A way to "cheat"

HeatSurge · 02-12-2011, 04:27 AM

So, it looks like pursuant to my comment in this thread I did some investigation.

I actually wanted to do a small "review" of the game on my blog, so I fired up fraps... and what a surprise.

I forced the framerate to 30... and then proceeded to produce LOL as the game actually started.

The ship/enemy/animation speed was reduced in half (or perhaps more, couldn't tell but it was VERY slow compared to normal), but the "cannon" speed was not!

That's right, I was able to shoot at normal "rate," in a slowed-down game environment.

The result was that the game became extremely, ridiculously easy compared to normal. I easily scored 270K just for kicks, with one life (including achievements), whereas I normally have EXTREME difficulty in scoring 100K using all three lives.

I suggest you guys (devs) get your fraps on (free/demo version will have this "bug" as well I'm sure) and take a look at the timers you're using in your render loop and "fire rate" calculation...

I suggest when this is "fixed" that you reset the leaderboards and achievements too :-( ...

Saijin_Naib · 02-12-2011, 09:55 AM

Yeah, this is known unfortunately. The current tic-rate implementation is improved over the previous timer, but as you've noted, needs some work yet.

I didn't want to call bull♥♥♥♥ on the kid, but it was fairly obvious he is full of it. That being said, I'm trying to be a nicer admin than I normally am so I didn't call him out in public, but, the cat is out of the bag so whatever.

We're certainly going to take this into account and try to improve the tic-rate and timing events to make certain this kind of exploitation can not happen anymore.

For fun (before a leaderboard reset), I tried this out on my P3 1.1ghz Celeron box with a MX420 PCI, I made 1M+ :P

Joshhy has worked on the timer, but I guess we've still not got it ironed out. Have you any recommendations for us?

HeatSurge · 02-12-2011, 01:03 PM

I'm not a professional programmer (just a lame hobbyist with almost a CS minor and some basic java programming behind my back), but look into making it render frames on a timer and not slow down when there's not enough CPU, but rather skip frames (like all other games would).

From what I've read about game programming, the ship/enemy movements should be based on last position and a vector (for "acceleration/speed"?) and their positions should be calculated based on that, right?!

If you've coded them to be based on some multiplier and based on the last frame position, you should rethink that to a vector-based calculation and based on a timer, not frames...

IDK, I'm in way over my head by saying all these things above, so I hope they make some sense.

Basically, if the ship was at x,y=6,7, the new position should be x+speed*time,y+speed*time... time being the time since the last frame was displayed.

That's my understanding anyway... (please correct me if I'm full of sh** which I probably am XD )

Saijin_Naib · 02-12-2011, 01:43 PM

Its all on vector currently, at least from what I understand. I just think our timer is too forgiving.

©λεєrio · 04-07-2011, 05:47 PM

I enjoyed this slow-mode, perhaps it would be nice setting for a easy/beginner difficulty?

TerranBrackiatt · 05-01-2011, 10:07 AM

hmmm... "slow-mode" Training Arena? that would be a curious idea... would obviously not be counted toward leaderboards or achievements...

08-04-2011, 08:38 PM

Would it be possible to give users a choice on different game speeds/framerate?
For the sake of simplicity, there could be two speeds for each mode. Example - Chaotic 30/60 or Chaotic Easy/Hard
In addition to that, adjust the score/different multipliers/enemies give more points/etc. so there's more incentive to play on the higher speed.
Some old Japanese shoot 'em ups would have a setting in the options for that. I would choose whichever made the game run slowest.

02-12-2011, 04:27 AM	#1
HeatSurge Join Date: Oct 2007 Reputation: 89 Posts: 1,293	A way to "cheat" So, it looks like pursuant to my comment in this thread I did some investigation. I actually wanted to do a small "review" of the game on my blog, so I fired up fraps... and what a surprise. I forced the framerate to 30... and then proceeded to produce LOL as the game actually started. The ship/enemy/animation speed was reduced in half (or perhaps more, couldn't tell but it was VERY slow compared to normal), but the "cannon" speed was not! That's right, I was able to shoot at normal "rate," in a slowed-down game environment. The result was that the game became extremely, ridiculously easy compared to normal. I easily scored 270K just for kicks, with one life (including achievements), whereas I normally have EXTREME difficulty in scoring 100K using all three lives. I suggest you guys (devs) get your fraps on (free/demo version will have this "bug" as well I'm sure) and take a look at the timers you're using in your render loop and "fire rate" calculation... I suggest when this is "fixed" that you reset the leaderboards and achievements too :-( ...

02-12-2011, 09:55 AM	#2
Saijin_Naib Foreign Legion: BoB forum Volunteer Moderator Join Date: Feb 2008 Reputation: 663 Posts: 3,433	Yeah, this is known unfortunately. The current tic-rate implementation is improved over the previous timer, but as you've noted, needs some work yet. I didn't want to call bull♥♥♥♥ on the kid, but it was fairly obvious he is full of it. That being said, I'm trying to be a nicer admin than I normally am so I didn't call him out in public, but, the cat is out of the bag so whatever. We're certainly going to take this into account and try to improve the tic-rate and timing events to make certain this kind of exploitation can not happen anymore. For fun (before a leaderboard reset), I tried this out on my P3 1.1ghz Celeron box with a MX420 PCI, I made 1M+ :P Joshhy has worked on the timer, but I guess we've still not got it ironed out. Have you any recommendations for us? Last edited by Saijin_Naib: 02-12-2011 at 10:02 AM.

02-12-2011, 01:03 PM	#3
HeatSurge Join Date: Oct 2007 Reputation: 89 Posts: 1,293	I'm not a professional programmer (just a lame hobbyist with almost a CS minor and some basic java programming behind my back), but look into making it render frames on a timer and not slow down when there's not enough CPU, but rather skip frames (like all other games would). From what I've read about game programming, the ship/enemy movements should be based on last position and a vector (for "acceleration/speed"?) and their positions should be calculated based on that, right?! If you've coded them to be based on some multiplier and based on the last frame position, you should rethink that to a vector-based calculation and based on a timer, not frames... IDK, I'm in way over my head by saying all these things above, so I hope they make some sense. Basically, if the ship was at x,y=6,7, the new position should be x+speedtime,y+speedtime... time being the time since the last frame was displayed. That's my understanding anyway... (please correct me if I'm full of sh** which I probably am XD ) Last edited by HeatSurge: 02-12-2011 at 01:06 PM.

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02-12-2011, 01:43 PM	#4
Saijin_Naib Foreign Legion: BoB forum Volunteer Moderator Join Date: Feb 2008 Reputation: 663 Posts: 3,433	Its all on vector currently, at least from what I understand. I just think our timer is too forgiving.

04-07-2011, 05:47 PM	#5
©λεєrio Join Date: Jul 2010 Reputation: 80 Posts: 506	I enjoyed this slow-mode, perhaps it would be nice setting for a easy/beginner difficulty?

05-01-2011, 10:07 AM	#6
TerranBrackiatt Join Date: Feb 2010 Reputation: 5 Posts: 57	hmmm... "slow-mode" Training Arena? that would be a curious idea... would obviously not be counted toward leaderboards or achievements...

08-04-2011, 08:38 PM	#7
excess. Guest Posts: n/a	Would it be possible to give users a choice on different game speeds/framerate? For the sake of simplicity, there could be two speeds for each mode. Example - Chaotic 30/60 or Chaotic Easy/Hard In addition to that, adjust the score/different multipliers/enemies give more points/etc. so there's more incentive to play on the higher speed. Some old Japanese shoot 'em ups would have a setting in the options for that. I would choose whichever made the game run slowest.