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Old 04-26-2012, 11:08 AM   #1
Blk_Mage_Ctype
 
 
 
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Lightbulb Balancing the Detonator.

Let's face it, the Detonator as it stands is practically a straight downgrade to the Flare Gun. The jump and explosion radius are just too small and too situational to justify the loss of a full crit.

I have some suggestions on how to balance the Detonator into a viable sidegrade. (Choose one of the following.)

1.) Mini-crits on detonation.
As previously stated, the burst radius is too small, so why not at least add a greater benefit to it and reward players for their good sense of timing? Whoever gets caught in the detonation takes mini-crit damage. (Same as a direct hit.)

2.) Increase the burst radius of detonation.
Simply increase the burst radius of the detonation.

3.) Full detonation on contact with enemies/surfaces.
When a flare hits an enemy or surface, the burst radius of the detonation is equal to that of a manually detonated flare.

4.) Increase Afterburn damage/duration.
Simply increase the damage and duration of the Afterburn inflicted by the Detonator. (Say to 4 or 5HP per tick for 15 seconds?)

5.) Increase Detonator jump height.
Yeah, we know you don't want to do this one for some reason, Valve, but the people want it and it's not like you're going to break the game by giving an underpowered class like the Pyro more maneuverability. (Increase the height of the Detonator jump to that of the Atomizer's Triple-Jump.)

This concludes my suggestions on how to balance the Detonator. I encourage all reader's to vote on which option (1-5) is best by posting below, or alternatively making suggestions of their own.
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:01 PM   #2
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I think the detonator is fine. It fills a different niche than the flare gun. It allows you to get places you otherwise wouldn't be able, ignites multiple enemies from long range AND can destroy clumps of sticky bombs pretty quickly. The only real problem with it is timing the explosion since the blast radius is so small (and it's not lag compensated). Once you get used to it, though, it's great. The only change I would make would be to make the automatic detonations have the same radius as the manual ones.
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:06 PM   #3
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I just wanna see a knockback buff. The rest is unnecessary to me.
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:09 PM   #4
NeoSamus
 
 
 
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I don't really have a problem with the Detonation radius or anything about the Detonator offensively, it's fine in that regard. I'd still like to see either the self damage reduced slightly or the knockback increased slightly.

It's very viable right now, I just don't think it's on par with the Shotgun or Flare Gun. It just feels like the jump does too much damage for too little distance/height. Making that ratio a little better would be great.
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:26 PM   #5
Trotim
 
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6) Decreased self-damage

Because when you actually think about the jump height and length it's very good, especially considering Pyros have been wanting a tool to get in close range faster for years. Quite underrated... though I agree the self-damage is very high - you could probably even halve that.
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Old 04-26-2012, 03:44 PM   #6
Nismu
 
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some extra suggestions.
some knockback on direct hit.

extra damage to buildings.
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Old 04-26-2012, 04:49 PM   #7
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I think the Detonator is already balanced. If anything, implement something that makes it easier to tell where the flare actually is while it's in flight. This was one of the biggest suggestions while the weapon was still in beta and it seems to have fallen on deaf ears.
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Old 04-26-2012, 05:50 PM   #8
chzchan
 
 
 
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It just needs a larger explosion radius. And larger for both the "impact" as well as the mid-air detonations.

This would make Det Jumping way more reliable and make it easier to hit multiple targets with.

Currently the Detonator is pretty useful, but the two useful things about it are hampered by their unreliability. The increase in explosion radius would be more of a reliability fix than a buff.
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:10 PM   #9
hypercrite
 
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It is balanced, any better and it would be spammed by no-good players, any worse and it would be replaced by the flare gun.
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:29 PM   #10
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Pyro needs stock advanced mobility before we do anything serious with the Detonator.
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:22 PM   #11
SammyQ
 
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Honestly the full crit is pretty much overkill most of the time on anything but Heavies.

If the detonator gets a wider blast radius it should ONLY be for the radius when it collides into a wall or object.

The manual detonation is fine. Once you get it down, its VERY hard NOT to light at least 1 person on fire with it. It just requires good timing and aim.


HOWEVER the tiny explosion it does when it hits a wall and isnt detonated is pathetically small and other than jumping, I'm not sure why it exists.

Making THAT explosion bigger I would assume would also increase the jump height.

I think the height is fine as it is but I wouldnt say no to making it higher. The detonator is already pretty much a straight upgrade over the flare gun if you know when and where to use it properly. But if people still feel my favorite new toy is lackluster, then go ahead and make it better.

And also what KajiVena said.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:38 PM   #12
Boomere
 
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Detonator is fine and dandy. Stop creating threads like that.

I use it all the time and I don't feel like it needs buffs.

Increased explosion radius will make it overpower, because its a pain in the ALREADY.

Increased afterburn and damage, or minicrits on detonation will make it overpower, because detonator can spam, and all the damage buffs will turn it into a server-clearing device(every no-medic and no-friendly-pyro teams will whine their asses off about that)Also, don't forget, that your primary is low-range! Why should Detonator give us an ability to devastate everyone at the distance??

No detonation on surface contact is nothing more than a spam protection against noob pyros. And I feel it should stay the way it is right now. Detonator should be mastered, it shouldn't have any other ways to play around with.

About jump height - you can jump up the hole in the ctf_2fort! why you ask more!? It is okay already. Pyro wasn't even supposed to be jumping around! Pyro can gain some momentum to land on someone, or jump up the ramp to cut the time, and there is NO ramps in-game that too high to not being able to jump on to. except, ofcourse, if you're trying to jump around.

Self-damage is okay as it is. HP selfdamage is nothing more than a payment for being faster. If you use it, you should find a medkit. Decreasing the selfdamage will decrease the actual payment. No, pyro will not suffer from it, but all the other classes - do. I use jumps as a "bonus feature", but not as mobility increasing tool(I do not jump up the every ramp possible, I only jump when finding another way is painful, like sentries, or ubers, or when finding will take too much time).

Also, any buff will make other classes suffer(not like starting having normal challenge against pyro, but SUFFER), because detonator is awesome as it is! its balanced, why touch it?

Last edited by Boomere: 04-26-2012 at 10:10 PM.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:14 PM   #13
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only yes to 3 and 5
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