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Old 04-11-2012, 09:34 AM   #1
giskarduk
 
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REQ Block Feature for Steam Workshop

Hello Steam

I am a modder and I love the direction your going on with Steam Workshop, you have already done a lot to solve some problems within the Elder Scrolls modding community.

Such as allowing modders to moderate their own pages, that was good, making download and installation of mods easy, that is good. All welcome features.

But moderating comments does not remove the problem of Elder Scrolls fans endlessly raging at modders over petty issues and causing the modders to remove their work and stop modding.

What we need is a block feature, we need to have the power to block the worst cases, denying them download access completely to our mods.

The trolls are usually our own mod users and they want our mods, when the modder has the power to deny them download access and stop them seeing any of his mods, they usually start to behave more reasonably.

EVERYBODY gets to enjoy the mods not just the trolls.

We modders are often punished for sharing our work with folk publicly, this is needed for our sanity. Remember we are not getting paid for this. There is no customer to company relationship between the mod maker working for free and the player downloading for free. This is a different world from yours steam. We need this and players want our mods to stay available. And this give us a chance at doing that for them.

Last edited by giskarduk: 04-11-2012 at 09:37 AM.
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Old 04-11-2012, 10:27 AM   #2
bobczes
 
 
 
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I support this effort. Modders are entitled to restrict access to their work with sufficient cause. Free downloads do not infer nor should they allow unrestricted and uncensored criticism.

The skilled people who create these mods should have some control over the dissemination of their work product.
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Old 04-11-2012, 10:32 AM   #3
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I totally agree with this. Modders ought to be treated with, at least a minimum of common courtesy. Someone needs to moderate what goes on, and if Steam is unable to do it themselves, then the obvious solution would be to empower the modders to do it.
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Old 04-11-2012, 10:51 AM   #4
giskarduk
 
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I have asked players to post their support for this, it should remain friendly and not need moderating.

But I wish to add that the threat of being blocked from downloading a mod a player wants is on its own reason to behave. The Elder Scrolls community has heavily trolled its best modders for years and keeps driving them away. There has never been a reason for them to think twice before doing it.

This would give them that reason and improve things for everybody.

Remember forums have moderators, block functions, punishments for reason, these download sites have nothing like that and usually turn in to a troll fest pretty quickly.

Last edited by giskarduk: 04-11-2012 at 10:56 AM.
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:34 AM   #5
keiskay2
 
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i wouldnt say block them from downloading access, but say from commenting and PMing the modders would work fine. but then again sometimes a full out block is the best solution, either way im in support of it.
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Old 04-11-2012, 02:26 PM   #6
giskarduk
 
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Modders can already remove comments from their download page, it helps remove the bulk of comments that are not actually about the mod. But it does not stop the trolls from coming back and doing it again. Anything short of an out right block would be worthless to modders.

Players worrying about being blocked all ready and wanting appeals and so forth is a sign this idea is already working. They see them selves being blocked, if this idea comes in you can bank on them being fair to the modders instead of their usual hostile selves.

The threat of the block holds more value for modders than the block it self. More people will avoid the block because it exists, than will be blocked.
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Old 04-11-2012, 05:59 PM   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #7
alden
 
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Thanks for the feedback. We've seen this issue come up a few times, and have a fix in the works.

With the next Steam client update, users you have blocked will no longer be able to comment on your Workshop items.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:25 PM   #8
Breton Warrior
 
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alden View Post
Thanks for the feedback. We've seen this issue come up a few times, and have a fix in the works.

With the next Steam client update, users you have blocked will no longer be able to comment on your Workshop items.
Now that is a great thing to read, thank you Steam/Valve.

I fully support this and not just as a Modder but as a Mod user and player because I am sick of seeing Modders leave the Workshop due to the lack of respect they are given by those players who believe Moders are here to be abused instead of thanked. BW
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Old 04-11-2012, 09:03 PM   #9
Doombuggie41
 
 
 
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I'd say the appeal process would be at the dissgresion of the modder. The modder made the mod and should choose who gets it and who doesn't in a way.

I know on a minecraft server I help run, I let banned rule breakers appeal their ban. They come and plead their case on why they should be unbanned and I usually ban them for up to 2 weeks depending on the offence. People who just keep breaking rules get as one of our former moderators would say "PERMABANNED!"

But we clearly state in our rules that if you break a rule, you will be banned.

I think appeals are an extra nice thing to do versus something that admins should do.

My 2 cents on the matter...

Quote:
Thanks for the feedback. We've seen this issue come up a few times, and have a fix in the works.

With the next Steam client update, users you have blocked will no longer be able to comment on your Workshop items.
Awesome, but why not restrict the DL access for the trolls blocked by the modder.

Lets say I block Jim from my mod, he can still use it and can still get his hands on my mod even though he is a troll whom is just trying to ruin my day. He might just make another steam account and troll me with that, or come to my site and harass me there. Restricting access is a serious thing, and really should be a serious punishment. Blocking comments is a start.

Great to know that Valve has their eyes open on the matter, <3 you guys. Thanks for the portal 2 DLC too, been having a blast with it

Last edited by Doombuggie41: 04-11-2012 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 04-11-2012, 10:24 PM   #10
giskarduk
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alden View Post
Thanks for the feedback. We've seen this issue come up a few times, and have a fix in the works.

With the next Steam client update, users you have blocked will no longer be able to comment on your Workshop items.
That sounds nice on paper but my experience it will not work. You are just pushing the trouble off steam. Not ending it as the original idea would have done. Modders are still going to end up quitting and pulling their mods and 1000s of players are still going to be upset every time that happens.

You are also assuming its 1 person that can be blocked doing it, its not, its a few hundred trolls venting at the modder all the same time, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. That is not going to be stopped by blocking users from commenting.

You might as well ask us to play wack the mole.

We need an way to out right ban a troll from downloading anything by a modder. If you give us that, nobody will want to be a troll on steam or anywhere else. Suddenly good manners will be the fashion within the TES community and everybody will be allowed to enjoy them selves, even us modders.

I know this because I already do this from my own website and it works. You see the trolls are my own mod users and I happen to know they want the mods more than they want to troll. Thats why this works.

Give us modders a carrot and I'll show you how its used.

PS I know steam like to take things slowly and get things right and this is a step in the right direction but its no fix for the problem. You are not understanding the nature of the beast here or who the beast is.

Last edited by giskarduk: 04-11-2012 at 10:29 PM.
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:05 PM   #11
wombat_of_war
 
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I definitely see the need for this feature and whole heartedly support Giskarduk in this. It needs to go go beyond merely blocking comments and allowing a modder to individually block trolls from downloading their personal work they have put so many hours into making
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:11 PM   #12
giskarduk
 
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Its a question numbers for me, I neither have the time nor the inclination to give up modding to become a full time moderator because I have to block 1 user at a time just to stop them commenting when there is a small armour of other players waiting in line to troll too. I would be there all day and get nothing done.

If i can say, misbehave and I'll make sure you never get to download my mods again, that message will keep all the trolls in line in 1 easy move.
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Old 04-12-2012, 11:45 AM   #13
Mr_K
 
 
 
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Hi Alden;

I love all the Great Mods Giskarduk has made, and I know he has a lot of trouble from many Rude and unhelpful people that waste his time, and make him want to give up Modding. The only way for a very active Modder to have time to help the Players with their Mods, is for everybody to be polite and give complete and useful information with their questions and suggestions to any Modder.

When a person just says a lot of rude and argumentative things to a Modder, they are not being supportive or helpful, and if the Player in question is being what is often called Trollish, than I think the best way to stop that kind of behavior is to have a way to block a Player from downloading any Mod from a Modder that has Blocked or Banned them for being a time wasting and Modder discouraging person. The loss of the privilege to download and use a Mod is a strong incentive to be polite. To truly block a person would be to block them using another or a new account to get back and start being rude all over again. It would be a tool for a Modder to use to force an end to Rudeness on-line. With this ability to block a Player from having access to a Modders Mods will be a strong incentive to clean up the TES communities.

We all want to have Mods to add to our games and we all need Modders to make them for us for Free. And anything you can do to help Modders like Giskarduk be able to make Mods would be helpful.

A concerned Player and a Friend of Several Modders.

Mr. K
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Old 04-12-2012, 12:54 PM   #14
NDCowdy
 
 
 
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I would also like to back the idea of being able to block abusive players from downloading your work.
As it stands I am planning on using the friends only feature to control who accesses work I am about to release. I think though it would be a shame if modders gradually changed to doing just this as the variety and the lifeblood of the Steam Workshop would dry up.
Steam Workshop seems such a good idea and has potential to be a great, controlled environment for people to share their creativity.
As such a lot of the community seem to have forgotten (or never learnt) their netiquette or even common courtesy having tools to reinforce boundaries seems logical.
Generally someone wouldn't walk up to a stranger in the street and start mouthing off at them especially if they were giving them free gifts.
Being able to stop them posting on the modders files is certainly an action (and I imagine maybe an easier one than some to implement), but it seems a little like just being able to stick your fingers in your ears and not listen to the idiot on the street who is still taking free gifts from you.
Surely not stopping giving the freebies is actually reinforcing the bad behaviour.
And it might help the modder to remain the grown up and not just punch the idiot in the face, not sure what the online equivalent of that loss of temper would be
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:28 PM   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #15
alden
 
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I totally see your points (and agree), and we very much want to provide modders the tools they need to help foster a friendly environment in which to play, work and share. To that end, we will be continuing to work on features that help address these issues.

To help us understand the issue more fully, can you point us to instances of this harsh trolling that is driving authors away from the Workshop? Are there specific comment threads we can see as examples of this?

Comment blocking should be public now (If you view someone's profile, click 'Block All Communications' in the right column). Those blocked users won't be able to comment on any of your workshop items.
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