Hello from FringeSpace & some answers

[JGZinv]

I happened to be in game when a Steam user of Tachyon popped
in and informed me the game was active over here. so I thought I'd drop in and mention some things.

First of I'm the Co-leader of the FringeSpace project, which is a total conversion mod, taking Tachyon to the Freespace 2 SCP engine.
This is much more than a simple graphical update. We're also the hub for most of the pilots that still play Tach.

We have scheduled games Sunday and Saturday, 8 to 10 PM EST. Which is GMT -5 for folks outside the USA. Usually there's some players on early Sunday afternoon, around 2 PM I guess.

You can see more about us here:
http://www.fringespace.org/index.php

As to Tach itself, there's a few things youo should be aware of.

1. What you've got appears to be the downloadable version, which Novalogic started licensing out back a couple years go with GameTap. That version has had well documented problems such as graphics and audio issues. Most of these we've been able to overcome by coping over the files from a retail disc install.

2. Tachyon will run on Vista, as well as Linux and just about every other kind of Windows.

3. If you've got issues with the game, plese see my fix-it guide here: http://www.fringespace.org/index.php...iewtopic&t=142

More to come...

[Rumtruffle]

maybe you will know if there is a way to increase the maximum resolution of tachyon from 1024x768 (small by todays standards) to something supporting 1900x1200 and/or widescreen displays.

widescreengaming is normally the place for that sort of thing, but they dont have anything on it. maybe a dedicated fan such as yourself knows of anything short of just putting up with chunky and stretched graphics?


ps. what graphics and audio problems does this version have? a link to something concrete would be nice.

[Bet]

Alright I've looked over the forum you linked (and searched it for keywords), and I think I'm close to giving up hope that it's possible to rebind the joystick axes in Tachyon. I swear I remember playing with the twist-rudder enabled on my Sidewinder Precision Pro in 2000 when playing Tachyon the first time. Turning it on now is an exercise in frustration though, since twisting and yawing the stick are set opposite of how I'm used to in flight sims and Freespace. Starlancer has the same problem, which is amusing because it came out the same year as Tachyon. Two great space battle games that support joysticks, but have apparently hardcoded joystick axes set in a maddening way when you're used to normal flight-sim joystick controls.

Is there a way to exchange the stick left/right and rudder-twist axes, either through a .cfg file, or in the game itself? I have a Saitek X52 now, which I think supports changing the axes on the hardware-level, but that seems like overkill. Plus I'd still prefer to use my Sidewinder joystick, which doesn't support hardware axes rebinding, unfortunately.

I know that Freespace lets you bind the joystick axes like in a flight sim (so twist rudder is actually like using a rudder), so I look forward to playing your conversion to the FS2 engine, but for nostalgia's sake I'd like to run through the game in its own old engine almost a decade after playing it the first time.


Thanks for posting, by the way. Was hoping someone would start a thread about the technical side of this game.

[JGZinv]

Originally Posted by Rumtruffle

maybe you will know if there is a way to increase the maximum resolution of tachyon from 1024x768 (small by todays standards) to something supporting 1900x1200 and/or widescreen displays.

widescreengaming is normally the place for that sort of thing, but they dont have anything on it. maybe a dedicated fan such as yourself knows of anything short of just putting up with chunky and stretched graphics?


ps. what graphics and audio problems does this version have? a link to something concrete would be nice.

Rumtruffle - At one point in time I have heard about someone changing the resolution set in the files. I just checked everything in the files that are available in the top level folder. Bottom line is that there is one file in which it has the resolution listed and one other setting.

Now changing that file is the same as using the Tachyon.exe launcher, which modifies that file. I've seen it but I don't remember which it is. I'd need some time to sit and run a process trace on what the exe is doing.

That said however... modifying that file to odd resolutions I remember doesn't really do you any good. The game was really made for the 640x480 era, not even 1024x768. People that have intel graphics which does a fullscreen stretch, have always complained it looks like crud.

Most of the textures are quite compressed and small. When looked at though outside the game, you'd find they are exceptional. The game itself is incomplete and was rushed out the door by Novalogic. The devs were not given the time or funding they needed to finish. The handful that stayed with NL after that, tried what they could to release a couple patches to fix the worst of the bugs... and that was it.

There's a long history I could go on about. The FringeSpace project is partially about upgrading the graphics and resolution.
What Freespace 2 SCP can do, we can do. I think 1024x768 is the minimum actually nowadays for scp.

As to the downloadable issues, I can link you to here:
http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/265/

A lot of what I heard or was faced with was audio issues in the form of missing or corrupted audio. The graphics also had some issues with rendering. I can't really explain those as well as it was on another person's machine and English was not spoken very clearly. We ended up fixing it on several cases by swapping the audio archives. As to the video, that might have been directX... it's been a couple years since the GameTap incident.

Originally Posted by Bet

Alright I've looked over the forum you linked (and searched it for keywords), and I think I'm close to giving up hope that it's possible to rebind the joystick axes in Tachyon. I swear I remember playing with the twist-rudder enabled on my Sidewinder Precision Pro in 2000 when playing Tachyon the first time. Turning it on now is an exercise in frustration though, since twisting and yawing the stick are set opposite of how I'm used to in flight sims and Freespace. Starlancer has the same problem, which is amusing because it came out the same year as Tachyon. Two great space battle games that support joysticks, but have apparently hardcoded joystick axes set in a maddening way when you're used to normal flight-sim joystick controls.

Is there a way to exchange the stick left/right and rudder-twist axes, either through a .cfg file, or in the game itself? I have a Saitek X52 now, which I think supports changing the axes on the hardware-level, but that seems like overkill. Plus I'd still prefer to use my Sidewinder joystick, which doesn't support hardware axes rebinding, unfortunately.

I know that Freespace lets you bind the joystick axes like in a flight sim (so twist rudder is actually like using a rudder), so I look forward to playing your conversion to the FS2 engine, but for nostalgia's sake I'd like to run through the game in its own old engine almost a decade after playing it the first time.

Thanks for posting, by the way. Was hoping someone would start a thread about the technical side of this game.

Well what I would do is look at the flight simulator community. They usually have tools for binding keys on the windows side, so that it doesn't matter what the game thinks. One such tool I know of is PPjoy - http://www.♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥/deonvdw/Docs/PPJoyMain.htm

Not sure if that will work for your old Sidewinder. I know there's a great deal of documented stuff on the internet about problems with the Sidewinder series. Main reason I know this is I have an old gameport serial Sidewinder FF Pro. Awesome old stick which I first played Tachyon with back in 2000... but unfortunately you can't even use a USB converter due to the pin and hardware setup on the stick side.

I also have a X52 standard. Not sure if it's just my stick since my mod partner uses his and it works fine... but I can't get some of my buttons to bind to anything.

If you've not seen it, there is a options > keys/controls menu after you have made a pilot for multi or single player. In there all you need to do is press the button for bindings. As to inverting the stick - check your windows > game controllers wizard which should be in your control panel (XP and previous).

I'd start there and we can look into it further if all that's not fixed it.

[Bet]

Originally Posted by JGZinv

Well what I would do is look at the flight simulator community. They usually have tools for binding keys on the windows side, so that it doesn't matter what the game thinks. One such tool I know of is PPjoy.

Not sure if that will work for your old Sidewinder. I know there's a great deal of documented stuff on the internet about problems with the Sidewinder series. Main reason I know this is I have an old gameport serial Sidewinder FF Pro. Awesome old stick which I first played Tachyon with back in 2000... but unfortunately you can't even use a USB converter due to the pin and hardware setup on the stick side.

I also have a X52 standard. Not sure if it's just my stick since my mod partner uses his and it works fine... but I can't get some of my buttons to bind to anything.

If you've not seen it, there is a options > keys/controls menu after you have made a pilot for multi or single player. In there all you need to do is press the button for bindings. As to inverting the stick - check your windows > game controllers wizard which should be in your control panel (XP and previous).

I'd start there and we can look into it further if all that's not fixed it.

Thank you for pointing out PPjoy, I'd heard about it in the past and forgotten it existed. I did some followup research and realized I must have been using the Microsoft Sidewinder profile software in 2000, which unfortunately doesn't work on XP or Vista. The only thing I miss about that software was the ability to set up game-specific binds...which I also assume allowed rebinding axis assignments. Unless I'm remarkably dense, I can't even see a way to manually assign axis assignments using the Game Controllers control panel.

I remember being shocked at how easy it was to assign joystick axes the way I wanted in Freespace. It's a shame Starlancer and Tachyon, which both came out 2 years after the original Freespace, weren't so technically adept. When I replayed Starlancer a few years ago, I actually resorted to playing it on a gamepad. Not happy times.

If I remember right, the Saitek profile software will let me rebind the axis assignments, so I might just try going with that.

Turning the stick to the right has to make the ship roll right, or my brain goes crazy. Flight simulator control instinct is a pain.

[JGZinv]

Well like I said, my co-leader also uses a X52 and he's rather pleased with it. I don't have his profile for it either.

This is the Sidewinder ver. 4.0 software... not sure if it'd work either.
http://members.driverguide.com/drive...driverid=25613

The SideWinder software (version 3.02) included with these SideWinder game port devices is designed to work with Microsoft Windows 95 or Windows 98. If you have Windows 2000 or Windows XP, the operating system includes device drivers for these game controllers listed above, so the device will function properly on both Windows 2000 and Windows XP. However, the accompanying SideWinder software (version 3.02 or any previous version) will not function, so you will not be able to create profiles for these devices using the SideWinder software on Windows 2000 or Windows XP. Microsoft is not planning to update the SideWinder software (version 3.02) for game port devices.

BTW if anyone wants to see if there are people online, here's the lobby address. http://nw2.novaworld.net/ttflobby1.htm


Also might try this... see if it'll even recognize the Sidewinder.
http://www.pinnaclegameprofiler.com/features.html
Seems to have mixed reviews.

Evidently it does work for tachyon though
http://www.pinnaclegameprofiler.com/...hlight=tachyon

Hi, new player. I posted a thread about the joystick problem just now, but I hadn't read through this first. My apologies.

Does anyone know if the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro can have the axes rebound? Like JGZinv mentioned, the setup that's coded into the game conflicts directly with the way flight controls are hard-wired into my brain.

For now I'll try looking on the internet for some solutions. Perhaps I can even find the manual for it, since I've moved house about twice since we got it and it got lost in the process.

I am also considering getting an X52 FCS once I have the $$$. Anyone here have anything they'd like to recommend about it? I know the price has gone down a bit, and I might even be able to find one on eBay, but I'd like to at least find out if it would even work.

Thanks everyone!

~Zero

^^^ Actually never mind. I was able to find the solution on my own, but thanks anyways. As thanks I'll go ahead and post my solution.

As far as I know, this will work with any Logitech brand digital input joystick such as the Extreme 3d Pro:

1. Go to here and download the Logitech Gaming Profiler. It's a free download directly from the Logitech site. Make sure you choose your OS and bit config from the drop down menus before downloading.

2. Install the LGP. When it prompts you, make sure the device you wish to use is plugged in and connected to your PC. It will automatically detect the device. Select it from the menu, make sure it is calibrated correctly, and finish the installation.

3. Open the LGP and select the device you wish to use for Tachyon. Then click on "Choose Profile" and select "Make new Profile."

4. A prompt will appear. Enter a name of your choice for the profile. In the filename box, browse for the Tachyon .exe file. For Steam users it should be Computer\OS\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\common\tachyon the fringe\tachyon.exe (assuming you're running Vista 32-bit)

5. Once you've created a profile for Tachyon, open it. Select the X-axis from the controls menu, then select "Axis Properties".

6. At the bottom you should see the drop down menu "Axis Mapping". Select Twist/Z-axis from this menu.

7. Repeat steps 5 and 6 with the Twist/Z-axis, mapping it to the X-axis. This will effectively reverse the two axes, meaning that moving X will roll the craft while Z yaws it (as it was meant to be)

8. Go to the top menu, select Options then "Global Profiler Settings." Check the "Persistent Profile" Option and then select the Tachyon profile you just created and modified. Note that if you play another game with this joystick, you'll first have to deactivate this option or else the axes will remain switched. For some reason the LGP software won't automatically detect when Tachyon launches, possibly because it's launched through Steam, so this is a workaround for that.

9. Launch Tachyon (you can do so from the LGP software as long as you selected the correct exe file in step 4.) The start menu will appear, click play and it will disappear and then reappear. Click play again to start the game (once again, a glitch with Steam).


Sorry if that's a little long. It worked for me and it should work with most modern Logitech joysticks, so give it a try.

[JGZinv]

I wouldn't buy a X52 used... did that myself and have regretted it.
In fact, might try to sell it eventually as it gathers dust.

[Flying Ace]

I wish I could use My REATAIL key to activate the game on steam seeing as the overlay crashes the retail version

[JGZinv]

Well any retail copy will take any key. That's been well known for a long time.

Not sure what the deal is with Steam or other downloaded copies.

I'm guessing you tried to make Steam use the Tachyon game as an add-on, not bought through steam?

Here's a though, point it at space.exe (the actual game) not Tachyon.exe (cruddy launcher). See what goes.

[Bet]

Zer0Emperor, thanks for telling us about the Logitech game profile software axis reassignment feature, it led me to get a Logitech joystick just recently, and now I'm able to enjoy Starlancer as well as Tachyon with the flight controls that feel natural. Thanks a bunch!