09-18-2011, 12:46 AM
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#1 |
 Join Date: Jul 2009
Reputation: 208
Posts: 788
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My Review
Hey guys. I didn't really see a good review of the game on these forums, so I figured I'd contribute a quick one after I finished my playthrough. Note that I'm basing this on single player only; I've had enough of this game and don't care to mess with MP.
My Racing Background I didn't get into racing games until the last 2-3 years. I'm not much of a car person in real life, and they seemed same-y and repetitive. But I saw GRID on sale and picked it up. Fell in love. I played through the entire game, then spent hundreds of hours online messing around. I also played DiRT 2 and found a lot to love there too. Then I went back and played a few other titles that aren't as highly regarded (DiRT 1, FUEL, Need for Speed Undercover). I completed all of them (at the default difficulty or a notch above) but they didn't quite have the same flair for me that DiRT 2 and GRID had. Then I saw Midnight Club 2 had a metascore in the mid 80's. I thought "this should break the mediocre streak". My First Impressions I started with the "Career Mode", and the premise here is pretty cool. Three detailed locales (LA, Paris, and Tokyo). There aren't any collectibles, but it's kinda fun to just drive around the city. While driving around you see other people you can race. You flash your headlights to initiate a chase, follow them to their race location, and start a series of races (2 to 3). If you beat them you get their car. Pretty cool, right? Open world. Pick your opponents. Earn better cars. We're gonna have some fun with this... Or are we? Oh, the Flaws!! The Controls When I played previous racing games, I found the XBox 360 controller worked rather well. Most games natively detected and supported the controller, and even made use of the analog sticks and analog gas/brake buttons to really make me feel like I had some control with the driving. Now, I understand this is an older game, and it probably works quite well with a PS2 controller. But it was a really annoying getting this game to work with the 360 gamepad. I was able to get it to work natively, but it refused to take advantage of the shoulder buttons. It was very awkward to race using the front controller buttons for brake, gas, and turbo. I ended up using a free version of Xpadder per the recommendations on this forum. Using Xpadder I was able to finally map gas/brake/turbo where they ought to be. However, still there was a problem: Even though Xpadder knew the shoulder buttons were analog button, the game seemed to refuse to recognize that they were analog buttons. This means that pressing gas or brake ever so slightly would result in the same burst that holding the button down all the way would. Coming from DiRT, where achieving mastery over being sensitive with the gas was paramount to victory, this came as quite a shock. While the game recognized the analog stick and I was happy to finally have shoulder buttons, the lack of analog button support for gas/brake really bothered me all throughout. The Interface Now, a lot of people complain about console ports. I usually don't think it's such a big deal to context-sensitive buttons or menus designed for consoles. But the interface for this game is really atrocious. There was no easy way to compare cars. I was constantly switching between the keyboard and my gamepad, which was distracting. In addition, all the documentation I found related to the PS2 gamepad. I couldn't find a way in-game to show me what all the keys do, and most of the stuff online even refers to the PS2 gamepad. This is an annoying problem. With no way to remap keys and no documentation telling you what keys do what you're kind of on your own. I'm already having to use Xpadder just to remap the damn keys! Can't you at least tell me what each key does so I know what to map?! Overall, I found the interface to be horribly uninformative and a pain to navigate. The Racing There's a good racing game in here somewhere, but I found it to be just buried in flaws. The underlying problem here is the challenge. I gave my background because I wanted to give you an idea of my racing experience. I'm not a pro guys. When I play racing games online, I'm usually somewhere in the middle of the pack. When I play single player, I usually beat the game with fairly little difficulty on the normal setting or just above that. I found this game to be harder than others I've played in the genre. Which isn't bad. But it's hard for all the wrong reasons, which makes things just frustrating. Allow me to explain all the cheap components. The AI: So you're typically going to be racing against about 5-7 opponents. And you have to beat all of them to move to the next race. The problem is: they don't care about winning the race. They only care about crashing you and only you. If they're behind you, they'll hit nitro and try to spin you out. If they're in front of you, they'll try to swerve and spin you out. If they're to your side, they'll try to ram you in the wall or into traffic. Now, I don't mind a little aggression; truth be told, the AI in GRID is probably too passive and online I get annoyed when the slightest bump will unleash a torrent of flaming. But when you have jumps and nitros that need to be lined up or you're screwed, and traffic everywhere, the slightest bump is game over. In addition, while the AI is slowed down by traffic, I've read that the AI only sees traffic when they're around your vicinity. This means if one guy breaks ahead (because another crashed you), you're screwed, because they won't have traffic to slow them down. Long story short, the AI plays cheap and does everything they can to turn a frustrating game into a maddening one for you. Also, they typically have faster cars than you. The Traffic The traffic is one of the big draws to this game; this notion that you're really street driving and have to deal with civilian traffic is somewhat novel. But they are also so cheap and frustrating. Often they will swerve in front of you (wtf, why are you swerving into the INCOMING traffic lane out of no where?!). Often your AI will pass right before traffic converges right in front of you and you're blocked. Often you'll make a turn only to find a bus blocks the entire passage into an area you need to go. Also, some races have police cars that are even more aggressive than the AI at crashing you. The problem, again, is they seem to target you and only you. The Jumps The game has some pretty crazy jumps. The problem is, even if I took a jump straight-on without wiggling or anything, it was often a crapshoot what would happen to my car when I landed. Sometimes I would land OK, sometimes I would roll, sometimes my front end would lift straight up (really frustrating, because then you roll backwards and when the game resets you you're facing the wrong way). But there really wasn't any rhyme or reason to any of it; it often seemed quite random. So, that's my major gripe with the game. When you finally win a race, it doesn't feel like you actually won the race. It feels like you just played enough times that the AI messed up enough to make up for their faster cars, the traffic gods blessed you with a run where no car swerved at just the wrong time and no bus blocked the path you needed, and no jump decided to just sporadically flip your car. Other Quirks First, the camera. When you enter tight spots the camera often goes ballistic, which is very distracting since you really need to focus during those times. Second, the opening race ritual. For some reason, a lot of races refused to save my preferred camera setting, therefore I had to zoom out every single restart. In addition, for some of the more complex runs I wanted my map out. So I had to hit ESC, down arrow to RESTART +enter, up arrow YES + enter, back to gamepad, hit button to skip opening sequence, hit M on keyboard to show map, hit gamepad button 3-4 times to get camera in right spot, GO! Every single restart, and there will be a lot of them with how cheap this game is... Third, track selection. I got annoyed with the voices so I turned those off. I picked a song in the songlist and wanted that song to loop. The problem is, when that song is over it moves to the next, and it doesn't revert to the song you initially chose when you restart the race. This means if you lose a race, most likely you have to go back into the audio options and reselect the song you want playing to get it going again. It's very annoying, because I found some songs to be distracting, and was even using my preferred song as a means of gauging my progress in a race by where I am at a certain point in the song. So, the Good? Sound Not gonna lie; the music is very good. My favorite track was "electrify" (trance) but there were plenty of good songs to play while driving. Characters Not gonna lie; the free-form selection of opponents was fun, and it was interesting to listen to their cheesy dialogues. Circuit After career mode was such a chore to play, I decided I wanted to 100% this and moved to circuit mode, which removes the traffic and gives you shorter, multilap courses to run. I had MUCH more fun in this mode, because much of the random cheapness in the form of traffic/police was removed, and the AI didn't seem as aggressive at trying to screw you over. It felt like an actual racing game where I had some control over if I won or last, as opposed to a crapshoot of random events. When I won I didn't think "wow, finally that one is over" but rather "hey, that was pretty fun." Don't get me wrong; this mode is much easier, but it felt like the challenge was more appropriate. Final Thoughts I'm sorry but I just don't think this game deserves the high metascore, guys. Maybe a 50 or 60%. But this game is too old and flawed to be worth your time IMO. Nonnative gamepad support that still doesn't do analog gas/brake make it needlessly difficult to control your car, and incredibly cheap and frustrating racing makes the game tedious to play. You can do better than this, guys. I hope that there's a game in the same mold as this one that does without the flaws. There's some good concepts in here, but the execution was sorely lacking for me. Last edited by Sly_Squash: 09-18-2011 at 02:55 AM. |
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04-13-2012, 01:07 AM
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#2 |
 Join Date: Aug 2011
Reputation: 16
Posts: 154
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Hard as hell but I loved it, I really loved the music in this game too. You are too negative on this review, towards the end it's really hard but for the most part it's a damn challenging and fun game.
I didn't understand what was your problem with the game restarts and the camera. I don't remember having issues with that. "esc, restart, go." Oh and don't bother with gamepad!! This game has too sharp cornering to be played with a gamepad, keyboard is the way to go! Try the Midnight Club 2 MODern edition. It's a cool mod for the game. (Btw I tried the Grid demo but I found it much more annoying and unforgiving. Well they are completely different games.) Last edited by SzF: 04-13-2012 at 01:14 AM. |
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04-15-2012, 09:37 AM
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#3 | ||||||||
 Join Date: Oct 2008
Reputation: 7
Posts: 25
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From your opening statement "I've had enough of this game and don't care to mess with MP.", I can guess that you did not have a good time playing Midnight Club 2.
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Dirt 2 - 2009 Fuel - 2009 Race driver grid - 2008 Need for speed undercover - 2008 Dirt 1 - 2007 Midnight club 2 - 2003 MC2 is almost 9 years old. Unless you have fond memories of this game, or REALLY into racing games, then why would you go so far backwards for a game? Quote:
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However, you are quite right. On the PS2, the right analog stick allowed for smooth control over the accelerator and brake, but if there's no support for the shoulder buttons, then that's a problem - probably worked on an original xbox controller though. Quote:
So why would anything online and in game NOT refer to a ps2 gamepad? Quote:
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You said at the start that you only really started playing racing games when you bought newer games like GRID. At one point, you COMPARED a newer game to this game, and came to the conclusion that it doesn't deserve its high metascore - presumably because it doesn't meet the standards of those other games. But then you go on to say that it's TOO OLD - so why did you compare it to those newer games to start with? Flawed? No. It's hard and unforgiving. Like most old games. Quote:
Made when PS2 was the top console. Analog control is present if you actually used a correct controller. Cheap and frustrating? Because everyone drove faster cars, targeted you exclusivly and made cheap shots? Welcome to the racing genre. Midnight club 2 wasn't the first game to do this, nor is it the last. I bought Ridge Racer unbounded a few weeks ago, and found that all cars have a limited top speed of around 133mph, and everyone is faster than you, even at max speed. Honestly, and no offence to you - obviously you're entitled to your own opinion, but I would say this review is near worthless because you're expecting too much from an old game, and you've been going backwards on game releases. If you never bothered to pick up this game from 2003-2005, you're not a big fan of the Midnight Club series, and you're not a huge racing fan, then this game (and any game as old as this), then this game is not suitable. It's not worth £5.99 though. |
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05-01-2012, 03:29 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Reputation: 208
Posts: 788
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Last edited by Sly_Squash: 05-01-2012 at 03:50 AM. |
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05-28-2012, 07:40 PM
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#5 |
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Reputation: 0
Posts: 32
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At the end of the day you either like the game or not, and obviously it will be based on previous experience and expectation from other games.
A lot of the flaws you mention I do not notice, maybe because I am used to playing older racing games. I have to say IMO the AI is pretty well balanced in terms of aggression. Although their racing lines are definitely a lot more restricted than in GRID. Midnight Club II was always meant to be more of an arcade game though, rather than a semi-simulation like a lot of the racing games you played recently. Hence some of the aspects of the racing being quite over-the-top. Some of the jumps can be quite frustrating if you get them wrong though, as it pretty much means a restart. I would suggest that NFS: Underground might want to be a game you want to look at. The first of the new generation of NFS games after NFS 4: High Stakes, and was very good. Nice graphics and the driving feels quite realistic. Which seems to be more what you are looking for. |
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06-01-2012, 05:30 PM
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#6 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Reputation: 7
Posts: 31
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I got this game as part of the "free if you join the Rockstar group" thing, and I pretty much agree with this review.
I didn't have problems with controls (I just used keyboard) and the interface was okay after I got used to it. I also didn't have the camera quirks. However, I COMPLETELY agree about the AI. This is a very difficult game, but for all the wrong reasons. I have encountered multiple instances where AI cars turned around and slammed head on - and no, I don't mean when there are multiple routes/a 180 in the track. They really did just decide they wanted to crash into me that much. On one occurrence, I was on the first Kenichi race, and after many, many, MANY restarts I finally just had the last end bit before the finish. Three AI cars made a box around me, making me unable to steer, and coordinated themselves to steer straight into a wall, taking me with them. The traffic - I have had them swerve into me from the opposite lane (unprovoked) a few times. One thing that bothers me with pretty much all racing games featuring traffic, is THAT car. Right in the middle of the intersection you need to cross, blocking you is THAT car. Blocking the only lane you have to pass is THAT car. Jumping out right as you cross an intersection is THAT car. At multiple points, it was THAT bus - and it wasn't scripted like that truck in the early highway race. One of the worst happenings was when it was blocking the ONLY way to a checkpoint. No alternate routes. Another time, I had to go on an oncoming ramp to get on a highway. As I went through, there was a torrent of traffic cars blocking every possible space I could use to get on the ramp. Of course, I crashed, and watched on the side as the road opened up to absolutely ZERO cars so the AI racers could go through with no problem. The physics, while they do have their own arcadey driving style which is pretty fun, there are a lot of annoying issues. With one particular car, the Saikou, sometimes I would just spontaneously flip over for no discernible reason. A different car wasn't an option because this car was the absolute best available car at the time. Another time, an AI racer slammed into the back of my car at full speed with nitrous and I went flying and flipping up into the air. Another time, I failed to pass another car with the slipstream turbo and slammed into the back of him. I ended up pushing him around a bit until I smashed him into two traffic cars. He immediately sped away unscathed while I got slowed to a crawl (remember, I never actually hit the cars) and then spun out. Also of note that whenever an AI hits your rear, you spin out and crash, but if you do the same to an AI, they just get boosted by you. The jumps were not really a problem for me, however Rockstar should have thought of adding different checkpoint sizes. On the first real race of the Tokyo champion, after a massive amount of restarts I finally got to the end and finished with a satisfying jump. Except I didn't finish, because I didn't hit the jump at the precise center and flew right past the finish point. They could have also put the finish right at the end of the ramp. I ended up quitting at this point. One more thing - I have played many racing games from the same era as this game, and some before it, too. Racing is one of my favorite genres, but this game just didn't work with me. Playing this game really makes me want to play MC3 (a great game) again, but all my original Xbox controllers are messed up in some way. If you still have a proper functioning last-gen console, I would recommend you get that (specifically the Remix version). Last edited by BearzUnlimited: 06-02-2012 at 08:50 AM. |
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06-01-2012, 05:51 PM
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#7 |
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Banned
Join Date: Mar 2012
Reputation: 204
Posts: 512
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I got MC2 free also, and I don't think I'll be installing it anytime soon, simply due to the fact that there are a ton of newer and better racing games out there already. OP's review just solidifies my initial feelings about MC2.
Now, off to play Driver: San Francisco. |
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06-02-2012, 02:31 PM
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#8 |
 Join Date: Apr 2006
Reputation: 670
Posts: 4,068
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I loved the game because of the handling, the cars just feel so precise (the bikes even more so). But yeah, basically you have to race every race once to figure out the best route, the shortcuts, etc. And then you just have to mash restart until you get lucky where the AI doesn't A: directly crash you into something, or B: crash into something that then causes you to crash.
I seriously got to like the last four races legitimately with trial and error, but there's this one race in paris that's just garbage. As the OP said, the AI doesnt' see traffic when they're not near you. So you have to literally run around the entirety of paris and go to each four corners (it's a scramble race) with all these jumps and if you mess up even once, you lose. The Ai just gets to take an easy direct path to all of them. |
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06-06-2012, 08:59 AM
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#9 |
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Reputation: 0
Posts: 37
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Oddly enough, I haven't really run into the whole "AI being too aggressive" thing, not even after playing it recently on PC after a long time from playing the PS2 version. I do admit that these races require a lot of trial and error and sometimes the controls get way too sensitive, especially on keyboard where I felt like I had to constantly fiddle with the left and right arrow keys just to keep my car straight.
BTW, there's an option for Analog Gas and Brake in the controls section. Maybe you can map the triggers to those functions instead of the regular ones. All in all, despite its flaws, it's still one of my favorite racing games of the time (against such games as NFS Hot Pursuit 2, Underground and Gran Turismo 4) and even today. Alas, to each his own. |
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07-04-2012, 03:01 PM
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#10 |
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Reputation: 0
Posts: 9
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This game is extremely hard. Traffic makes it that way and very often stupid car behavior. I haven't finnished Savo challenge, where all six cars go in different way. Don't know how to solve it, it's almost impossible...
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07-15-2012, 06:27 PM
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#11 |
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Banned
Join Date: Jul 2011
Reputation: 7
Posts: 138
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TL;DR-casuals.
Only legit complain in this thread is the crappy KB steering. The traffic isn't scripted, it's just like IRL. You expect motorists to be able to move/react fast enough to get out of the way of a group of street racers going 100 some odd MPH? Plus, lol @ the tards thinking the traffic swerves into the lanes on purpose. They're trying to skid out of the way of your car. Too old and too flawed my keister, you're just a casual conformist. Last edited by RoyalMonaco76: 07-15-2012 at 07:09 PM. |
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07-17-2012, 12:54 AM
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#12 |
 Join Date: Jan 2010
Reputation: 190
Posts: 1,014
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Hey anyone who wants advice or are scared off by these noobs,
I use mouse steering. Try it. A lot of games makes you think you are steering but really they just help you steer instead. You have to actually steer correctly in the game. You can't just steer too much and lose grip. The scripts are to make it like movies and just to make you think. The AI have personalities but it won't matter if you jump off the line. They give you burnout, slipstream turbo, and nitrous. You shouldn't be near any AI unless you are learning the course. I used Emu for most of LA and Viper for all of Paris and never had issues with fighting the AI. If they are coming at you head on just go around them. Learn to brake. Learn the maps. It's fun. Look at some videos. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jRhut8Z1fo Last edited by playaR: 07-17-2012 at 12:59 AM. |
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07-18-2012, 12:08 AM
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#13 |
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Banned
Join Date: Jul 2011
Reputation: 7
Posts: 138
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Plus, for people BAAAAWing about traffic, lol. They'd throw their comps out the window with the traffic mod I made. Makes all vehicles for each city spawn in their respective city's traffic. Vehicles never normally seen outside of small scripted scenarios in races can now be seen driving around in traffic, eg. LA tractor-trailer,, ambulance, limo etc.
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08-02-2012, 12:29 AM
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#14 |
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Reputation: 1046
Posts: 2,685
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I don't agree with any of the criticisms in this thread. I find the game feels lovingly crafted to be just the right difficulty and challenge to keep you playing and retrying races you failed. Xbox controller for me worked out of the box, though I had to change some of the buttons in the config.
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