Support Ship Turret/Rbay balance suggetion

WarnarI · 04-26-2012, 01:44 PM

In the current game, the turrets (backed up with repair bay) from the support ship are now pretty hard to kill and get out of the way in the mid-late game. This is mostly do to the armor regen change that allows the turrets to not only get their hp back faster but even get a boost from the repair bay. I suggest rather than nerfing the repair bay or changing armor regen back to what it was that the turrets armor should be reduced as the skill lvl goes up. It balances out because at the beginning the turrets have lots of armor but low hp, while at the end they have lots of hp but low armor %. This is what I suggest exactly should happen to the armor value as the turret skill goes up: 50% base/45%skill1/40%skill2/35% at skill 3.

Stealth field generator
A side suggestion, to get support ship players to not just use the repair bay for their turrets as the only viable build with turrets. Change the stealth field generator to make it more useful without making it overpowered. The generator shold be on the side of the stealth field, NOT in the middle of it! I suggest that as it is selected to be placed down, 2 circles appear to the support ship player, one large circle and one small one. The small one is the generator while the larger one is the stealth field. The stealth field will be pointing away from the ship while the generator circle is in the area around the ship until the player puts it down. This gives the generator a much better position to be at as well as still being visible so that the enemy players can attack it. By doing this change, it encourages players to use the repair bay and gives a variaty to the builds the support ship can use.

KDR_11k · 04-27-2012, 07:29 AM

I've seen a well used stealth generator build, hiding the main structure behind asteroids and stuff and using the cloak as a combat advantage instead of trying to stay completely invisible. Stick protonic guns on the support and that may make for a mean combo.

zeropositivo · 04-27-2012, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KDR_11k

I've seen a well used stealth generator build, hiding the main structure behind asteroids and stuff and using the cloak as a combat advantage instead of trying to stay completely invisible. Stick protonic guns on the support and that may make for a mean combo.

The problem is that when it works it's not because of the strenght of it, but from everything else the support has. I has to be hidden behind turrets to work, as alone will die fast. Also, the main point of stealth is that it confuses the enemy about your position. If someone spots my stealth field gen, they know something is there. Turrets cannot move and the field is pretty small, so you can still be shelled even while invisible

KDR_11k · 04-27-2012, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeropositivo

If someone spots my stealth field gen, they assume something is there.

Also at lv3 the field is pretty large. Yeah, that's a big point investment so maybe a bigger radius could be a good buff.

zeropositivo · 04-27-2012, 08:38 AM

Yea, agree. Tho I think the priority here is to fix how armor and support stuff scales so well in comparison to everything else...

I already gave my opinion: either no regen for turrets, or regen limited to the ACTUAL armor, not the max armor (so, being damaged actually means less regeneration. This last one would actually apply to armor to all ships, as I really think right now it's just too much...)

Nryrony · 04-27-2012, 12:47 PM

I think I would just completly remove armor regen, thats what shilds are for...

Just give ship's a very basic regen (green only?), so that in time a critical hull hit/debuff will fix itself _in time_ (the 2 S/S from the officer should be sufficent).

Concerning towers, the repair tower and the support ship. Well the support ship on it's own is simply too good, as we all know its basicly a better cruser, since it's superrior stats.

Towers or thier regen needs to be rebalanced, at least in 2 on 2. A regen nerf in addiotion to them not beeing effected by the repair tower might do the trick or simply limit the amount to 2 dps towers in 2 on 2.

-QL^BLaNKMiND · 04-27-2012, 01:03 PM

Torpeado escorts/Reinforcements > Turrets
Arty (Large games) > Turrets
Destroyer > Turrets
fighting away from the turrets > Turrets
Focus fire from team (large games) > Turrets

I will investigate more in 2v2 ranked.

Nryrony · 04-27-2012, 11:55 PM

Yeah the turrets on its own are usually NOT the problem, its the fact that you have to face 2 enemys AND 3 turrets, not to mention they can farm. (And why? my escorts don't farm for me, even if I pick the ones from the skill....)

So basic rule, try to attack when there are not 3 turrets and/or when they are attacking, since they can not drop 3 at once.

Yet in 2on2 turrets push you, thats one of the main problems...

And Arti, seriously, only about 10 people play arti in 2on2 and only 5 of them can handle it. Also note, at the beginning of a game, an arti has the lowest (non skill) dps. Not to mention that if you have a brain, you can simply go in there and kill it...

KDR_11k · 04-28-2012, 02:28 AM

Arty plus support is a good team, the arty gives people a reason to charge headlong into the turrets.

The repair bay should be able to repair ships to 100%, it should be an option as a somewhat slower repair than going back to the base. If it could only perform hull repairs you'd still have to leg it back to the base to get a real repair for whatever dents are in your armor. Also it'd screw cruisers over since they've got so much armor it even covers their critical damage sections. I haven't seen the bay used to repair-tank damage (it's no big feat to overwhelm the regeneration, especially with the spike damage attacks from skills), it's really just for frontline recovery outside of combat. If repair tanking is such an issue then disable repair for a set time after the ship takes damage (just like shields do).

hurleybird · 04-28-2012, 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KDR_11k

Arty plus support is a good team, the arty gives people a reason to charge headlong into the turrets.

It's actually more or less the worst team you can take 2v2.

KDR_11k · 04-28-2012, 06:04 AM

Funny enough, that was the first match I played of the game (I was the arty) and we won. But yeah, the limited mobility means you're vulnerable to enemy blitzing so it'd only work on maps where your fortified position is hard to circumvent (e.g. that Z map).

04-26-2012, 01:44 PM	#1
WarnarI Join Date: Apr 2012 Reputation: 3 Posts: 22	Support Ship Turret/Rbay balance suggetion In the current game, the turrets (backed up with repair bay) from the support ship are now pretty hard to kill and get out of the way in the mid-late game. This is mostly do to the armor regen change that allows the turrets to not only get their hp back faster but even get a boost from the repair bay. I suggest rather than nerfing the repair bay or changing armor regen back to what it was that the turrets armor should be reduced as the skill lvl goes up. It balances out because at the beginning the turrets have lots of armor but low hp, while at the end they have lots of hp but low armor %. This is what I suggest exactly should happen to the armor value as the turret skill goes up: *50% base/45%skill1/40%skill2/35% at skill 3.* Stealth field generator A side suggestion, to get support ship players to not just use the repair bay for their turrets as the only viable build with turrets. Change the stealth field generator to make it more useful without making it overpowered. The generator shold be on the side of the stealth field, NOT in the middle of it! I suggest that as it is selected to be placed down, 2 circles appear to the support ship player, one large circle and one small one. The small one is the generator while the larger one is the stealth field. The stealth field will be pointing away from the ship while the generator circle is in the area around the ship until the player puts it down. This gives the generator a much better position to be at as well as still being visible so that the enemy players can attack it. By doing this change, it encourages players to use the repair bay and gives a variaty to the builds the support ship can use.

04-27-2012, 01:03 PM	#7
-QL^BLaNKMiND Join Date: Apr 2012 Reputation: 0 Posts: 37	Torpeado escorts/Reinforcements > Turrets Arty (Large games) > Turrets Destroyer > Turrets fighting away from the turrets > Turrets Focus fire from team (large games) > Turrets I will investigate more in 2v2 ranked. Last edited by -QL^BLaNKMiND: 04-28-2012 at 12:12 AM. Reason: edited arty part for Nryrony

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

04-27-2012, 07:29 AM	#2
KDR_11k Join Date: Feb 2009 Reputation: 57 Posts: 1,514	I've seen a well used stealth generator build, hiding the main structure behind asteroids and stuff and using the cloak as a combat advantage instead of trying to stay completely invisible. Stick protonic guns on the support and that may make for a mean combo.

04-27-2012, 08:38 AM	#5
zeropositivo Join Date: Oct 2011 Reputation: 0 Posts: 110	Yea, agree. Tho I think the priority here is to fix how armor and support stuff scales so well in comparison to everything else... I already gave my opinion: either no regen for turrets, or regen limited to the ACTUAL armor, not the max armor (so, being damaged actually means less regeneration. This last one would actually apply to armor to all ships, as I really think right now it's just too much...)

04-27-2012, 12:47 PM	#6
Nryrony Join Date: Oct 2010 Reputation: 0 Posts: 82	I think I would just completly remove armor regen, thats what shilds are for... Just give ship's a very basic regen (green only?), so that in time a critical hull hit/debuff will fix itself _in time_ (the 2 S/S from the officer should be sufficent). Concerning towers, the repair tower and the support ship. Well the support ship on it's own is simply too good, as we all know its basicly a better cruser, since it's superrior stats. Towers or thier regen needs to be rebalanced, at least in 2 on 2. A regen nerf in addiotion to them not beeing effected by the repair tower might do the trick or simply limit the amount to 2 dps towers in 2 on 2.

04-27-2012, 11:55 PM	#8
Nryrony Join Date: Oct 2010 Reputation: 0 Posts: 82	Yeah the turrets on its own are usually NOT the problem, its the fact that you have to face 2 enemys AND 3 turrets, not to mention they can farm. (And why? my escorts don't farm for me, even if I pick the ones from the skill....) So basic rule, try to attack when there are not 3 turrets and/or when they are attacking, since they can not drop 3 at once. Yet in 2on2 turrets push you, thats one of the main problems... And Arti, seriously, only about 10 people play arti in 2on2 and only 5 of them can handle it. Also note, at the beginning of a game, an arti has the lowest (non skill) dps. Not to mention that if you have a brain, you can simply go in there and kill it...

04-28-2012, 02:28 AM	#9
KDR_11k Join Date: Feb 2009 Reputation: 57 Posts: 1,514	Arty plus support is a good team, the arty gives people a reason to charge headlong into the turrets. The repair bay should be able to repair ships to 100%, it should be an option as a somewhat slower repair than going back to the base. If it could only perform hull repairs you'd still have to leg it back to the base to get a real repair for whatever dents are in your armor. Also it'd screw cruisers over since they've got so much armor it even covers their critical damage sections. I haven't seen the bay used to repair-tank damage (it's no big feat to overwhelm the regeneration, especially with the spike damage attacks from skills), it's really just for frontline recovery outside of combat. If repair tanking is such an issue then disable repair for a set time after the ship takes damage (just like shields do).

04-28-2012, 06:04 AM	#11
KDR_11k Join Date: Feb 2009 Reputation: 57 Posts: 1,514	Funny enough, that was the first match I played of the game (I was the arty) and we won. But yeah, the limited mobility means you're vulnerable to enemy blitzing so it'd only work on maps where your fortified position is hard to circumvent (e.g. that Z map).