Spycicle is an upgrade to stock

[KultanSwabi]

Based on silent kills alone. That bonus may not be too much, but the downside (melting knife) is negligible considering the brief fire immunity tacked onto it.

[4812622]

no man i play competitive srsbsns hl spy and i say it doesn't

[TheSentryIsaSpy]

Considering that Silent Kills won't help or hurt you anyhow, no, it's not an upgrade.


If the Team you're against has good comms, you won't or shouldn't be able to get a chain stab, regardless of what knife you use.


It just keeps you alive a little longer than the stock, but you lose a lot of picking power if the Pyro knows that all has to do is deny you kills with a single particle.

Originally Posted by 4812622

no man i play competitive srsbsns hl spy and i say it doesn't

Nah man Scorch Shot an Detonatr r garbage cuz I sayz so

[gomixy]

Yes, it is
Its well known by most.

[Munkyman720]

Yes, it is a straight upgrade.

The only time it is even arguably not an upgrade is if you're going for a backstab, and a Pyro flames you. But guess what! If the Pyro just airblasts you instead, he will deny you of your backstab regardless of your loadout.

So I guess the only time it's not an upgrade is if you are going for a backstab and you get flamed by a Phlog Pyro. But in every situation except for that single very specific one... yeah, it's an upgrade.

[Herr Shaun]

Originally Posted by Munkyman720

Yes, it is a straight upgrade.

Why don't people know what a straight upgrade is?

Stock doesn't leave bright shiny ragdolls and doesn't require you to keep your knife tucked away until the precise moment you want to go in for the stab.

Ergo: not a straight upgrade.

[Herr Shaun]

Originally Posted by Munkyman720

Ok fine, it's a 99% upgrade. Happy?

I wouldn't even say that. I don't find myself destroying more people with the Spycicle than stock. It's an effective sidegrade at best.

[Munkyman720]

Originally Posted by Herr Shaun

Stock doesn't leave bright shiny ragdolls

The bright shiny ragdolls don't tell anyone what team the victim was on, what team the Spy was on, where the Spy is, or how long ago the victim was stabbed. Anyone who sees it gains virtually no information (no helpful information), and if there is a Spy-cicle Spy on both teams, they gain no information. And since the Spy is obviously not using the YER, the enemy should already know there is an enemy Spy because of the killfeed.

Edit: The killfeed comment was referring to a non-Spy-cicle Spy. The non-SC Spy would be easily found out by the killfeed, while the SC Spy is noticed by the statues. Hence, the statues don't really "out" the Spy any more than his killfeed would have, had he not been using Spy-cicle. The exception is YER, since it has the same no-killfeed attribute as the SC, but that's a whole different conversation. I just realized that the way I worded it kinda seems like I'm saying the Spy-cicle has a killfeed, so I wanted to clarify.

and doesn't require you to keep your knife tucked away until the precise moment you want to go in for the stab.

Not really. If a Pyro sneaks up on you before you notice him and flames you before you can press Q, chances are he's going to be able to kill you regardless of your loadout. Unless of course he's braindead, in which case you will likely kill him regardless of loadout. If anything, the Spy-cicle could possibly help you survive in that situation when you wouldn't have normally.

Originally Posted by Herr Shaun

I wouldn't even say that. I don't find myself destroying more people with the Spycicle than stock. It's an effective sidegrade at best.

I posted that "99%" post before you edited your post, I thought you were referring to something else. So disregard that part.

[Chicken Hide]

It's a decent sidegrade. It makes a very distinct sound when you kill someone (ice statue) and a very distinct sound when it melts, combine that with the screams of "fire" if you keep the flames on the spy you get a pretty big downside.

[chucklenuts]

The thing has actually lead to many a death for enemy spies in my experience. I tend to be alot more cautious when I find that heavy that was just up ahead is now a popsicle.

[StarCraft]

yes, it's a upgrade, already established that, just remove the silent kills, explanations and discussions about why it's a upgrade has already been confered, just search previous threads about the matter.

[Rottaran Owain]

Originally Posted by TheSentryIsaSpy

If the Team you're against has good comms, you won't or shouldn't be able to get a chain stab, regardless of what knife you use.

Wrong. So very wrong. The amount of time for someone to react to a sound is much smaller than another person reacting to an event, mentioning the event, and then the receiver of the message comprehending the message, and responding to it.

[Aeropyro]

Originally Posted by Chicken Hide

It's a decent sidegrade. It makes a very distinct sound when you kill someone (ice statue) and a very distinct sound when it melts, combine that with the screams of "fire" if you keep the flames on the spy you get a pretty big downside.

Downside: makes a distinct, but low and hard to notice sound when you kill the victim.

Upside: victim doesn't yell, something that normally would get their teammate to look behind and see you.

Downside: you lose your knife for 15 seconds if you use it, and you yell fire if you keep the flames.

Upside: you actually have a chance of escaping the enemy pyro and avoing death. And dieing is worse than waiting 15 seconds unless you are playing fast respawn.

I don't think this weapon is that overpowered to be much of a problem, but it seems to me as a straight upgrade. It doesn't break the class, but it makes the stock knife pointless.

[Herr Shaun]

Originally Posted by Munkyman720

The bright shiny ragdolls don't tell anyone what team the victim was on, what team the Spy was on, where the Spy is, or how long ago the victim was stabbed. Anyone who sees it gains virtually no information (no helpful information), and if there is a Spy-cicle Spy on both teams, they gain no information. And since the Spy is obviously not using the YER, the enemy should already know there is an enemy Spy because of the killfeed.

The shiny ragdolls let everyone know that there is a Spy in the vicinity. If you're not sure if it's one of yours, either hit Tab to check the scoreboard, or press V or Y to ask your team. Stock just leaves plain ol' dead bodies, which, unless you observed the killing first-hand, could have been anybody. Yes, the kills show up in the feed, but unless you saw it happen, there's no dead giveaway.

Originally Posted by Munkyman720

Not really. If a Pyro sneaks up on you before you notice him and flames you before you can press Q, chances are he's going to be able to kill you regardless of your loadout. Unless of course he's braindead, in which case you will likely kill him regardless of loadout.

Although the lack of an enemy Pyro in your face removes the risk of losing the knife, it also removes one of the knife's upsides. At that point, it's just a silent kill knife that leaves shiny, obvious ragdolls. I don't think that could be considered a straight upgrade.

Originally Posted by StarCraft

i think it's an upgrade, but ♥♥♥♥ explaining myself

oh hey cool bro

[Munkyman720]

Originally Posted by Herr Shaun

The shiny ragdolls let everyone know that there is a Spy in the vicinity. If you're not sure if it's one of yours, either hit Tab to check the scoreboard, or press V or Y to ask your team.

By the time you do that, the Spy is already leaving or out of the vicinity. Unless he's a moron, but again, that fact would screw him over regardless of loadout.

Stock just leaves plain ol' dead bodies, which, unless you observed the killing first-hand, could have been anybody.

At least ragdolls tell you what team the victim was on. Spy-cicle statues don't.

Yes, the kills show up in the feed, but unless you saw it happen, there's no dead giveaway.

The killfeed is the dead giveaway. It definitively tells you that there is an enemy Spy, which is why the SC/YER's lack of a killfeed is such a big upside.

Although the lack of an enemy Pyro in your face removes the risk of losing the knife, it also removes one of the knife's upsides. At that point, it's just a silent kill knife that leaves shiny, obvious ragdolls. I don't think that could be considered a straight upgrade.

Well I still don't consider the statues to be a downside for reasons already mentioned, so I would indeed consider that an upgrade.