SSD Drives

Wotawally · 05-09-2012, 03:09 AM

Prices in the UK are now beginning to come down, and it is getting nearer the time when I consider upgrading.

A couple of questions to current owners:
How does this compare to yours in speed etc.:

Max Read: up to 525MB/s
Max Write: up to 500MB/s
Random Write 4KB: 45,000 IOPS
Maximum 4K Random Write: 85,000 IOPS
SATA 6Gbps / Backwards Compatible 3Gbps
Native TRIM support
Seek Time: .1ms
Slim 2.5" Design
Operating Temp: 0°C ~ 70°C
Ambient Temp: 0°C ~ 55°C
Storage Temp: -45°C ~ 85°C
Low Power Consumption: 2.7W Active, 1.5W Idle
Shock Resistant up to 1500G
RAID Support
MTBF: 2 million hours

Also the choice will be either SSD for the OS Drive or SSD for the Steam/TS2012 drive. Forgetting the rest of my programs - what would benefit my Steam games more?

Marleyman · 05-09-2012, 03:18 AM

You benefit most from the games or programs that Read/Write to the drive often, so if you know the game does not R/W the drive leave it on a mechanical drive.

TS2012 loads tiles of scenery during play so the most benefit would be to have TS2012 on the SSD.

Wotawally · 05-09-2012, 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marleyman

TS2012 loads tiles of scenery during play so the most benefit would be to have TS2012 on the SSD.

Thanks,

Replacing Steam HD will make life a lot simpler than replacing the OS drive - but will mean a larger, and thus more expensive, SSD.
(256Gb instead of a 64 or 128Gb).

HazySarkany · 05-09-2012, 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotawally

Thanks,

Replacing Steam HD will make life a lot simpler than replacing the OS drive - but will mean a larger, and thus more expensive, SSD.
(256Gb instead of a 64 or 128Gb).

I'd love to get an SSD, but I'm considering doing it in conjunction with a Z68/Z77/H77-chipset (Sandy Bridge or later) motherboard with "Smart Response" caching. This is where the motherboard uses your SSD as a cache for the hard drive and just mirrors all the frequently accessed content on the SSD. A variant of that is the hard drives you see marketed with a small SSD co-located on the drive to make a hybrid 'SSD/HDD.'

The cache size is limited to 64Gb though, so they say that for content beyond 64Gb you just put it on another SSD.

I'd be interested to hear about that kind of performance boost.

I boosted up to 12Gb of RAM and my system is fairly responsive, but I'm definitely still IO bound.

Wikipedia on Smart Response Technology

Yonkers Chris · 05-09-2012, 07:51 AM

Look at SEAGATE drives they have a HYBRID with SSD Cache,Or WD Velociraptor 750 Gig or 1TB Spinning at 10,000rpm

arizonachris · 05-09-2012, 08:15 AM

I have read too many say that even an SSD doesn't help RW that much. I had a RAID 0 with two fast SATA II drives and it helped RW a little, but not a lot.

But, if you are ready for an upgrade and can afford it, go for it. Windows will eat up a nice portion of that drive, so you may want Windows on a seperate mechanical drive, along with the swap file.

And, for what a used car costs, the OCZ Revo Drive is the ultimate SSD. Uses a PCI-E slot, not the SATA buss. Fastest drive made. (about $1,200USD)

hodderd · 05-09-2012, 09:34 AM

I use an SSD since a month with W7 64 bit and there is virtually no stutter anymore due to the speed of access. It was an expensive upgrade but well worth it.

David

Father Tiresias · 05-09-2012, 12:47 PM

prices of ssd have been dropping slowly for quite some time here in the uk, but recently a fairly new company has just pushed the prices for 120 gigs below the hundred pound marker (£20+ less than anyone else!) and add to that several big players have also just jumped on the ssd bandwagon and brought out their lines, all that within just a few months, sounds like price war is just about starting.

just my opinion, wait 6 months and see what you can get then.

Wotawally · 05-09-2012, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Father Tiresias

prices of ssd have been dropping slowly for quite some time here in the uk, but recently a fairly new company has just pushed the prices for 120 gigs below the hundred pound marker (£20+ less than anyone else!) and add to that several big players have also just jumped on the ssd bandwagon and brought out their lines, all that within just a few months, sounds like price war is just about starting.

just my opinion, wait 6 months and see what you can get then.

It was only recently that they started to drop in the States to a dollar a Gb, so this drop to a similar price in the UK is no surprise after they had been holding up to £1+ per Gb for some time.

Incidentally: this is what caught my eye -
http://www.ebuyer.com/278645-ocz-240...t3-25sat3-240g

I haven't started any serious research into SSDs yet, but apart from getting cheaper - are they getting faster, or are some faster than others.
(Forgetting the OCZ Revo Drive - unless Arizonachris is going to gift one to me.)

michbret · 05-09-2012, 01:22 PM

Personally I had an SSD on my main desktop for system but I had steam and all the games on a classical HDD. Nine month ago I decided to move RW3/TS2012 (but only this game) to the SSD.
I used the junction feature of win 7 to trick Steam so I only moved RW3 (Read This)

What are the benefits :
- Faster loading time (!!! great) when starting the game or loading a scenario
- Faster refresh in package manager or packager
- RW_Tools also benefit with faster scanning
- Faster "Verify local game cache" with Steam

- Little improvement on stuttering

No or negligible improvement on FPS which confirm my analysis that this game is very poorly programmed.

Three month ago, I upgraded my laptop by changing the HDD with a SSD: So the system, RW3 and all the steam games I had on this laptop got the improvement.
Even if the laptop got a fantastic boost (Win 7 boot is faster than bios time!), the status with RW3 is exactly the same.

To be complete, my Railworks directory is around 90 GB!

In conclusion, I would say that the improvement is nice on loading times but doesn't change a lot for in game experience.
However, I wouldn't go backward !

Necrosan · 05-09-2012, 01:30 PM

An SSD or a RAM drive with gobs of RAM & software like SuperCache (http://www.superspeed.com/desktop/supercache.php) or Fancycache (http://www.romexsoftware.com/en-us/fancy-cache/) is the _only_ way to get rid of the laggy behavior in more demanding routes.

Look at your hard drive activity light when doing a faster/more demanding route. You'll see exactly what I mean when it lights up like a christmas tree.

It was a day/night difference moving my RailWorks folder onto my SSD.

Wotawally · 05-09-2012, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michbret

In conclusion, I would say that the improvement is nice on loading times but doesn't change a lot for in game experience.
However, I wouldn't go backward !

Thankyou for the detailed post. +rep to you.
As I get no stuttering, and very good frame rates with my current Steam HD, it seems to be a very expensive upgrade just to save a few seconds in loading times.

I now think I will wait until the price comes down to 2Gb per £1 and then reconsider.

Kcspaceman · 05-09-2012, 01:48 PM

I have similar experiences as michbret. I have my OS and TS2012 on an SSD, and load times in TS2012 are much improved (still perhaps 15-30 seconds maybe, but much better than the many minutes it took before). However, in-game performance is unchanged.

I have two copies of Steam installed, one on the SSD for TS2012 and one on my external HDD for all my other Steam games. My SSD is effectively 85GB in size (partitioned) for Win 7 and TS2012, which I feel is a good size. 64GB might be kind of tight. My external HDD is 250GB.

To the OP, The specs you list are pretty standard these days, and are largely due to the "controller" used which is nearly identical even across different brands. Nonetheless, do your research and look at benchmarks, as it's likely for the same price there's still a decent variation of speed.

An SSD of any type is one of the best upgrades you can do for any computer, and you won't be disappointed.

Wotawally · 05-09-2012, 01:53 PM

Kcspaceman:
Thanks - that was very useful.

culleydog34 · 05-10-2012, 12:13 PM

i have 2 ssd's and i use the second ssd for railworks only and its smokes on load times, no lag either, still considering upgrading my cpu from the sandybridge to the ivybridge

05-09-2012, 03:09 AM	#1
Wotawally Join Date: Jan 2011 Reputation: 144 Posts: 1,670	SSD Drives Prices in the UK are now beginning to come down, and it is getting nearer the time when I consider upgrading. A couple of questions to current owners: How does this compare to yours in speed etc.: Max Read: up to 525MB/s Max Write: up to 500MB/s Random Write 4KB: 45,000 IOPS Maximum 4K Random Write: 85,000 IOPS SATA 6Gbps / Backwards Compatible 3Gbps Native TRIM support Seek Time: .1ms Slim 2.5" Design Operating Temp: 0°C ~ 70°C Ambient Temp: 0°C ~ 55°C Storage Temp: -45°C ~ 85°C Low Power Consumption: 2.7W Active, 1.5W Idle Shock Resistant up to 1500G RAID Support MTBF: 2 million hours Also the choice will be either SSD for the OS Drive or SSD for the Steam/TS2012 drive. Forgetting the rest of my programs - what would benefit my Steam games more?

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05-09-2012, 03:18 AM	#2
Marleyman Join Date: Jun 2010 Reputation: 97 Posts: 575	You benefit most from the games or programs that Read/Write to the drive often, so if you know the game does not R/W the drive leave it on a mechanical drive. TS2012 loads tiles of scenery during play so the most benefit would be to have TS2012 on the SSD.

05-09-2012, 07:51 AM	#5
Yonkers Chris Join Date: Mar 2012 Reputation: 1 Posts: 94	Look at SEAGATE drives they have a HYBRID with SSD Cache,Or WD Velociraptor 750 Gig or 1TB Spinning at 10,000rpm

05-09-2012, 08:15 AM	#6
arizonachris Join Date: Aug 2009 Reputation: 620 Posts: 6,438	I have read too many say that even an SSD doesn't help RW that much. I had a RAID 0 with two fast SATA II drives and it helped RW a little, but not a lot. But, if you are ready for an upgrade and can afford it, go for it. Windows will eat up a nice portion of that drive, so you may want Windows on a seperate mechanical drive, along with the swap file. And, for what a used car costs, the OCZ Revo Drive is the ultimate SSD. Uses a PCI-E slot, not the SATA buss. Fastest drive made. (about $1,200USD)

05-09-2012, 09:34 AM	#7
hodderd Join Date: Jan 2011 Reputation: 30 Posts: 293	I use an SSD since a month with W7 64 bit and there is virtually no stutter anymore due to the speed of access. It was an expensive upgrade but well worth it. David

05-09-2012, 12:47 PM	#8
Father Tiresias Join Date: Oct 2010 Reputation: 20 Posts: 82	prices of ssd have been dropping slowly for quite some time here in the uk, but recently a fairly new company has just pushed the prices for 120 gigs below the hundred pound marker (£20+ less than anyone else!) and add to that several big players have also just jumped on the ssd bandwagon and brought out their lines, all that within just a few months, sounds like price war is just about starting. just my opinion, wait 6 months and see what you can get then.

05-09-2012, 01:22 PM	#10
michbret Join Date: Jan 2011 Reputation: 74 Posts: 723	Personally I had an SSD on my main desktop for system but I had steam and all the games on a classical HDD. Nine month ago I decided to move RW3/TS2012 (but only this game) to the SSD. I used the junction feature of win 7 to trick Steam so I only moved RW3 (Read This) What are the benefits : - Faster loading time (!!! great) when starting the game or loading a scenario - Faster refresh in package manager or packager - RW_Tools also benefit with faster scanning - Faster "Verify local game cache" with Steam - Little improvement on stuttering No or negligible improvement on FPS which confirm my analysis that this game is very poorly programmed. Three month ago, I upgraded my laptop by changing the HDD with a SSD: So the system, RW3 and all the steam games I had on this laptop got the improvement. Even if the laptop got a fantastic boost (Win 7 boot is faster than bios time!), the status with RW3 is exactly the same. To be complete, my Railworks directory is around 90 GB! In conclusion, I would say that the improvement is nice on loading times but doesn't change a lot for in game experience. However, I wouldn't go backward !

05-09-2012, 01:30 PM	#11
Necrosan Join Date: Feb 2012 Reputation: 32 Posts: 89	An SSD or a RAM drive with gobs of RAM & software like SuperCache (http://www.superspeed.com/desktop/supercache.php) or Fancycache (http://www.romexsoftware.com/en-us/fancy-cache/) is the _only_ way to get rid of the laggy behavior in more demanding routes. Look at your hard drive activity light when doing a faster/more demanding route. You'll see exactly what I mean when it lights up like a christmas tree. It was a day/night difference moving my RailWorks folder onto my SSD.

05-09-2012, 01:48 PM	#13
Kcspaceman Join Date: Jan 2010 Reputation: 2 Posts: 31	I have similar experiences as michbret. I have my OS and TS2012 on an SSD, and load times in TS2012 are much improved (still perhaps 15-30 seconds maybe, but much better than the many minutes it took before). However, in-game performance is unchanged. I have two copies of Steam installed, one on the SSD for TS2012 and one on my external HDD for all my other Steam games. My SSD is effectively 85GB in size (partitioned) for Win 7 and TS2012, which I feel is a good size. 64GB might be kind of tight. My external HDD is 250GB. To the OP, The specs you list are pretty standard these days, and are largely due to the "controller" used which is nearly identical even across different brands. Nonetheless, do your research and look at benchmarks, as it's likely for the same price there's still a decent variation of speed. An SSD of any type is one of the best upgrades you can do for any computer, and you won't be disappointed.

05-09-2012, 01:53 PM	#14
Wotawally Join Date: Jan 2011 Reputation: 144 Posts: 1,670	Kcspaceman: Thanks - that was very useful.

05-10-2012, 12:13 PM	#15
culleydog34 Join Date: Dec 2011 Reputation: 16 Posts: 473	i have 2 ssd's and i use the second ssd for railworks only and its smokes on load times, no lag either, still considering upgrading my cpu from the sandybridge to the ivybridge