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Old 04-26-2012, 02:05 PM   #1
dark12222000
 
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Exclamation Common Commander Mistakes

Hey all,

After logging 20 some hours, and suffering what seems to be an infinite amount of bad commanders, I'd like to post some general guidelines on common mistakes that commanders make, and how to resolve them.

1. "Drop everything and go to prime"

If you've said this as a commander, especially at the start of the game, then you've already lost.

Let's do some quick math: Prime is worth 250 resource points per tick. Each Secondary point is worth 130 resource points per tick. If you have both secondaries, you're getting 260 resource points per tick. Already, that's more then prime. Each tertiary is worth 50. Capture a few of those, plus the ones near your base, and you're bringing in a lot of resources.

Prime is a slaughter house. It's expensive to hold. Your goal towards prime should be concerned with capturing it (250 points is certainly something) but mostly defending from encroaching commanders.

2. "Why aren't you defending my structures?"

If you've said this, then you didn't do the tutorial.

Ground troops are mostly concerned with the people in front of them - you know, the ones shooting them, setting them on fire, and chucking grenades at them? They really aren't concerned with the big blinky thing behind them. In fact, it's really hard for troops to know whats going on, and what needs to be defended, unless you (key point here) Tell Them

Yes, I know, this is a strange and foreign concept, and probably a very scary thought, but as a commander, you need to issue Orders to your squads. If you have structures under fire, you need to direct a squad to defend it.

Alternatively, build turrets. That's what they are there for.

3. Not using squads

Nuclear Dawn provides a really handy feature called Squads. Squads exist to organize your troops. Now, people don't usually form into squads, so you'll need to guide them. Usually a quick voice chat will suffice:
"Stealths, join delta. Seige units, I need you in alpha squad." so, so forth.

However, squads are only effective if you actually give them orders. Sometimes, the default order tools will suffice - give attack, defend, and capture orders, and let your men (and women) work out how to do it.

Sometimes what you need doesn't work well with the default order system. When this is the case, you'll need to speak up, and give a polite verbal order:
"Stealths, join Delta, and please capture enemy tertiary points. Focus on annoying and harassing them, not holding the points."

4. Not using radar

Radar is a big boon to both your troops and your turrets. It gives your snipers a lot of useful information (thereby making them much more effective) and makes your turrets more useful in cutting down stealths - which thereby allow your exos to do their jobs unpestered. Radar is a bit pricy, but it's worth it.

5. Waiting for Advanced Kits

A good commander will get teleports out to the front lines immediately. A better commander will send a bunch of seige exos to blow up his enemies relay line and cut off his resources.

Advanced kits give your units a lot of power, flexibility, and gives them a chance to cause havoc against the enemy commander.

They are also one of the cheapest researches in the game, and are available almost immediately. Just buy it.

6. Failure to use sidelines

Rarely does a commander have the resources, especially at the start, to secure their base from all directions. Sending two siege units, or a few stealth saboteurs, to exploit this weakness and cause mischief, can seriously cut down your enemy commanders ability to do much, and will infuriate him endlessly.

7. Getting Angry

A good commander is a calm commander. An angry commander is a dead one.

Remain calm, focused, and remember to encourage your troops both verbally and with supply stations and other helpful bits. It might not advance the campaign, but it will produce more willing troops.

__

I hope you found this guide useful. Remember to always play for the long game, not just the next 20 seconds. Stay calm, collected, and focused. Always have a backup plan. Always encourage your troops, even if they don't perform so well. Always communicate clearly and often. A bad commander will destroy a team quicker then any amount of bad troops.
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Old 04-26-2012, 03:55 PM   #2
Lokarin
 
 
 
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I found this works for organizing squads, only really works on 32 player servers:

Alpha: Attack - Kill players
Bravo: Building - Kill buildings
Charlie: Capture - Capture points
Delta: Defense - Defend material

I know at least 3 random players have caught on to this when they see me change squad when I change class.


Secondly. Teleports are OP. Even if you never use them AS teleports, they are the cheapest/strongest random barricade. Moreover, only so many players can spawn from a teleport at a time, people need to double them up on high population servers.
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Old 04-26-2012, 04:52 PM   #3
IshmarRelien
 
 
 
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1) Prime can only be captured by 3 people simultaneously, secondary can be captured by only by one simply stealth.

2) Agree for the talkative commander >> all, but there is the "structure under attack" message with also the red circle, you just don't know how many powerplants i have seen destructed by a ninja dewelding engineer... And of course none goes Eng repairing (remember thaat if the com repair structure it costs res)

3) ---

4) Due to research and costs, i think they are useful only on late game to close enemy base with a couple of turrets

5) Agree even if remember that going for Kits is 2500 +30s advanced field research, 2000 + Armory building time (and energy avaible), 2500 +30s Kits research. Better a front spawn with smart people remembering of EMP on Eng to block enemy farward spawn.

6) Farward power plants, that's all

7) Totally Agree
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:27 PM   #4
Razor273
 
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IshmarRelien View Post
1) Prime can only be captured by 3 people simultaneously, secondary can be captured by only by one simply stealth.

2) Agree for the talkative commander >> all, but there is the "structure under attack" message with also the red circle, you just don't know how many powerplants i have seen destructed by a ninja dewelding engineer... And of course none goes Eng repairing (remember thaat if the com repair structure it costs res)

3) ---

4) Due to research and costs, i think they are useful only on late game to close enemy base with a couple of turrets

5) Agree even if remember that going for Kits is 2500 +30s advanced field research, 2000 + Armory building time (and energy avaible), 2500 +30s Kits research. Better a front spawn with smart people remembering of EMP on Eng to block enemy farward spawn.

6) Farward power plants, that's all

7) Totally Agree
Prime can be captured only if 2 people are on it - not 3.
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Old 04-26-2012, 07:09 PM   #5
OrsonM
 
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Bad commanders usually don't know the map very well to begin with. They don't recognize areas that are too exposed or that have heavy traffic or fail to build spawns and supplies in a timely manner (by just building way too many turrets or waste the money on that useless health upgrade).

I don't blame a commander for not using command groups, usually the best way to give out any order is just to set up spawns and supplies in areas that are of strategic importance. You can give orders all you want, but in practice it'll depends on how much you help them get there.
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Old 04-26-2012, 07:44 PM   #6
snivilous
 
 
 
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Radar is next to useless and primarily helps the commander.

You should get a forward spawn first, then siege. Though you should be able to do both at the same time.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:32 PM   #7
Enigma314
 
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This is something I want to sink in, so I'm gonna repeat it a few times if you don't mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
Ground troops are mostly concerned with the people in front of them - you know, the ones shooting them, setting them on fire, and chucking grenades at them? They really aren't concerned with the big blinky thing behind them. In fact, it's really hard for troops to know whats going on, and what needs to be defended, unless you (key point here) Tell Them
Quote:
Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
In fact, it's really hard for troops to know whats going on, and what needs to be defended, unless you (key point here) Tell Them
Quote:
Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
Tell Them
Quote:
Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
Tell Them
I am always willing to help defend a building if I am in the position to do so. But I can't do anything if I don't know whats going on. so please tell me.
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:22 PM   #8
dark12222000
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OrsonM View Post
Bad commanders usually don't know the map very well to begin with.
Shouldn't be commanding on the map if you don't know it. Play it as a ground unit a few times and think about the layout. This isn't intuitive to new players - I'll admit that, but it's important.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrsonM View Post
I don't blame a commander for not using command groups, usually the best way to give out any order is just to set up spawns and supplies in areas that are of strategic importance.
I blame them all the time . Unfortunately, setting up spawns and supplies, while an important step, are not the only step. I go where I'm being shot at, and where I can kill others, not where I think the commander wants me to go. Clear orders are important.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IshmarRelien View Post
There is the "structure under attack" message with also the red circle
Sometimes, though not always, commanders will "sacrifice" structures. I'm not going to argue about whether this is valid or not, but red circles are not a clear indicator. In addition, your commander may not desire every player to defend every structure. It's just too chaotic and insane. Just give orders.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snivilous View Post
Radar is next to useless and primarily helps the commander.
If you seriously think that, then you don't understand how turrets work and what your units need. Your most important units are your exos, and they need protection from stealths. Radar and Turrets do that. Radar gives all of your units protection from stealths. It also feeds a lot of information to the stealths on your side, and your snipers, which allows them to act more effectively. Oh, and yes, it boosts the commander. Plus, a radar station is what, 4k? And you need maybe, what, 3, to cover an entire map?

Appreciate the feedback so far guys! Keep it coming!
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Old 04-27-2012, 02:48 AM   #9
IshmarRelien
 
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor273 View Post
Prime can be captured only if 2 people are on it - not 3.
My fault XD it was a bit late...


ps. An assault with thermal visor can protect exos from stealths, and it is free
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Old 04-27-2012, 03:33 AM   #10
Zoridium JackL
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
If you seriously think that, then you don't understand how turrets work and what your units need. Your most important units are your exos, and they need protection from stealths. Radar and Turrets do that. Radar gives all of your units protection from stealths. It also feeds a lot of information to the stealths on your side, and your snipers, which allows them to act more effectively. Oh, and yes, it boosts the commander. Plus, a radar station is what, 4k? And you need maybe, what, 3, to cover an entire map?

Appreciate the feedback so far guys! Keep it coming!
if you seriously think sniv doesn't understand those things than you don't know who sniv is, he is one of the best commanders in the entirety of the current community, so it would be wise to listen to his input, although I agree, for 4k each you could certainly do a lot worse.
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Old 04-27-2012, 12:30 PM   #11
snivilous
 
 
 
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Each person plays differently. From experience, radars are useless unless you have a very hardcore rusher. I never use radars because I don't leave my team in one position any longer than I need. If there are a lot of stealths, get some assaults then.
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Old 04-27-2012, 01:13 PM   #12
Lokarin
 
 
 
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I find radars work best as a final effort building. If you are about to win/lose you can use it to indirect target with artillery.

That's about it.
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Old 04-27-2012, 04:53 PM   #13
dark12222000
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IshmarRelien View Post
An assault with thermal visor can protect exos from stealths, and it is free
Assaults can be better directed elsewhere. You probably have a few turrets already, you might as well spend the stupid 4k and make them even more useful. Yes, you should leverage assaults too, but unless you're really short on resources, you might as well make the most out of what you have and leverage everything you have to it's fullest potential.

----

I'm really glad to see everyone engaged in this topic. Yes, we're going to disagree, about a bunch of stuff (like radar), but the fact that there are people who are serious about discussing commander strategies is a really important step.

When you're faced with a bad commander, and it's too late to demote them, how do you handle the situation? What strategies work and don't work?
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Old 04-27-2012, 05:35 PM   #14
snivilous
 
 
 
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Radar costs 3k, and a lot commanders try to avoid turrets to begin with.
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Old 04-27-2012, 05:40 PM   #15
snivilous
 
 
 
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Originally Posted by dark12222000 View Post
When you're faced with a bad commander, and it's too late to demote them, how do you handle the situation? What strategies work and don't work?
As an fps player? I just go capture all the resources on the map.

If I can get command, I'll either rush or turtle depending on the tactical situation. Unless it's Downtown or Oilfield in MOST cases (excluding metro as it's a stupid map) you can turn around and rush and win assuming the commander sucked, NOT the team.

Or can turtle, depending on the map and hold for awhile if anyone repairs anything.
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