated copy as a lost sale.

Last edited by mriguy: 07-23-2010 at 02:13 AM.
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Old 07-23-2010, 06:18 AM   #34
Poioioio
 
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There are still ppl arguing about the DRM ?
It's bad, everyone knows that. Others are just closing their eyes or trolling.
On the other hand, the game is good. Eugene's dev'team deserve success here,
but it might not do it (as well as it should) just because of Ubisoft's politics. A shame.
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Old 07-28-2010, 12:00 PM   #35
Fiya
 
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Originally Posted by LordCurlyFry View Post
Cute.



Cuter.

Please learn to cleanse your argument of logical fallacies before you post. Now you just sound stupid, ignorant and like someone paid by a publisher to argue on the internet about how good and reasonable DRM is.
Unfortunately I have not had time to respond lately and I don't have time to go through the thread right now. But I will respond quickly. I took a look through my post to see if being tired turned me into a illogical fanatic. I honestly don't see your point whatsoever. Its an opinion. It should all make sense to you, if you do realize that yours is not the only opinion. Think outside the box for one moment, just look at what I've said from the 'other side'. If you can't see any of it, then you my friend are the illogical fanatic. I have a long history with DRM, what I am saying about it does not come from hearsay. If you actually know about DRM and the ways to bypass it and the community that does it, you will realize my point has some merit.

I have to ask is what exactly your 'logic' is. It seems my outlook on DRM contains none, yet yours must without any explanation.

I'm not trying to convert people here, I'm trying to get fools to stop being cute ignorant fools.

Do you REALLY think that everyone in the world hates DRM and doesn't see a point in it? Very few people can argue without actually giving reasons, you are not one of those people.

Got to go!
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Old 07-29-2010, 06:09 AM   #36
Philipus II
 
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Serial keys are the easy and probably safest wy to protect an online game.
Cracking serial keys isn't possible. The pirates can play the game in LAN and they host cracked servers like in counter strike / counterstrike source / dod and so on, but they can't play the game on official servers. That's it.
DRM will be cracked. It's only a matter of time.
In call of duty modern warfare II priates even could play the official multiplayer- great work

For the customer who pays for games a serial key is easy. You need about 10 seconds and its done.
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Old 07-29-2010, 04:50 PM   #37
BroflMouth
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philipus II View Post
Serial keys are the easy and probably safest wy to protect an online game.
Cracking serial keys isn't possible. The pirates can play the game in LAN and they host cracked servers like in counter strike / counterstrike source / dod and so on, but they can't play the game on official servers. That's it.
DRM will be cracked. It's only a matter of time.
In call of duty modern warfare II priates even could play the official multiplayer- great work

For the customer who pays for games a serial key is easy. You need about 10 seconds and its done.
MW2 people COULD, I don't believe they can now.
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:24 PM   #38
sfade
 
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Well, the arguments aside... Ubisoft's DRM has been very successful at significantly stunting their PC platform sales performance. You only have to look at their fiscal's and the result of the DRM is obvious. Apparently it doesn't really convert enough 'pirates' into customers to replace the ones they lost because of it.
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Old 08-02-2010, 04:49 AM   #39
Philipus II
 
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I think reading and understanding the official reports about sold games and earnings isn't that easy. The advantages and disadvantages of high end copy protection in real world are unidentified.
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Old 08-09-2010, 06:39 PM   #40
xplay2.0
 
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I would like to play offline skirmish when I lose my internet due to Mediacom.
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Old 08-25-2010, 08:59 PM   #41
me_loco
 
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i'm all for DRM

I'm in favor of game protecting. If hacking drops down then more people would buy games meaning less likeliness of console port games. Many companies abandoned PC gaming or focused on console because few idiots decided to make a home project and crack games and few idiots follow path and download cracked games. I say UBI, reinforce strict rules, online is the only option to check legitimacy of purchased games if DRM detects cracked game then record PC credentials and prevent this user from even installing a legitimate version of this game, idiots don't learn the easy way.
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Old 08-26-2010, 05:26 AM   #42
DoReMi
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by me_loco View Post
I'm in favor of game protecting. If hacking drops down then more people would buy games meaning less likeliness of console port games. Many companies abandoned PC gaming or focused on console because few idiots decided to make a home project and crack games and few idiots follow path and download cracked games. I say UBI, reinforce strict rules, online is the only option to check legitimacy of purchased games if DRM detects cracked game then record PC credentials and prevent this user from even installing a legitimate version of this game, idiots don't learn the easy way.
Do you really believe developers/publishers arent interested in the PC market because of piracy? The console market is easier to develop for due to pre-set size-restrictions of console-games, clear hardware-specifications/-limitations, and because there's obviously more money in it.

For everyone else here who isn't anti-DRM, go read this whole article and then talk about piracy and DRM when you have a remote idea of what you're on about.

Dolla dolla bill y'all.
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